Just a question about how much feed my 4 month old should be having?

[shellmc]

Hi my ds has been having a little bit of rice or rusk the past few weeks along with his bottles.
He is a hungrey baby and have gradually been giving him little bits of dinners and puddings from the jars as he was just hungrey all the time and polishing his bottles off he is having 8oz bottles now.
Im just wondering if anyone could help me as to how much food and bottles he should be having at this age, im a first time mummy and dont want to overfeed him as mush as i dont want to underfeed him 2.

Thankyou any help would be grateful x

Any food is overfeeding him, 4 months is far too young for any food.

Just milk - and as much of it as he wants.
Too young for food.

Thanx, have spoke to the health visitor who advised me to try him with rice or sloppy rusk when he was 12 weeks old he was on stage 2 of his milk at 5 weeks. He is a very healthy baby and doing very well i feel i am doing a great job with him.
At my last appt with ds i spoke to healthvisitor and said that he was having the rice or rusk twice aday and he has been fine with that, she said that when he is 4 months to try him with the cow and gate jars, he has 5-6 spoonfulls from the jars along with his rice in the morning and at night.
He isnt taking as much milk now and is settling great.

The jars do state 4 months+ x

Your H V doesn't know what they are talking about. 12 weeks is far too early to feed rice or rusks.

There seem to be a lot of these early weaning posts about. Is it odd trolling or is it subliminal advertising for Cow and Gate?

Pooexplosions and biscuit stuffer - as much as everyone is entitled to their own opinion, if I had just posted with a 4 month old baby asking for help, I would have been completely demoralised and be made to feel like a really bad mother from your replies. I suspect she came on MN for some support and an answer to her question!?

Shellmc - lots of babies are weaned at 4 months so don't worry (and I have read the current research from my sons gastro-paed that suggests that weaning late in fact causes more problems!! Perhaps another debate for another time!!??).

If you want a guide to follow, Gina Ford's Guide to Weaning gives a step by step approach to weaning with quantities and timings. It is really practical and has lots of really helpful tips. She acknowledges that some babies need weaning at 4 months and gives advice from this age onwards.

I hope it goes well and good luck

Ohhhh sorry!!
Im confused as he has taken to it soo well he wasnt eating full rusks or a dish full of rice, he has 4-5 spoonfulls of rice or a quater of rusk mixed with his milk.
Many people i work with have said they also introduced rice and sloppy rusk to thier dc at this stage, i think il speak with HV again and see what she can do to help me.
Thanks anyhow

Ohhh sambo2 thankyou sooo much, thats made me feel a bit better.
He is doing well and has been a hungrey baby all along LOL, he has gained weight right from birth and the HV is very happy with his progress and has no worrys to concern her.
I feel i am being a great mum and love my ds to bits i was just wondering if anyone could shed a light on as to what he should be having and what are the right steps to take, thank you soo much. I will take a look at the Gina Ford Guide. xx :-)

Shell - I'm sure you are a great mum and nobody is trying to say any different

But you have been given very poor advice by your HV. The best thing for your baby is to have nothing but milk until around 6 months. Some babies may be ready for solids earlier but there is no way of knowing, and NO baby is ready for solids at 12 weeks. Their digestive system simply isn't mature enough, and your HV should know this.

I'm sorry but you won't find many posters on MN who feel able to advise on what solids a baby should have at this age. The fact is that milk alone is the optimum diet for your baby.

Sambo2, Gina Ford knows about as much as the HV, ie not a lot. If you want to give some more bad advice to add to that already dished out, you go ahead. Some of us will actually use some facts and a bit of sense and try for better.

I am sick to death of being told that its up to yourself and ignore the guidelines and whatever. Why is this one of the few topics where that nonsense is bandied about? If I advise posters to put brandy in their babys bottle to help me sleep would you back me up as its up to the individual? After all, doctors used to advise it too....
No, obviously not, as we know better now. Like we know that giving rusks at 12 weeks is a bad idea, bordering on dangerous.

OP if you don't want sensible advice try posting somewhere else. Netmums is good for patting you on the back without actually talking any sense.

Sorry for my very short reply. It's based on the information given by the World Health Organisation (WHO) that every single baby (except in exceptional circumstances) is able for solid food at 6 months (ie their gut has devloped enough).

Although some babies may be ready earlier, it is impossible to know which ones without very invasive medical techniques carried out on the actual baby.

Therefore, to be safe it is advised that you wait until your baby is 6 months before offering them solid food.

For what it's worth, DS was born at 4.4kg (9lb 4oz) and was fine on milk until he got the hang of feeding himself decent amounts by 7 months. I know that some babies are even older than this (those that go down the self-feeding route rather than jars etc).

And you sound like a great mum

Just because the WHO and the government promote weaning after 6 months does not mean it is correct...there are plenty of examples where they have not been correct...

And mother's DO need to to make decisions themselves. They need to weigh up the pros and cons and make an informed decision. Just because you decide to do one thing and I decide to do another does not make either of us right or wrong. We ALL have the best interests of our children at heart.

Oh yes, absolutely sambo2. It isn't right or wrong to do anything - nothing has any value judgment anymore. Mother knows best, all the time. If you feel it's best, obviously it is. Why not give your child steak, OP? Please furnish us with detailed examples of the WHO being wrong about infant nutrition, sambo2.

Four month old babies need milk, nothing else. If they are hungry, they need more milk. That's all.

What a pleasant reply Georgimama?!?!?

My son had silent reflux and I saw a gasto-paed and a paediatric dietician to get advise about weaning my very large (9lb 11oz at birth) son. Their research (currently published, which I read) suggests that there is more damage being done by weaning post 6 months as the mother's immunity has all but gone, at the point where food is introduced. Furthermore, there are large numbers of babies with iron deficiency, due to the lack of protein in their diets. Yes, formula and breast milk has protien but not complete amino acids that can only be found from animal sources. Of course you are not going to feed a 4 mo steak (a ridiculous and unhelpful thing to say) - but neither can a 6 mo, who has only ever had milk eat protein straight away. They need to build up to it.

Government guidelines used to say wean at 4 months...it then changed to 6 months. There is no reason why the guidelines won't change again?

The WHO publishes guidelines for the world, where there is no doubt that breastfeeding exclusively to 6 months is going to be of benefit to many babies in many deprived places in the world.

My judgements are based on what I have read and discussed and then i have made MY OWN decision. I am my child's mother and I will decide what I think is best - I don't get why this is such a big deal??

As for misleading guidelines, there was a time when mothers were given thalidamide, the MMR is still contraversial (not because of autism but because of bowel disorders)...will you give your child the swine flu jab??? Lots of things to consider and I am sure you will discuss the issues with friends, family, GPs, HV, MNetters and then you will make a decision that you feel is right for your child based on the information you have gathered?

Yeah ok, just because everyone who knows anything about it says the same thing, you know better because you are the mother. Good one. Do you always know better than a thousand experts on anything.

You are clever aren't you? You're talking rubbish. But whatever, no skin off my nose if you want to promote such shite.....

I know the 4 momths / 6 momth debate will rage for ever but I thought it was pretty unanimous that babies under 17 weeks should never be given solid food.

Shellmc - this is the information provided by the Department of Health, and gives guidance on when to wean.

Your HV should be following these guidelines - it's what she is paid to do.

Sorry if that seems blunt but there is no way that feeding solids to, in your own words, 'a very healthy baby' before 17 weeks is ever right, or necessary.

MONTH

I weaned my baby at 6 months and my friend weaned her baby at 4 months...now my friend had awful problems baby spitting out the food being sicky her baby didnt seem to understand what to do ..now i fed my daughter at 6 months where she could sit up much better than a 4 month year old ,and she seemed to automatically chew iykwim my daughter was more aware what was happening etc ....looking at our experiences i deffo wait till the baby was a little bit older............

Food is important before 6 months due to immunity from the mother disappearing? New one to me.

6 moth old babies can eat protein straight away, thats the point in waiting until a baby is developmentally ready for solids. They are physically capable of eating pretty much anything, including steak if you choose to give it to them.

Please, do link to this research you say you have read.

"Government guidelines used to say wean at 4 months...it then changed to 6 months. There is no reason why the guidelines won't change again?"

This one really pisses me off. They were 4 months for many years, then 6 months for the last 6-8 years. No chopping and changing, no going backwards....getting longer not shorter. very crappy justification for a stupid argument. As for thalidomide and mmr, find a rational argument will you, because thats just odd.

Journal of Pediatric Gastroenterology and Nutrition 46:99-110. Complimentary Feeding: A Commentary by the ESPHGAN Committee on Infant Nutrition.

The abstract states that milk is a desirable goal for 6 months and that complimentary feeding should not be introduced before 17 weeks. However, some babies can not wait till 6 months (hence the raging debate) and this paper states, "There is no convincing scientific evidence that avoidance or delayed introduction of potentially allergenic foods, such as eggs or fish reduces allergies" and goes on to say that, "During the complimentary weaning period, >90% of the iron requirements of a breast fed infant must be met by complimentary foods, which should provide sufficient bioavailable iron".

As for the immunity thing, "It is prudent to avoid both early (before 17 weeks) and late (after 7 months) introduction of gluten, and to introduce gluten gradually whilst the infant is being breast fed in as much that it may reduce the risk of celiacs disease, type 1 diabetes and wheat allergy".

I didnt mean for this to turn into a big arguement, we are all entitled to our own opinions and i am very gratful to all of you who have taken the time to read my post and offer your opinion and advise.
Just want to say thankyou for that, im now thinking im doing this all wrong altho my baby is taking soo well, im not offering him alsorts of different foods i understand that he is way to young! He has baby rice 4-5 spoonfulls and sometimes a half a rusk mixed with his milk. He has tried the jars of veg cassorole again only 4-5 spoonfuls and that is it along with the milk he is having 7oz bottles and now sometimes he will finish a 8oz bottle off, soo i know i can still up him to 9oz bottles if he needs it.
2 Of my close friends have weaned their babys at 4 months and they are absolutly fine and they felt that it was the right thing to do for their baby.
As everyone has mentioned you gather information and make your own decision im not asking what solid food should i feed my baby??!! Im just wondering how much feed does your 4 month or did your 4 month old have at this stage??.
I will be keeping an eye out if there are any mums whos baby was weaned at 4 months and over and how they took to it.
Thankyou again for the comments

Then in answer to your question - my 4 month olds were on just milk but I noticed that sometimes they would go through phases of a week or so where they would suddenly take alot more. I'm not sure of the exact quantities as they happened to be breastfed, but I could tell by how they were feeding and for how long as to when they were taking more.

That's no help at all is it?

OK, well the answer to your question, "how much food did your 4 month old baby have" is loads. Loads and loads of breastfeeds (which is food, btw) on demand. You're clearly not interested in any of research that shows why what you are doing is a bad idea, so go for it.

My baby is 4 months and I'm also feeding her by advice of my health visitors. She is a hungry baby and has bottlefeeds every 2 hours of 6oz's which can be very time consuming. She sleeps 12 hours at night but crams so much milk in the day. I have her on hungrier baby milk but to be honest makes no difference. She will not take more than 4-6oz's at any one time. I don't mind the feeding every 2 hrs as she sleeps all night, but she is still only just 12lbs at 18 weeks and on the 9th pecentile line even though she is taking 25-30 oz's per day.

I have started giving her gluten free baby porridge in a morning after her bottle, 2 tablespoons mixed with 6 tablespoons of cooled boiled water. I sometimes offer half a petit flous late afternoon if she is particularly hungry. I'm not weaning her off milk, just supplmenting her calorie intake by offering it after she has had her bottle feed.

I have been trying to leave weaning till as late as possible and mu hv said she wouldnt normally advise weaning before 6 months, but in some cases the benefits outweight the disadvantages, do whatever you feel is best for your child.