To sterilise or not to sterilise.....

[emmx]

Hi - I'm a first time mum to a gorgeous 3 1/2 month old boy and I have a question - is it actually absolutely necessary to sterilise bottles before every use? I've been researching on the net and most info that comes up comes from the US - nearly all of it says that apart from before the very first use (out of the packet) you do not need to do more than either put them in the dishwasher or wash with hot soapy water. We use a cold water (Milton) steriliser but as I am at home looking after our son 24/7 as my OH is at work all day I am finding it a real struggle sometimes to keep on top of making sure I always have at least one sterile bottle ready - when they want feeding they want feeding NOW! We use Dr Browns anti colic bottles which are very expensive (around £12 for a pack of 2) but are very effective so, being very short of money, we only have 3 240ml bottles (we also had 3 120ml bottles but he's outgrown them) and hence its hard work keeping on top of it particularly if we go out for the day. Is there anyone out there who DOESN'T sterilise before every use? Also when do most people stop sterilising? Is 4 months too young? Or do you think it would make me a bad mother? We use boiled water in compliance with what it says on the tin (we use Aptamil). Another obstacle would be my husband and my mum who are both convinced that if everything is not sterilised all the time our LO will die. However he is obsessed with his hands and feet right now as well as anything else he can put in his mouth and apart from trying my best to keep them clean as poss he's going to be putting germs in his mouth that way too. I don't want to put his health at risk by exposing him unnecessarily to germs but I also don't want him to have an unchallenged immune system - I believe it is not good to never have exposure to any germs (over and above the usual washing of hands after going to the loo, preparing food, etc). Anyway, it was just something I was wondering about and am currently still sterilising everything. Thanks

p.p.s I also wanted to add that I am also very careful to make sure there is never any milk/powder left as residue anywhere on the bottles/teats after I've washed them - the same with when washing cutlery/crockery, if theres still any food or whatever stuck to anything it gets washed again. Sorry for ranting, etc its just really got under my skin and made me feel I kep having to justify my reasons. Sorry!

at HVs having feeding as their "area of speciality".

Yes, it was all great spot on advice I got from the ones I saw, I can tell you!!

That I would never breastfeed my large dd1. That her weight gain wasn't acceptable. That she needed "more calories" than my breastmilk and that I should wean her at 10 weeks!

That I could and MUST never take antidepressants while breastfeeding. Or painkillers. Or a single glass of wine, ever.

Oh, and that I should sterilise.

Forgive me if I ignored that last bit of info (I washed my breastpump and any bottles we needed in the dishwasher).

My motive was that I didn't trust a bloody thing she said and found out for myself - on MN mainly - how to look after my daughter.

emmx a troll is someone who deliberately tries to provoke people into a fight/lively discussion by posting something likely to cause offence which may or may not be the poster's actual view point. Hence "trolling" (to troll) the act of being a troll.

Sorry I have no idea about steralising. It is the one thing all of my RL mum friends admit to finding completely baffling. I did think if something had been in the dishwasher it was as sterile as something that has been in the "steraliser". But then my DS will put pretty much anything in his mouth... so I do wonder what's the point of steralising everything, which we do, and he's still had two tummy bugs.

I have to agree with you re. the HV. Mine is absolutely useless - she's retiring soon thank God. Being a new mum I believed everything she said re. feeding. My boy has suffered from constipation and tummy pain since we had to put him on formula at a week old because my milk didn't come in properly and he never learnt to latch on properly. The HV said that he had these problems because I had one cup of coffe a day and was drinking orange juice and eating things like garlic, and if he had pain I had no-one to blame but myself so shouldn't complain to her as she'd told me to avoid these things before he was born. I then cut out all these things from my diet - it made no difference to him whatsoever. She certainly had nothing to say when I told her he was still constipated and still in pain because of the constipation. She's in her late 50' or something and I just think she stuck in adifferent era. The younger HV who came a couple of times was much more understanding and less aggressive (when we were having problems feeding him in that first week the older one used words like "starving" and "skin and bones" because he went from 7lb 10oz to 6lb 13oz - it really made me feel like it was all my fault despite the fact I spent literally hours at a time trying to feed him myself). Its true what they say - you really do just have to find your own way in the dark - all the advice I was given my different MW and HV conflicted depending on who was giving it

That was some really bad advice you got, emmx.

I'm a stroppy mare and so didn't listen to a word she said (I had fabulous support from dh on the feeding!) and over 3 babies have clocked up almost 5 years of bf! Partly cos the HV told me I couldn't - it was like a red rag to a bull!

At least you knwo where to come for help next time!!

My ds was only 2lb odd when born. In hospital I was sterilising before I expressed but sometimes left it an hour or two or three between sterlising and expressing. That isn't particulary sterile but never did him any harm. In fact he's been healthy as. Ds' godmum has a phd in virology and told me it's the best thing for him not to be sooo sterile with him.

kentmumtj - Can't be bothered cos they'd rather have a fag???

I think we all know the difference between a mouldy bottle and a clean one and how to clean it.

some of the parents i work with yes they prioritse their needs above that of their childs and consider such care tasks as mundane boring etc etc and would much rather do other things, and yes i have seen parents feeding babies with awfully dirty and mouldy bottles and have had to tell them to stop

like ive alrady said i do work with very vulnerable families and children who are already involved in proceedings, if there were no CP concerns i wouldnt be working with them

Kentmumj, as you will know, MN has a different demographics than the parents you work with so saying that you would question a parents reasons for not sterilising is not something you ought to have said on MN. People are here precisely because they are generally looking for good information on parenting.

The sterilising thing is a red herring. All the sterilising in the world won't protect any baby if they bottle is not clean - as you have suggested in one of your posts. So, these parents who you work with, no amount of sterilising in the world will protect their babies if they are not sterilising a clean bottle.

From the post in RTKanga's link explains as soon as a bottle leaves a sterilizer it is contaminated simply by the air.

Milk powder is not sterile so the focus should rightly be on v good bottle washing and safe milk preparation. The guidance for preparing formula safely changed 2 or 3 years ago and the vast majority of parents are not following it because they don't know that it has. NOt all the formula manufacturers have updated their prep instructions on the labels. Most HV's and MWs are not passing the information over to mothers. I wonder who will be at fault when these babies become ill? Imo, if the parents are not informed then it isn't their fault.

i stopped doing mine at 1 year old

'i work with parents and many of them have small babies i know my work place would recommend sterlising to continue until the child was one years old and not stop earlier

i do work in a child protection enviroment and if one of our parents stopped sterlising at that age we would question their motives behind it and consider it not to be in the childs best interests.'

as i said in my first post i was not questioning anyone on MN as to why they would not sterlise but clearly said 'if one of our parents stopped sterlising'

theres a big difference

and yes i do agree that it can not be a parents fault if they are not informed

No, kentmumtj you think you weren't referring to anyone at MN, but the way you wrote that? Even saying 'one of our parents'? Did not then make me, or apparently anyone else who read it, think 'oh she isn't referring to us.'

foxytocin what are the new guidelines? Just wondering if I am following them!!

Kentmumtj, I think the reaction you got is because of the way you wrote what you wrote. You didn't explain (as you did later on) what you were referring to, what population you were talking about etc. Also, I think- as foxytocin said, what you're talking about is clean bottles, not sterile ones. I'm sure the parents you work with would be find if the bottles they were using were clean, and in my opinion that's what to focus on, not sterilizing.

That said, I did sterilize until 6 months, but I'm more & more realizing that it may have been useless. Next baby (if I have one)? Clean soapy water, or dishwasher. And maybe sterilizing for 1-2 months (since I already have the sterilizer somewhere in a cupboard).

So if one of your parents stops sterilising you would question why. Fair enough. The fact still remains that sterilising is unnecessary, despite what the DOH is saying and what 98% of people think they ought to do for a small baby. Parents with chaotic and lifestyles and vulnerable backgrounds would surely breathe a sigh of relief to be told to chuck the steriliser and make sure their bottles are scrupulously clean instead. In fact, they deserve to have one less thing to worry about. It can only be helpful for their babies if there is one less stick to beat them with.

Clean hands, clean bottles and safe formula preparation will protect babies. Not bunging bottles in a steriliser so that they can become contaminated by the air the second they touch it.

here is the leaflet which all health professionals coming into contact with mothers of new babies are supposed to be following.

kentmumj: i know it is your job to follow all the current guidelines including the sterilising one. i appreciate how hard your work is. so the sterilising thing is unfair to you too. Far more awareness ought to be drawn to all parents to the fact that powdered formula is not sterile and in the UK is more likely to be the source of most GI infection of babies than lack of sterilising is.

kentmumj, I am glad you came back and explained yourself a little further. I think the antagonism you have met, as others have explained, is for not responding to your audience. The OP is very clear. She has researched, she is interested in whether sterilising is in fact necessary for x number of months, if at all. Yours is the first reply and does not respond to the question about necessity but makes generalised statements about good parenting with the added weight of 'I do work in child protection'. You must know how that sounds. It's white coat syndrome. We are more likely to believe somebody who claims to be or looks like a professional. Like your assertion to ask the 'expert' HVs. How many have listened to dud info from an HCP and found it to be just that after the fact? Look at it this way. If a child came on and asked if their boy was likely to be hurting himself by stretching his foreskin in the bath (so many boys do this, so many threads), a response of 'I work in child protection, I would question why a child was playing with its genitals in the first place' would achieve the same effect. Yes, you again would be correct to do this in the area you work in, it's a 'warning sign' just like many others but in this case is not relevant and is inflammatory. You do a tough job, and hurrah for you looking out for these this but the OP feels got at and though that was not your intention, you must surely see why.

Oh good, foxytocin. Those are the guidelines I follow!!

By the way, I'm sure some HVs are excellent & really informed in issues of child safety, nutrition, weight gain etc. But- judging from my own experience & that of my friends, and also judging from what I read here on MN- lots & lots of HVs are really not that informed & give some overgeneral advice without looking at the specifics of each case. This is sad but unfortunately it seems to be true in many cases (but I'm sure, not in all). So I'm not sure 'what the HVs say' would be my first port of call when I was trying to reach a feeding / sterilising decision for my baby. I would (unfortunately) feel I have to do my own research.g

kentmum ,your drip feeding information i think led to the amount of antagonism to your post . You clearly work in another world ,as far as most of the people on mumsnet are concerned , obviousley if peoples homes are basically unhygenic ,and i thnk we can all imagine where you are coming from, then strict guidelines re sterilisation are probably a good thing .Back in a more 'normal' setting ,most people would know to use clean bottles on a clean worksurface ,with clean hands ,therefore massively reducing the risk of infection.

Perhaps a stupid question but I have been using cool boiled water in a bottle (I often do all the feeds for the day in the morning) and then adding forumla powder (DS2 does not mind room temp milk). I now see the guidance says you should have water cooled to 70 degrees, add the powder and then cool under the tap.

In reality, on a busy day with other children do people always follow that guidance?

ibangthedrums, bumping for you. I have never used formula but I believe it's that's bit of advice that's quite important in terms of destroying bacteria in the formula. Don't quote me though...

ibangthedrums, I don't always follow those guidelines. I do boil and cool for 30 minutes, but I do not reboil always for the next feed. It is completely counter to Feed on Demand as when a baby is hungry? Its hungry now not 30 minutes from now. If I am sure he will be hungry at a certain time, i.e. if he hasn't eaten in several hours, I will boil a new kettle, but if he suddenly gets hungry before then? I use the boil cooled water I have on hand.

He has never had a tummy problem in his 3 months. Doesn't even get colic or reflux!

ibangthedrums, I just add mineral water(very hard water where I live) to the formula, never warm it beforehand and on the formula can there's no instructions to use warm water, unless your baby prefers it that way. I only use a bit of formula once a day for her cereal, though.
I think, even though there probably are some bacteria in powder, the most important thing is not to leave made-up bottle for too long in room temperature as that might cause the germs to multiply.
I think if you're using reputable brand, you should be fine. My DD never had any tummy issues and neither had my son.