Please help me to improve my relationship with my dd.

[BugInMySalad]

Don't know where to start really.

dd1 is 8. I also have a younger ds and dd2. I remember feeling so close to her as a baby, and enjoying all the new stages. I think I found things harder with her from about age 3. Can't go into all the details here but if I had to sum up the situation now I would say we just can't get along. I've spent a lot of time trying to work out why, and if and how we can improve things.

Her attitude is very negative. Nothing pleases her. She shouts at her brother and sister if they talk to her or try to play with her. At school she controls her temper but at home lets rip. When she tries to speak nicely she uses a strange fake voice, like it's not the real her we are seeing.

For my part, I think I've expected too much too young as she's very smart (I know everyone says that but she really is), and have got frustrated with her on many occasions and let her know. When she's ranting and raving about something I try to be the adult and give her a hug but she wriggles to get free.

I'm finding it hard to be positive. Do other people feel like this? What can I do to bring us closer? I have none of this with my other 2 dcs. I don't have a great relationship with my own mum and would hate the same to happen with dd.

Really would love some advice. Thanks.

(have no advice, but will lurk w interest)

I wonder if trying to give her a hug is sending the wrong message. It might make her think you are not taking her seriously and not listening to her rantings and ravings, just trying to hug them away or treat her like a baby. Just a thought.

If its any consolation my DDs are often yelling and shouting and cross with me, and I often despair and wonder where I'm going wrong. It's probably not unusual. I do feel like we're close though.

Do you ever get some time on your own, just you and DD1?

I try to schedule things for just her and me, and dh does things with her too. If we don't timetable things they don't happen. And she does respond more positively then, yes. She asks to play board games so we do that when we can. But we probably don't give her enough one to one time.

I try to listen to her woes but we seem to really annoy each other. I think she knows how much of an effort it is for me to spend a lot of time with her. It shouldn't be like that, she's my child.

well all hummm.. maybe she needs an outlet? like if she is very smart i think that can be a bit hard on kids, maybe she needs to join a group of some sort, artsy or a reading group or even dance. does she have many friends? maybe she should go to a kid theripst where she can really talk to someone. maybe even adding a vitamin, sounds crazy but i know but she could be lacking a mineral or vitamin (this makes a big difference in me!) or even checking to see if she has low blood sugar see how she responds after different foods that can really affect kids (and adults) sorry to go on and on. good luck!!

Thanks.

I have been round in circles over the years trying to work all this out. I think it's our personalities combined with a bit of a negative viscious circle of us annoying each other and almost avoiding each other at times. I find that very sad.

Regarding friends, no big problems anymore. Her first couple of years at school were fraught with fallings out and confrontations with both teachers and children, but she has learned how to "play the game" and controls herself at school, mostly. She also does a few activities - judo, Brownies - she likes structure and being busy. It's almost easier to fill her time so we don't have awkward scenes at home, but I would love for us to be able to just hang out and chat sometimes.

However, just posting all this has clarified it in my head and tonight I made the effort to go and sit with her in her room before bed. Initially she seemed uncomfortable like she wanted me to leave and was talking in the silly voice which is not really her talking iyswim. I just stayed there and didn't say much and eventually she started talking a bit more naturally and I told her about a friend of mine who had a baby today and it was all normal and fairly ok. Maybe I just need to keep doing this and it will get better with practice.

Goodness, babies were so much easier than all this.

I don't have any experience of this as my eldest is 3. But I have recently read How to talk so kids will listen and listen so kids will talk. Some of the ideas in there my be helpful in letting your daughter open up to you

That's really lovely you had a good bedtime conversation together.

Do you think her difficult behaviour is possibly some form of attention seeking?

I don't mean to say that in a critical way and imply you need to ignore it. But sometimes if children feel unlistened to/unacknowledged, they get angry and that comes out in all the wrong ways.

Are there any issues about sibling rivalry? How did she respond when they were born?

Also, in families you do get personality clashes between parents and children. Not necessarily a disaster, but it needs some thought as to how to rub along well together - realise what pushes each others buttons in a negative way and avoid those things.

Sounds like you have made some progress anyway.

All the best.

ramblingmum I do have that book. Will look at it again.

blueywhite there are definitely attention issues. As a baby and toddler she was unbelievably demanding, couldn't occupy herself for 2 minutes. I expect ds coming along when she was 2 had a big effect. She always needed lots of stimulation. I used to see other kids playing with the same toy for ages and wonder why my child couldn't seem to do that. Things have gradually improved (for me) on that front with going to playgroup then school, and things like her being able to read alone or watch a film. I think she does want more attention from me, as I notice that when we're with other adults she has a tendency to "corner" one of them and tell them every boring detail about something, almost knowing they won't be able to stop her without appearing rude! But we are a family of 5 and I do what I can. 3 of them are trying to get my attention and I'm only one person. Maybe she would have been happier as an only child....

It's difficult carving up time to meet everyone's needs in a family - not least your own need for some "me" time!

It sounds as though the positive results from the scheduled time she has had with you and dh, and the moments you had together at bedtime, are the way forward.

And as she matures, she'll find other outlets (more challenging/stimulating activities with a wider variety fo people, deeper friendships, mentors at school, etc) who will have time to give her some more attention (if she has a personality needing higher than average levels of attention).

I think we often go through phases with our children when their point of development doesn't fit easily into the wider family, and it all looks like it's going pear-shaped. Then six months later, they've moved on, we've moved on, a particular situation or health issue has moved on, and suddenly the relationships are better. (And then something else comes along! )

When she's struggling she just needs your unconditional love and acceptance. And I think we all like to feel we're understood by those around us even if they can't wave a magic wand and make us feel happy.

She will mature and move on from this, I'm sure. She'll also learn to see that your time and attention is reasonably shared with her siblings. Hard when you're eight not to be resentful maybe?

On a practical level - does she get enough sleep?!!!

let her stay up later - have a special night in the wek where you stay up and have pizza and watch crap tv

Thanks for wise words, you are right of course.

Custardo that is a good idea. She likes Strictly but they've all been up watching it the last few times. I'll try to put the other 2 to bed beforehand, although there will be protests.

Yes she gets enough sleep I think. 8pm-7am approx. Later at weekends but I think that's ok?

i find with protests that if i said " the quicker you are asleep the quicker dd will come up to bed" made them go to sleep quicker

i used to let ds1 stay up later on a fri night when the twins were born and dh was working nights. it used to be our night.

also i had to activley try to like DDs company - so know exactly where you are coming from - although dd was under 5 at the time and always sulked, cried and was generally miserable.

it mightn't exactly be guru of the year advice - but i do like to get each of them on their own now and again and make them feel extra special, have deep and meaningful conversations - secret sweets just betwen us ( they are now teens) siblings love this one upmanship - but as long as you are fair about doing it - i think its fine - although a rota would be too much me thinks - i think half the fun of some special time with each kid ( even it be only 10 min secret walk to shops for biscuits) is thatits better spntaneously.

also i think that giving the older one some responsability - this might just be an 'industrious' boy thing - i dunno - but my eldest boy used to love HELPING me with shopping " can you get me the xxx i can't reach" or " run round and find the spaghetti for me please darling" kind of thing keeps them busy and makes them feel wanted.

my kids have their favourite foods too - it makes them feel special

for example dd loves rosy deep red apples, so she ALWAYS ( aged 16 even now) races to look for the reddest apples! we used to pick a fruit we hadn't tried - like dragon fruit or something exotic and try a diferent one every month - it was the thing that she and i did. I thing you and her need a thing so you can identify

anyway i've gone on a bit

or a tv prog ( sorry to go on) you mentioned strictly - that might be a family one - maybe there is a 'girly' one that you and her can watch.

dd and i used to watch veronica mars when it was on and we even had a silly dance to the title song on the opening credits - she was about 13 at the time. So if you could force yourself to watch something meant for a younger audience- that might be fun

No you haven't gone on at all, you're absolutely right. My main feeling reading your post was that all the things you suggest are things dh does with with dd already. Maybe you and he have similarly creative personalities.

dh is great with her - he humours her out of strops, doesn't let her wind him up, spent hours teaching her how to snorkel on holiday - they have a great relationship. I don't know, me and dd just seem to take each other so personally. Maybe we are too similar, I don't know.

We would love for her to take more responsibility and try this in small ways all the time. Not brilliant success so far with this - the younger 2 dcs seem to have way more common sense, although dd1 outshines them in the purely academic side of school. She is very inflexible and "in the box", but has a memory like a computer. We asked her recently if she would like to walk to the (very close) shop to get something. She wanted to, but when she got there they didn't have what we needed and she completely panicked, stayed where she was until dh went to find her and brought her home all upset. We haven't managed to persuade her to try it again.

oh and tv....she likes Weakest Link (????) Probably memorising all the answers.

BugInMySalad, you've just described my eldest DD, now 10 - almost exactly the same patterns of behaviour. After years - literally - of thinking and figuring out why she's like she is (my other DD very different), I ended up talking to a child development expert (Not with DD, just a private series of conversations between me and the expert)who got me to talk about her birth. It was crap, I won't go into the entire story, but basically for various reasons I didn't hold her immediately after the birth and struggled with bonding for a few days. She missed out on very early contact which having now read up on the subject extensively, I now understand is crucial in forming later patterns of behaviour and relationships. Things I have learnt have made a huge difference. I also enjoyed her as a baby and toddler, but realise I had completely blanked out the birth episode. This of course might not apply to you, but if any of it sparks a light, take a look at Why Love Matters by Sue Gerhardt - fabulously enlightening book.

Our DD also very similar (much improved over last year, but she is nearly 10 now). And same as offbeatmum, DD was prem and in an incubator straight away, and I didn't even see her until spinal block anaesthetic had worn off 9 hrs later. So lack of bonding time. She is also very bright, and my expectations of her on an emotional level were too high (this becomes more obvious as DS grows up and I realise how unreasonable I was with DD). It has helped that I am now very careful how I treat her. I don't mean that I'm walking on eggshells or anything false, but I'm more aware of treating her lovingly (was hard to start with), and it has made a difference. Also, when she is ranting about something, I won't listen - I make her take a deep breath and explain things to me so I can understand what she is trying to say. I hope that comes across to her that I want to listen, but can't when she is screeching, rather than me not wanting to listen at all.

But I'm convinced that there are some people who, because of their inbuilt personality, are simply happier when grown up, and until they are, things can be difficult.

Sounds exactly like my dd, aged nearly 10. Reading with interest and sadness.

Just wanted to add, I am not a mum (yet, only 20 weks to go) but me and my mum were constantly at loggerheads when we lived together, she was very strict and I knew all the right buttons to press, I was a daddy's girl (1 of 4 girls) and we were just too alike to get on.

But now I am grown up and live away from home we have the most fantastic relationship and I love my Mum to pieces, not best mates or anything but we treat each other like equals and it is fab!

So it may just be that you are alike, try your very best to see things from her point of view and don't expect too much of her or yourself.

And there is hope, when she is all grown up you may find you come full circle and you are close to her all over again!
Good luck