How do I get DS to ADMIT that he has to poo???

[purplemonkeydishwasher]

or pee for that matter!

I've started more threads about DS's poo issues than I'd care to admit. He's been basically potty trained since July 2008. he's now 3.4 yrs.

He waits until either the last second and ends up peeing a bit in his underpants OR I'll end up forcing him to sit on the toilet while he screams the place down and he does a big pee and is pleased with himself.

that's bad enough but the poo problems are really getting to me.
he hates pooing. will do anything to avoid it. mostly that means holding it for days on end.
we tried bribery. if he did X number of poos then he would get a treat. that's basically working. he still doesn't like to poo and will hold it but he's do it.
but yesterday and today he obviously can;t hold it anymore and it's coming out a bit and he's sucking it back in so there's a big crusty skid on his underpants. his bum is obviously sore from being covered in poo so much. but that makes him even more reluctant to go because he's sore.

3 times i had to change him out of pooey underpants yesterday (plus once from wet ones) and so far today it's been once.

I'm fed up. really really fed up.
i'm trying not to get angry but...
please help. please give me an answer. please give me a clue.

he's currently sitting on the toilet. i won't let him get up until he does something. probably the wrong tact but i just can't face anohter pooey episode.

bumping out of desperation...

Don't like to be the bringer of bad news but .... my ds2 is like this and he is 8.6! He has always been like this and it is a nightmare. He hasn't been for days at present and I'm going to force him onto the loo in a minute... he'll probably be there for 30 mins.

sounds like my 3.4 year old who potty trained in July...

He eats a fantatsic diet, loads of fruit and veg and rinks loads of water (and always has)

we are just winning since Xmas (though he has always been fine with wees)

the more we ask him to poo or talk about it the less likely he is to do it...

we feed him dried apricots evry day with breakfast and they do see to help...

the dont want to poo as it hurts, so they dont, so it hurts more, so it hurts even more etc....

today (for the 1st time ever) i found him sitting on the loo doing a poo ... he had taken himself, got his step and loo seat etc and was doing it.. normally he moans to me... i had felt he needed a poo all day and i didnt mention it once and he just did it

when he says it hurts we always tell him to do it now or it will hurt more... i think some things need to be said and acknowledged, and not hidden

his dad is a GP and apparently GP would just prescribe lactilose until they basicaly have to go and disassocate it with pain but we have managed to avoid that so far... just!

good luck

Oh dear, I know exactly what you mean. Search for 'encopresis' (on here and elsewhere). It's horrible.

Try, try, try not to get angry. My only real successes have come from being very calm and kind and understanding about it (eventually, after years of screaming and irritation).

He's not doing it to be deliberately stubborn - he might well have no control over it at all.

I dose regularly with Califig, and top up with prescriptions of lactulose from the GP when things go beyond 5/6 days (not often thankfully).

Another thing that helped for me was to find a child-friendly internet site that showed the digestive system, and to explain what was happening inside him. If your DS is showing signs of being scientifically-minded this might help? Or one of those books about farts and poos that small children are supposed to love (haven't tried this one myself yet).

It's not at all uncommon. Talk to the GP - it might well make you feel better.

Oh, and to take the pressure off yourself - and him - you could try putting him back into nappies, at least until the current episode is over. I know it seems like a backwards step, but it releases you from the frustration around pooey pants.

thanks everyone
i know i'm handling it badly. blame the pg hormones!

after starting this thread i put him in the shower (to get the poo off) and lef t him. when i went to get him he was standing there with his legs crossed trying not to poo!!!!!

so i got his potty out. (he hasn't used it for months and months) and put it IN the shower. he did the biggest poo i've ever seen.
cue much cheering from me!!
DH brought him home a treat for doing it and he was so proud of himself.

poor little guy. i feel bad now. i just get fed up.
anyway, thank you for your replies. i'm going to have a think about what we're going to do.

x

Don't feel bad - I just don't get it with my ds2. He needs a poo - then go, don't stand there with your legs crossed and he's 8!!!

With ds2 the problems started when he was coming up to 3 and he broke his leg. It was uncomfortable for him to sit on the potty or toilet and he became constipated. Then when he did go, it was so big that it made his bottom bleed a bit and then he was scared of doing a poo in case the same thing happened ..... and on and on. He was put on to lactulose by gp which really helped. He couldn't hold the poo in as the urge to go was too strong and the poo was soft and easy to pass. He came off of it after about 1.5 years (just before he started school), but then the same old problems came back.

You can buy lactulose over the counter - I used to put it in his milk.

i finally went to the doctor about it. she gave me MOVICOL to give him.
yesterday he peed everywhere because he was so afriad so go on the toilet or potty.
i told him that today we are going to go tot eh shops to buy some stuff to make a special chart. he can pick stickers stamps whatever to use. he seems pretty excited about it.
stickers worked the first time so i'm hoping that if we go back to basics he;ll start being ok with the toilet again.

he finally went again yesterday. (a full week since last time) but only because i caught him hiding and crossing his legs so i put him on the potty.

he was in tears yesterday though. even when i just wanted him to pee he cried and cried that he was afraid.

i feel like such a failure.

I was just about to suggest movicol. It took me AGES to realise that dd was constipated because she was doing poos, in an emergency in her knickers. She's been witholding for such a long tome that her muscles have actually stopped working properly, and she is still straining terribly to do a (very loose) poo. At the moment she is back in nappies, and she has started to do poos in the toilet about half the time. I am trying really hard to chill out about it, and hoping that her body becomes better at dealing with it, then maybe we will start to think about toilet training again.
I felt dreadful when I eventually realised that she was actually constipated, I had tried so many tactics to stop her soiling, and had eventually got pissed off with it all, and said things which were counterproductive. I really feel for you.
This is my thread.

OK, I can understand that, I'm sorry, it wasn't supposed to sound rude.
How about this or this
or this

oops wrong thread!

I really sympathise purplemonkeydishwasher. DS was like this for a very, very long time and it made me so stressed. By the time he started school he still didn't want to do a poo in the loo and we had to put him in a nappy each evening when he would sit on the toilet and poo into this. This went on until he was about 6 1/2. As he got older we made him deal with the contents of his nappy - ie tip the poo into the bowl and put the nappy in the bin etc - I think this helped him understand that pooing into the toilet was a lot more convenient! Eventually we persuaded him to take off the nappy and place some toilet paper in the bottom of the bowl and poo onto this instead. I tried very hard to play down my anxieties about his toilet habits and we eventually managed to be very matter of fact about it. Lactulose wasn't that helpful because he wasn't really constipated and I didn't want him to face the anxiety of needing to use the toilet at school - I think he would rather have had an accident than go to the loo. He did love looking at books about poo and the school nurse was reasonably helpful - she said it is very common among boys. I don't think we'll ever get to the bottom ('scuse the pun) about what set his fear off but I know when you're in the middle of these things it feels like it will never get any better. You really have my sympathies.

thanks minky and pluto - it's so sad that there are so many kids out there like this.

DS was so excited about his chart. he peed 3 times today no problem (well there was one little accident) and he was fine. even went while we were out. (and he was wearing a diaper)

so we get home, he helps with his chart, is very excited and when it comes time to pee before bed he...REFUSES to go and cries and cries. i wonder if maybe he was overtired? i dunno.

right. i have to look at the positives!

1. he peed in the toilet 4 times today
2. he took the medicine quite happily
3. he was really good today. (not related I know but in my current condition it's definitley a bonus!!)

ok, i'm off to finish reading minky's thread now. (DH is putting DS to bed so i have a few peaceful minutes!!)

minky - we are in very similar situations - i'm due end of april! being hormonal certainly doesn't help this at all!!

Oooh, congratulations.
I know what you mean though, it would be really good to have this sorted before new baby comes along. I currently have two in nappies, and just don't know how I will manage with three! On the other hand I am really reluctant to 'push' dd1 in to it again as I just think it will knock her confidence if we go back to soiled knockers being the norm. I can't help being frustrated when that happens, despite my best efforts to act like it doesn't matter, it is a pita to clean up and is really restrictive re going out etc etc.
Great news about your ds and the pee.
Yesterday I found dd1 on the toilet having done a poo! on her own. However, I have no idea how substantial it was as she had put half a roll of toilet tissue on top of it!
Got to go, have screaming child.
More later.
Hope today is ok for you.
x

that's awesome that she went by herself!!

i can count on one finger hand the number of times that DS has even done a pee on his own!

he's been ok today. a couple of squirts but i was calm and didn't make a big deal about it. i also bought some pull-ups!

a few minutes ago he was hiding and when i went over he said not to look at him and he was obviously holding a poo in. i didn't make a fuss i just said ok and left him. a few minutes later he called me and said he wanted to sit on the potty!! there was a tiny poo but i think it was more that it fell out rather than being pushed out IYKWIM. i think the important thing is not making a fuss and not making a big deal about anything. (HA HA easier said than done!!!)

they WILL crack this!! (no pun intended!! )

"i think it was more that it fell out rather than being pushed out "

YES! I know EXACTLY what you mean. I don't think DD can actually push a poo out, she does every so often sit on the loo and try to push one out, but nothing ever happens, if she ever makes it to the loo/potty to do a poo then it's I'm sure it's just that she's managed to get there before it fell out of its own accord.

I guess it's positive that he hid when he was doing the poo, maybe there was some sort of decision involved???

I think I'm going to ask GP to refer us to a specialist as I am worried about it that she has actually lost the ability to push.

oh minky, i hope the specialist can help. they do say that it takes a while to get the bowel back to 'normal' after something like this. i think that's why they say to use the meds for months rather than weeks.

we seem to be taking a BIG backward step today. he won't even SIT on the potty or toilet.

looks like it's diapers for us today.

Yes, I gather it's supposed to take as long for them to get back to normal as the length of time they had the problem for! Since I was absolutely bloody useless at diagnosing it in the first place, it could be well over a year.

I hated the idea of going back to nappies, and now I feel sorry for her being in them, it's silly but I feel people will wonder why she is still in nappies, adn hate the idea that people think she is backward or something. I guess that if anyone was to judge it though, they would assume it was my incompetence rather than dds which kept her in nappies, which is fine. I have to say though that since going back to nappies, life has been significantly easier.
Can't wait for it all to be sorted.
DD did a small poo this am in her nappy, and then got out of the bath for a serious expolosive number in the toilet which was great. I have become a little obsessed, and wish that we had those toilets (which they have in Hong Kong) which have really wide shallow bowls so you can see EVERYTHING before it gets flushed away!
Hope he feels a bit more like sitting on the toilet tomorrow.

"I feel people will wonder why she is still in nappies, adn hate the idea that people think she is backward or something."

I TOTALLY get that. i was feeling the pressure to get him out of diapers when he was 2 never mind NOW!

the Movicol isn't working so far. it's been since last tuesday that he's pooed. i've upped it to 2 sachets a day since yesterday. unfortunately there's no medicine to MAKE him sit on the toilet and he's still fighting it. peeing is going ok. back to the potty, but he's been telling me when he has to go which is getting better again.

he knows and tells me often that when i he goes poo he gets a fishing game fro the Wii. but when it comes to actually sitting down to do the deed he just refuses.

why is this so HARD????

i just wanted to update on how well DS is doing. for the last week or so he's been going poo in the toilet every couple of days!!!!!!

i've tried a new tact - i started blowing bubbles with him while he sat on the toilet to encourage him to sit longer. then i got bored with it so i told him that he could blow bubbles if he did a poo (actually i said if the poo plopped in the toilet!) and for the first time EVER he actually actively pushed a poo out!

the movicol is making a big difference because the poos are softer and easier to get out.

he's been better with pees as well. sometimes he doesn't even tell me he needs to go, he just goes into the bathroom and does what he needs to do! i can't tell you how happy i am!!!