Is it too late to bond with my 5 y/o?

[BEAUTlFUL]

This is awful. Since having DS2, I've realised that I have never properly bonded with DS1. He's now 5. Is it too late?

I had PND with him, and DH was very involved with the childcare which is wonderful, but sort of took over from my role.

I never felt I found my feet with DS1. This led to my putting him in nursery 3 days a week when he was 1 just because I could (I'd never dream of doing this with DS2), feeling generally exhausted every time I was with him, and having to force myself to play or spend time with him one-on-one.

With DS2 it's all so easy and natural, it's made me suspect that I never bonded with DS1. So... what can I do? Is it too late? How can I strengthen our bond? I have to do something. At the moment he still exhausts and depresses me, it's not right, it needs fixing now.

Please help, if you can. Thank you.

Its never too late!

I think you've taken your first step by realising it. Have you spoken to your dh about how you feel?

I'd guess the best thing to do is to set aside dedicated time with your ds1 for you and he to do some fun activities together. Now that he's five i guess make them adventures that you can do together, i'm thinking tree climbing and treasure hunts, where you have to work together and can have a giggle with him.

Well done for acknowledging it and taking action.

Good luck xx

first of all, did you have counselling for pnd. i did, and it was really worthwhile and allowed me to understand it and move on in lots of ways. its certainly not to late for that.

and it is not too late to bond. i know what you mean about your dh taking over your role, my dh did/does this and i feel quite pushed out.

i think some kind of dance/movement class if he's not too old for this kind of thing. something expresssive but non verbal

Thanks Hattie. I think a shared project would be good for us, wouldn't it? He loves it when we do multi-player games on the DS, but something outdoorsy would be better.

Can you and DS1 go away for the weekend or something? DS2 is very possessive of me so DS1 gravitates to DH. It really helps when DS1 and I get to spend time together without the little brother we both adore.

Sorry to hear this.

Yes yes yes it is possible!

My ds1 is 7 and has aspergers syndrome.
When he was 2 his twin siblings were born and dh took over most of his care when he wasn't at work and I couldn't really pay that much attention to him.

Because of his as he becomes stuck in routines and I wasn't part of his routines so he wouldn't let me in

However, last year I decided enough was enough and I scheduled hugs with him into our day- and tickled him until he gave in to them! I have worked up to us leaving the house together (something he refused to do if his dad was there). I have really really focussed on allocating time to him and being really explicit in telling him how great he is and hoe special he is to me.
I am a firm believer that if you plaster a smile on and pretend you're having a great time eventually you will actually be having a great time!
You have to focus on your ds1's postives and ignore the exhausting/depressing stuff (my ds1 does some incredibly anti social stuff becaus eof his sn- so I really do understand)
My relationship has been transformed with ds1 - he gives me hugs and he wants me not dh!

I think cognitive behavioural therapy would help you to associate your ds1 with the lovely little boy he is rather than the bad time t=you had at first with him. You can buy books that you can teach yourself cbt with.

Good luck - really not too late.

I feel the same sometimes. Probably undiagnosed PND which didn't get treated until I was PG with DS2. My DS1 is 4.5.

I take DS1 out to a cafe every week just the two of us, and I chat to him in the car there and back, just the two of us. I get very excited if he "lets" me sit next to him for meals, and have little jokes that are just ours not daddy's.

Does this help? I feel as though I'm getting somewhere with him now.

I bet you're being harder on yourself than you need to be. Re read the last part of your sentence

Just had quick discussion with dp about this, as we have 2 girls. i was the 'main carer' whilst our eldest was growing up and he is the 'main carer' in the last couple of years with our youngest who is 2.
We both agree we seem to have stronger bonds with the dd's that we spent the most time with, but this doesn't mean we don't love the others any less, its just different because of the experiences. I feel i can read the mind of dd1, but i sometimes have to look to dp for an explanation of dd2s behaviour.

Do you think that some of what you're feeling may just be an element of this? because you have had more of that time with ds2?

Don't beat yourself up about it.

I just had to respond as your post struck a chord.

I had bonding issues with my dc1 (who is now nearly 5) given a traumatic birth & undiagnosed pnd and, like you, a fab dh who leapt into the breach which was a sanity saver but left me feeling rather inadequate. And yet with my 2nd it's been soooo easy which has meant occasional waves of guilt re my pfb. But I've also come to realise, having had my wildly different dc2, that you also have different relationships with your children, simply because they are different people and have different needs.

Fwiw, my advice is to find things that you enjoy doing with dc1, that's different to the things dh does with him. DC1 and I do imaginative play (pirates and power-rangers) and we make things, whilst with dh he does activities like swimming/rough and tumble. I also encourage dh to take dc2 with him if he's nipping out, just to give dc1 & me time alone - & this eve we looked at family photographs together.

Thank you all so much - I have been in tears (in a good way) reading your replies.

Do you really think it's fixable? It's so hard to explain, but I have always felt (I have never said this out loud) that there were/are invisible arms pushing me away from DS1. When he was a baby, I'd hover in the doorway of the room, watching him play, then feel guilty and panicky when he wanted me to join in, because I really didn't want to. It's so bad. I'd always busy myself doing things for him (like cooking, washing, buying him clothes, etc) rather than with him.

Have any of you felt like that? Or are you reading this with horror now?

Have just talked to DH about this and have arranged that I'll take DS1 up to London this w/e, just the two of us. I know DS1 will like that. But I need a weekly outing, don't I?

Thank you for not judging, by the way. Thank you so much.

I had severe PND with ds 1 and he went to nursery 2 days a week from 12 weeks (I remember saying 'I have to wait that long??? When staff told me the earliest was 12 weeks)

I dreaded Mondays as I was alone with him, he screamed a lot and was generally a very frustrated unhappy baby. He wasn't comforted by me (or anyone) and would push us away if we tried to console him.

I had psychology sessions for over a year, left my job as I really wasn't coping and spent more time wondering why I was so abnormal and other mums loved being with their babies. I felt he was always at arms length.

Now he's 5 (ds 2 is 16 months and I'm prgt with ds 3) and things have got better but I think a lot of it is really to do with personality. He has been very much a daddy's boy but we went away (dh and I, no kids) for half term and he's since become very clingy, loving and wanting me which is the first time ever. He wanted me to take him swimming at the weekend!!! (That is unheard of)

This isn't to say we hadn't bonded, it took a while but I think I bonded with him around 12-18 months but it's been a really slow process.

Ds 2 on the other was easy and natural we co slept, I breastfed for longer and felt he loved ME above all others I could comfort him, he wants my arms...

I love ds 1 totally for his differences, he's very confident in his ideas, intelligent but the older he gets the easier I find our relationship. He's able to articulate what he wants and has started to tell me he's proud of of me!

It's been a journey but as I do tell him constantly, he's the one who made me a mummy so he is incredibly special (he loves that) and I no longer dread being on my own with him but like to plan what we're going to be doing.

Maybe start slowly, accept where you are and don't put any pressure on yourself. How about planning 1 activity that you know ds like to do and go with the flow and have some mummy and ds 1 time.

I felt like that when I was pregnant with DS2 (v depressed) and DS1 really needed me. And I couldn't be there for him. Oh the guilt. Sometimes even now DS1 asks me to play and I get that shiver of not knowing whether I'm doing it bcause I want to or ought to or to make up for what I didn't do when he was younger.

I'm sure it's fixable, I do believe it. Probably need to forgive ourselves first, and just pretend a bit more until it comes naturally.

muppetgirl "I do tell him constantly, he's the one who made me a mummy so he is incredibly special (he loves that)"

I do that too - it's lovely isn't it and really makes them feel special.

...just read your 'invisible arms' point and the part of my post where I say ds 2 wants my arms echoes you in your feelings with your ds 1. I felt there was a barrier stopping me going to him. I can't explain it but he spent a lot of time on his sheepskin on the floor, not in my arms. I gave up b/f as I couldn't bear him near me.

I now view it as my mind wasn't well. I try to separate me from my mind, my actions to my feelings. Yes he was clean, fed (bottle) had toys so I was outwardly a 'good mum' but inside I felt nothing but rage, anxiety about not feeling 'normal', desloation at the thought that Is this it? Is this motherhood? Can't I have my old life back? And also a huge sense of disappointment about not feeling what I though I should.

We have a day each holiday when we go on the train to london. We've been to the Natural History Museum a few times and St pauls (went to the top -he was in awe) and we're going to go on the millenium wheel when the weather gets better. Ds 2 is in nursery so we do get some quaility time together. He loves it, so do I but I still can't get on the floor and play trains, he won't cook with me, do arty stuff so we meet in the middle! I now feel that that's okay though, what we do do together we both have a fab time and both look forward to it.

You are all helping me so much. muppetgirl, yes, I read your post and it is so similar to how I felt with DS1. I didn't b/f with him as we couldn't make it work -- a b/f specialist at the hospital even said that DS1 and I weren't "a good fit".

I think I blamed myself for a lot of things that, looking back, were just parts of his personality. For example, he never seemed to like cuddles, singing, rocking, etc. With DS2, I would accept those things as part of his nature, but with DS1 I felt rejected and pushed out.

He just wanted his little swing chair, so I gave up and let him stay in it for hours on end, feeling that I was completely failing him. That's how I've (secretly) carried on since then... Sort of giving up. Never waking up with any verve or enthusiasm to tackle the problems, just wanting to pretend they didn't exist. Awful, really.

I'm still (secretly) a bit surprised when people really like him. I know how bad that is. I do everything right on paper, but underneath, I find myself getting very irritated with him very quickly.

He deserves better, which is why I posted.

maybe them telling you 'you and ds weren't a good fit' has stuck in your mind a bit.
thats not fact is it? that is some div saying something completely without reason.

I love all your ideas. I think a lot of "faking it till you make it" is needed here. I know that wnever we go out we do have a good time. Staying inside doesn't seem to suit us at all.

halo, yes, I do think she was a div and should not be allowed to tell mothers (especially 1st-time mothers) such utter crap.

For met just being able to say

I don't feel the same as the other mums I see. I find this hell, I struggle to be with my son everyday. I am angry but I don't want to be.

to someone helped massively. To actually say it out loud somehow acknowledges it, that it's a real felling.

The comments your received in hospital were awful, I would have hated anyone to say anything like that but I would have probably taken it far much to heart and made it an excuse for my failings. ('well, the woman said we weren't a best fit and she knows...')

I also find outside much better with ds 1. He gets cabin fever spending too much time inside. We like taking the dogs to the local large house with grounds and walking around, he's into nature so he loves the passing seasons and we always come home with a lovely collection of stuff to show daddy.

I think I've learned that love comes in different forms. Ds 2 wants cuddles, smiles and grins when you catch his eye, is happy to play for hours with the same toy and generally seems 'satisfied' with me. Ds 1 is still very intense and I have learned to love this part of him (it is a big part!) he loves me in his way which is different to ds 1. He doesn't want constant cuddles and is fiercly independent and I now accept him more for what he is rather than comparing him to ds 2.

You'll get there because you want to and you've shown you have a deep love for him by posting and saying you know it isn't right what you feel and you want to change.
I would plan short activities that you would like to do (don't talk yourself into an activity as I don't think it'll work) go for a walk, give him a pictorial shopping list so he can find his own things whilst you shop, take him swimming etc.