dd having a bout of unhappiness - it's very sad

[mascaraohara]

I've posted about this before but we are having another bout and I don't know what to do, it seems to get worse each time.

My dd is a very very placid, polite, loving, kind, eager to please, little girl and for the most part she's very happy go lucky and relaxed

However she seems to go through periods (days at a time) of being incredibly self loathing. We are now into day 3 of this bout, last night she couldn't sleep and was incredibly upset because (her words) shes 'fat', 'ugly', 'she can't do anythign right', 'she hates herself', 'she's got no friends', 'she doesn't like her smile', 'nodody likes her'. She gets so so upset and it breaks my heart to see her do this to herself.

Now I know she has a few friends at school, she seems well liked and is always getting awards for being hospitable, kind, generous, thoughtful etc

She's not very academic but she's liked and loved. I don't know where she gets these ideas. I ask if someone has said soemthing at school and she says no. I tell her she's beautiful & clever all the time (perhaps that's where I've gone wrong) and we are a very cuddly family. So lots of affection.

I've asked her if there's anything particular that's worrying her, I've even asked if she would like to talk to a doctor about how sad she feels but she says no to everything. She can't explain why she feels the way she does

She's just about to turn 7 by the way. I didn't think I'd have to prepare myself for this sort of behaviour until she was a teenager

I could've cried last night, nothing I say or do makes her feel better and it breaks my heart.

I wish I could give you some advice. This is heartbreaking to read, so I can only imagine how you must feel.

My dd occasionally has the blues (she's 8) but nothing on this scale. More an antisocial downtime and it's usually down to tiredness. This seems a whole other level of the blues to me and I have no experience to share. Sorry

I hope you can get some support for this or some advice from some sage parent out there. I'm just sorry I can't help and I pray that your little girl finds her happiness and inner strength soon.

Thanks Squilly

I tell myself it's just a phase, that it'll pass, that her body is changing and her thoughts processes are changing but underneath I am worried that if it continues or becomes more regular she could have some long term problems

We all worry so much about our kids and I think about girls in particular with all the daft image stuff that's bandied around.

I'm sure it's just a phase, but I'd be spending my hours on the internet and on here trying to find someone who's gone through or is going through the same things. I can't imagine it's that rare an occurrence tbh.

I've just googled childhood depression and found this

www.bbc.co.uk/health/conditions/depression2.shtml

It might not help, but I'm hoping it will of some comfort...

Oh bless her heart she's so young

I've no advice at all TBH but how heartbreaking for you to hear her talking like that. I've a ds of nearly the same age, they still seem so young at that age.

Do you think it would be worthwhile maybe you having a chat with your gp, see what they say. I understand your DD doesn't want to but the GP may have some advice for you.

Thank you.

Squilly thanks for that link, it was really nice of you.

I will havea look at the link when I get home from work this evening

It does break my heart. I don't know whether to talk to GP, on one hand I think it can't hurt, maybe she needs some sort of counselling or soemthing but on the other hand I don't want her to be labelled as anything unecessarily (iykwim)

I'm trying to get her involved in groups to help her confidence and self esteem. She did dramam for a while then suddenly didn't want to go - I think she'd moved up a group and it was less gorup activity more individual activity and she felt self conscious.

I arranged a music group which she should have started last week but she really didn't want to go and I don't know if forcing her will do any good at all.

She does do Rainbows and Swimming Lessons (willingly and actively enjoys these, she has friends at both and almost every Rainbow goes to her school). She always tells me I'm the bestest mummy in the world and she was very lucky to get me, so I don't think my parenting can be too bad. weak

i want to add as well

that she's very melodramatic - loves pulling faces and 'playing a part' iykwim

so the other thing that nags me is whether she's doing it for attention.. but I can never just ignore it because it's so sad to see & hear.. and I would never forgive myself if she grew up to think I was never there for her when she needed me iykwim

mascara - if she is doing it for attention then give her attention...don't think that it's best to ignore her and all that. But, perhaps the sort of attention should be trying to distract her. Don't show too much how she upsets you...try to be sympathetic but down to earth. Try to get her to "move on". Get her to help you with something. Give her a challenging task..then reward her.

Really not sure if I'm helping here but couldn't not post.

But one thing I learnt recently about self-esteem is that it doesn't come from being told how wonderful you are. It comes from facing something tough...and coming through the other side. So unless it really is depression or something clinical, it might be better to treat it as a phase.

Thanks, sorry for not coming back to this before now.

She seemed better yesterday and and is right as rain today so wee have been having talks. Yesterday I managed to get her to talk about one of the things upsetting her and she'd got herself worked up into such a state about a set of 'facts' that she'd told me.. turned out they weren't 'facts' they were just what she thought might happen.. desipte me asking her a number of times "are you sure that is the case" etc

very frustrating

I've decided to make a note in my diary of when it happens

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Hi Bloss, thanks for your post. I read it on Saturday - sorry I didn;t reply then.

Since I read your thread I have spent the weekend picking up on very specific things like "I thought you were very clever to work out how to do " and "thank you very much for loading the washing machine it was really helpful" etc

Will see how it goes, thanks again [smiles]

Take her to a drama class outside of school and try a sport aswell - this has help my dd a lot.

One to have have outside of school friends and of different ages. Plus the sports and drama have made her realise that she is good and enjoys other things. She has had to work really hard at the sport but this has helped make her realise that she is not useless.

Bloss, I would echo a the idea of a child psychologist.

I would also recommend the book How to Talk so Kids will Listen & Listen so Kids will Talk. Faber & Mazlish. May not solve anything, but you might pick up some helpful tips.

She used to go to Drama Club - dropped out after a term and a half. The people who ran it were very lovely and said she was welcome back anytime.. I keep talking to her about going back but as yet have not been able to persuade her. I think I said already that she seemed to not want to go when she had to do things alone while the group watched

Sports Club she did for half a term but to be fair she's always struggled with coordination and I think she knew she wasn't as good as the other children so didn't want to go back and to be fair after she told me she only ever got to be the referee or was picked last etc I didn't want to keep going so when she wanted to drop out I let her,

I also arranged a music club but she wouldn't even go to the first week after she found out a boy she didn't like went.

Just wanted to say sorry to hear about your DD! I think that you've already got loads of good advice and ideas to try but wanted to encourage you too as I had bad depression as a kid myself. Mine started when I was 9 (5 years before periods started but I think that it was hormonal in part) I know your DD is only 7 but it could maybe be related to hormones...??! In which case I think it is a case of learning to deal with it and seeing it as a developmental phase thats going to come and go throughtout the next however many years. Good diet, plenty of sleep and exercise all help with stabilising mood. The advice re activities and specific compliments is good!!
But maybe you could also ask her what she thinks would help her.
It sounds like you are a brilliant mum and are already doing what you can to help her. I know that my mum felt absolutely devasted by my depression and what she felt was her inability to help me, so can appreciate that this is a very difficult time for you. However looking back I think that if my mum could have seen it more as a phase and a sign that I needed help to learn better coping skills this would havehelped me a great deal. Good luck keep us posted!!

single sport - swimming, canoeing, tramploine, wall climbing, life saving club,

we do deals on go once and try it twice then a carrott is dangled to encourage participation. Holding hands has literally been done to help her get through the door the first time.

I wasn't keen on the two drama groups in my area so drive 10 miles away for a drama group that is lovely and really aware of not putting children "on the spot" but more group work - it is far cheaper than local groups but a 20 minute drive.

Just cos she has tryed one group explain that there are others to try and see what they are like, make friends etc.

Would it help you to say that you are not alone? Dd who is 7 is often unhappy, she doesn't often use the words your dd uses, but gets very emotional when she is having a bout. Unlike your dd she is very self confident, but also dislikes going to most sporting activities.

Her teacher at school has noticed that she has a deflated spirit and has quizzed her. It turns out that there are a few social issues going on and dd is finding it hard to find her place amongst the other kids just now.

Have you spoken to the school? Perhaps they can keep an eye on her and her friendship circles.

I think this is a difficult age for girls who can't really put into words the new emotions that come into play with their relationships, for example the feeling of jealousy at feeling left out, knowing that it is not a helpful emotion but not knowing what to do with it.

You sound like a great mum.

It does help, not for you I know but thank you.

I think dd also struggles with 'finding her place'

Thanks for all the other suggestions as well I will definitely be trying them

Well now MoH, look at this way - you can be a deep feeler, and feel things keenly and strongly without having depression you know.

Who can explain the way they feel? Let alone a 7 y-o. Sometimes we're moved by things or angered by things, sometimes we might be overcome with feelings of inexplicable sadness or strong feelings we can't even name. I think it's human, I don't see any reason why children shouldn't have strong feelings tbh.

I think rather than say 'but you've got a beautiful smile' which is basically saying, 'you don't feel this way' try and find a name for that feeling for her. Like with HTT I suppose. You might say 'so you're feeling really fed up?' or 'you sound sad!' or 'oh darling, you don't think you can do anything right! What's happened to make you feel like that. It's a horrid way to feel. I feel like that sometimes too. Like when I burnt the dinner - it was so frustrating and I was such a ditz but then it was okay because we had fish and chips.' You know that kind of thing.

I have 7 y-o dd too. She's awful dramatic!

I think what I'm saying is authenticate what she feels for her benefit - this doesn't mean you have to believe what she says to be the literal truth.

Does that make sense?

Spot on ahundred.

I certainly don't see dd as being depressed but she certainly is very intense and deep and emotional. I think 'authenticating' their emotions makes them realise that it is fine to have such complicated emotions, especially when she realises that her mama can feel that way too.

MoH, actually I do feel better knowing that I too am not alone. Everyone else's little darlings seem to be so easy.

That all makes sense 100x

I do try and authenticate it, though I find by the 3rd day or so my patience start wearing thin.

This bout has passed, it's quite hard to deal with at the time as whatever I say is wrong iykwim

I've tried not saying anything and just cuddling her but she just sobs and sobs uncontrolably

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I've been thinking about this MoH. I think 7 is really not an uncommon age for this kind of thing. My dd does it too, well a version of it. I really think it's a stage where they are asking lots of questions, like what will I be like? And are at one those brinks between having a better understanding of the adult world - almost for the first time - but still not, of course. It is a time for strong feelings.

I think you give enough validation of her feelings - but don't show excessive concern, if that makes sense. Sometimes they don't even know why they're upset or stroppy.

Mostly I think I was thinking that it seems quite normal and healthy and that you shouldn't get too upset about it, or actually get carried along by it. You don't have to sit there for ages cuddling her while she cries. You can empathize, be happy, be firm, name the feeling and move on.

hi mascaraohara,

I just read your thread and, although I don't have any DCs yet myself it reminded me of having those 'down-on-myself' moods as a child and I just wanted to add this thought.

Something I think that it's quite hard to help children understand that it's fine to just enjoy doing things you aren't necessarily very good at. When I was at school I did very well academically and was always praised for that but wasn't very good at music/sport/art/drama etc and so I didn't really join after school groups or classes that might have helped me make more friends. I didn't feel things were worth doing if I didn't do them really well and I got very self-conscious if I wasn't one of the best at whatever we were doing. Also I didn't think people would like me if I didn't do well at an activity - my self-worth was all tied up with achievement or ability IYSWIM. Years later (at 25) I joined a rugby club. I was fairly unfit and not very co-ordinated so I spent a lot of time on the subs bench but I loved the training, meet loads of new friends and generally had a great time. It was the first time I realised I could enjoy doing something I was crap at. I know that had a lot to do with the team I played with - the coach gave credit for the effort I put in even if I dropped a lot of balls and although I got some stick from the other players it was all good natured and taught me to laugh at myself for probably the first time. Looking back I realise how many things I missed out on because I wouldn't give them a go in case I failed.

Hope that makes sense and didn't turn into a ramble/lecture but I think it's really important for children to learn that sometimes you have to try not to worry what other people think of your ability and just enjoy yourself - it's amazing how many more people want to be your friend and how much better you feel when you are relaxed, having fun and not thinking about how good you are at something.