Any Lawyers/Law students out there help please.........

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I've got an assignment and part of it is i need a chart which shows the differences between murder, involuntary and voluntary manslaughter.

How would i lay that out?? i haven't the foggiest idea.

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Draw 3 columns and put the law pertaining to each at the top ie unlawful homicide needs intention to kill with perhaps an example underneath A did this to B and explain why it was murder, involuntary or voluntary manslaughter. Put Involuntary and voluntary manslaughter in columns 2 and 3.

I'd advise getting hold of the original statutes to read them if you can as they can sometimes be easier to understand than text books .

would i need to put in extra columns for the two types of involuntary and voluntary manslaughter etc.

This part of my assignment is really confusing.

Thanks Sally

I'd separate them as they are different offences.

Don't worry, criminal law is tough but it will click into place.

i don't even want to specialise in criminal law lol. Hmm so it would be a bar chart, mabe i should put %in of conviction rates, would that be good??

It's just got to be learnt so you can pass that area as it's an exemption subject so it can't be skipped . I don't know how detailed your tutors want it to be - probably a bit more than I've suggested.

You could try a flow chart as well. I'll have a look in my folders and see if i've still got my notes for crimnal law. They're pretty old though - I took this in 03/04.

I'd really appreciate it. All my assignments have been very indepth, and i've had distinctions for all of them, so don't want my effort or grades to slip iykwim. they've all been very detailed before, just this part of this particular assignment is boggling my mind!

I personally would put the offences under each other in one column. Then I'd put mens rea as heading for one colum, actus reus (sp?) as next heading and sentence in the last heading.

So would end up with a table with 3 rows & 4 columns. But I did criminal law 7 years ago!

this is what my assignment task asks for.

As part of your training you are required to accompany Mrs Lochee (the solicitor in our pretend firm) to see clients in custody, she has asked you to prepare some simple fact sheets which will assist in explaining to clients certain aspects of homicide.

She would like each fact sheet to deal with a different aspect of fatal offences as follows:

a) a chart showing the differences between murder, voluntary and involuntary manslaughter,

b) a sheet showing cases which illustrate the operation of the defences of provocation and diminished responsibility

c) a sheet cases which illustrate the two types of involuntary manslaughter.

the second two i should be okay on, its the first one.

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What about adding a row for defences and another one for sentences

I would do it with 3 columns with the offenses at the top and then rows for mens rea, actus reus, defence, sentence.

Not sure if there are any more but if malice aforethought different from mens rea? It is a very long time since I did a law degree!

'offences' obviously.

ahh right i see what you mean.
hmm how could i word the defence part for each tho??

i wonder if it would be best in a sort of flowchart. You can ask the question of whether there was mens rea then split off to murder or manslaughter. Then ask if there was provocation to split off between mansluaghter or involuntary manslaughter.

Then at the next level you consider what else is needed to prove liability. e.g. murder - intention to kill or harm, involuntary manslaughter - negligence or as a result of another criminal act.

Then lastly you can consider what other mitigating factors might help the court to reach a decision - use of a lethal weapon in murder for example.

sounds like an interesting assignment. I'm a third year law student.

Isn't manslaughter voluntary if the defendant has the mens rea for murder? It's a while since i've covered this and I have a memory like a goldfish!

i wouldnt cover defences in part A, because that is asked in part B in any case.

Chops i like that thanks.

This task is only 1 of 4 lol - the other task seem relativly easy to do. its just this part.

What area of law you hoping to specialise in?? are you hoping to be a solicitor or barrister?

No mens rea for voluntary manslaughter - it is caused by provocation or diminished responsibility. So you meant to kill but you weren't in charge of your faculties (insert correct legal term at that point)!

So murder - mens rea
Voluntary manslaughter - no mens rea due to diminished responsibility or provocation
Involuntary manslaughter - no mens rea due to negligence or omission.

voluntary manslaughter means you have both the actus reus and mens rea of murder but the circumstances mean you have one provocation or diminished responsibility as your defence.

I agree with muppets. there is mens rea for voluntary manslaughter, I remember that now.

I'd really like to become a solicitor, but I don't know if realistically I will ever be able to afford the training, and I worry about getting a training place. I may look at ILEX ore something instead. Contract law interests me the most, I'd love to work in that field somewhere.

i'm going down the ILEX route now, i want to be a legal executive fellow. although i really want to go to uni and get my degree and then a masters.
I want to specialise in either probate or family law.

No mens rea that is the difference between murder and manslaughter.

But it depends how you word it - no mens rea because of diminished responsibility etc

or mens reas but mitigated by diminished responsibility. My books and my google search are saying the first - no mens rea for manslaughter.

However, it was up for review so I stand correct if that has changed in the last couple of years.

so this is how the chart should go.
murder, v-manslaughter and iv-manslaughter at the top. Actus Reus, Mens rea, poss defences & sentencing down the side and then entering the details??

That was what I was thinking.

A flow chart would work but it would split at the top after the actus reus and then just be 3 columns so maybe you should do a table to allow for a bit more detail.

This just doesn't seem that difficult...or is it just me?
Perhaps it would be useful for you to try to draw a flow chart with your understanding of what would differentiate between the three.
That will ultimately show you your actual understanding of how you decide which is which and highlight your learning needs.
This surely is the point of the question.

Sorry if that sounds awful but ultimately drawing a decent flow chart now will help you masses at revision time

Good luck...uggghhh essays before Christmas