"oh no I am never allowed chocolate it is ^really^ bad for you and rots your teeth and makes you fat"

[CrushWithEyeliner]

I am a TA and this was said to me by a 4 yo girl when discussing favorite foods and trying new things.

I really felt sad for her to have been indoctrinated so negatively about a food that in moderation can be really enjoyable. I honestly believe this attitude causes eating disorders and I don't understand why some parents feel the need to drum in things like this. Are they scared their children are going to get obese or what?

It IS possible to buy processed meat e.g. sandwich meat that does not contain sodium nitrite - I have some nitrite-free turkey slices in my fridge right now.

I'm not actually advocating eating processed meat products (I'm just lazy) I just can't see that sweets and chocolate are actually better. You have exactly the same problem with the possible health benefits of cocoa - we don't eat cocoa - we eat processed chocolate.

My children tend to say 'ooo sweeties' not 'oooo ham'??

Have you ever read Boy by Roald Dahl? I love the joy of the attitude to the sweetshop and buying sweets (tactfully avoiding the dead mouse in the jar bit.)

My children eat EVERYTHING (well, not sprouts and blue cheese

I love the relish and pleasure my children get from sweets. They are not fed them often. Why do they need to be demonised?

I think its sad to give children negative conatations about food. I think its fair enough to limit certain things to very occasionally such as crisps only at parties etc but to give the impression that having some chocolate on occasion will make you balloon up and your teeth will drop out is a bit OTT. Obese adults tend to have ishoos with food rather than ocasionally eat chocolate.

I was once in a McDonalds with my friend and her dcs and her dds friend who was about 7. The friend didn't have anything to eat and was really upset because she thought that people were going to start dying right in front of her.

Acinonyx

I would be careful of that turkey if I were you. Meats are often labeled as nitrite free when Na nitrite isn't added but that doesn't mean that the level of nitrite in the finished product is lower. Instead of using sodium nitrite directly, cane sugar juice, or celery are used. The soil used for growing them has nitrate added so they will be high in 'natural' nitrate. The vegtable/plant extract is added anlongside bacteria which reduces the nitrate to nitrite so nitrite doesn't have to be declared on the label.

I don't know how much 'nitrite free' meat is processed this way but some is. I suspect that most is.

I don't see the sense in letting children have eating habits that I don't have as an adult and don't want to encorouge in them either. They would probably relish heroin given the chance but why let them? Why not - just say twice a year, for fun?

I doubt whether any child (even in the op) is actually told that one chocolate etc will rot their teeth and make them fat. But it is not incorrect to say that eating more empty calories than you can use will, suprise suprise, make you fat.

I rarely eat sweets etc because it's just empty calories - why encoutage dd to eat them? I don't want her to spend her life dieting/whining about being fat like so many women around me. I want to her to have healthy eating habits from the start.

Sweets are just a massive commercial money-making drive that we as parents facilitate at our children's expense.

Alice - I am going to be seriously challenged finding fillers for dd's sandwiches in that case...

i've stopped buying processed meat and sandwiches are egg, tuna or cheese variations - or a mackeral pate but not for dd.

i can't get excited about banning foods cos of calorific concerns but for health reasons, yes. so i'll allow dd1 ice cream but never, ever mr whippy. it's not ice cream, just chemicals and thatcher worked on the process (i won't say 'recipe') what's to like?

choc is fine in moderation - but again - it's the politics which put me off the cheap stuff. all that child slave labour. made by kids for kids. no thanks.

gawd, it's a minefield. don't give them issues. don't give them crap. try not to exploit anyone tooooo much.

pasta and pesto anyone?!

There is a difference between encouraging them to eat sweets and allowing them to, on occassion, have the sweets or chocolate or crisps etc. I don't have chocolate, sweets, crisps or juice in the house, largely because they are empty calories and I don't want to encouage constant snacking on rubbish.

However, I think that the 'damage' to health from occasionally eating empty calories is less than the damage done by not being allowed to join in or have some birthday cake or have the sweets out of a party bag. A 4yo shouldn't have to worry about stuff like that. My ds has a peanut allergy so he does have to worry about food and ask if things are ok for him. Its a PITA for him. It makes him embarrased and it makes him feel left out and excluded. I would never make him go through that if it wasn't necessary The comparison to heroin is ridiculous.

That is the same attitude that I take. I just don't add to the empty calories dd gets outside the house - that's more than enough.

The heroin comarison is trying to point out that our sttitudes to chemicals - all drugs of one sort or another - is largely irrational and culturally defined. A small dose of heroin every 6 months, apart from being illegal, may have fewer health consequences than many of our 'normal' habits.

Ah I see - I should let my children try heroin cos it feels nice AND it doesn't make them fat!

Where does one find a dealer in Hackney?

Well, once in a while, why not..?

I just couldn't bring myself to inject them! I really wouldn't want them to smoke it, it would make the curtains smell.

Oh and imagine the mess after they vomited!

Really, it's most inconvenient and have you seen the price of heroin these days?

Anyway, crystal meth is the drug of choice and you can make it with cough medicine.

Because of the risk of instant death due to allergic reaction to quinnine. Because you don't know what it is cut with or how pure it is. Because it causes the most cronic constipation. Because the downer you get after the high is horrendous. Because you only need to take heroin 2-3 time to have an addiction which will destroy your life. 75% of new HIV infections in women and children are thought to be due to IV drug use. Most people would not be able to handle opiate addiction but are able to handle having a few empty calories. Drug addiction causes enormous problems for society. I know that fatties cost a lot of money too but they don't break into peoples homes for kitkat money. You cannot take heroin at all without struggling with addiction.

my dcs have a avaried diet and understand that its fine to eat anything but there are a lot of things that should only be eaten in moderation and if they want to try something that isnt necessarily good for them then they are allowed even if its billy bear ham though if ham is in one thier meals planned by me its proper roast ham from the butchers!!

the only thing that is 'banned' as such is highly coloured sweets as they send dd1 potty but even there she can have them at parties if they are offered!

dp has started bringing less junk into the house as his family tend to put weight on easily and he is worried dd2 will become overweight as she seems to have a penchant for crisps and biccies!! he says that she is 'banned' from having them but i allow her to have them if they are offered i.e. if she is at my nans and the other dcs have them she can have some too!

i firmly believe that if you stop a child eating something completely they will binge on it later in life as forbidden things are always more appealing! my mum actually did us a favour bringing us up on junk! all three of us now eat salads and veg and are good cooks prefering healthy meals over chips!! maybe we got sick of chips when every meal came with them? my comfort food is not chips or choccy but berries. my sisters is mince she cant stand digestive biccies which she she was allowed at every meal.

Good points Bumdiddley. I will bear that in mine.

Alice - a small dose of good quality heroin (or insert high-grade drug of choice) ONCE in 6 months will not lead to addiction. I do think our reaction to drugs is a bit hysterical given the junk food, fags and alcohol that is routinely consumed by so many people (red wine being my drug of choice).

I'm still brooding on what to put in dd's sandwiches.

I think your reaction to sweets is hysterical as in haha

"I'm still brooding on what to put in dd's sandwiches."

Mary Jane Pesto perhaps?

Is that real stuff? Seriously, apart from cold meats, we have cheese, marmite or peanut butter. She won't tolerate salad stuff like tomatoes or lettuce. I guess there's tuna (barring mercury poisoning. Not sure how to get protein into her sandwiches. Humous is already a frquent snack. She won't have egg sandwiches - has to be scrambled on the side [hmmm]. Not much protein in marmite...

Any suggestions? I pack 2 meals/day for her CM days and lunch needs to be sanwiches.

I knew a women who 'banned' chocolate and sweets for her daughter, she told ppl coming round that if they wanted to bring a treat for her then to bring fruit.

The worked until she went to school and saw her friends having swwets and chocolate so then her mother let her have some but not that much - very little

fast forward 35 years and the girl is now a succesful women who has not been 'scarred for life'by the fact she wasnt allowed sweets and chocolate, nor has she a unheathly diet or eating disorder because of it

now i did see once a mother pour coke into a toddlers bottle - now that deserved title of sad

Oh Acin, Mary Jane is a term for marijuana! I was being cheeky.

IMO hommous is one of the best foods in the world for kids. It tastes good, is packed with goodness, you can dip things in it, spread it on bread, it keeps well. Fantastic stuff!

Tuna would be pretty nasty by lunchtime in a lunchbox wouldn't it? Same for tomatoes. I think the cheese and hommous stuff that you are doing are just fine. We probably worry way too much about this stuff now. I can't imagine my mother spending time thinking about whether there was enough protein in my lunch - not with 6 of us to get out the door!

I can't see that a little bit of cold meat a couple of times a week in a sandwich is going to give her cancer from the nitrates either. And lets face it, a world without bacon is not somewhere I personally would want to live.

Also if you have a read of the bread ingredients lists lots of them are heavy in protein themselves. A fav at our house the Vogels Honey & Oat but the Soylin and their Mixed Grain also have high levels of protein/good fats for bread.

You can use meat that isn't processed you know. Cold chicken, beef or prawns etc. falafel is nice in sanwiches. chapati and dahl?

Good point about the bread. You can blitz sunflower seeds and add to your bread flour.

Alas Morloth - I sensed some such trickery.

I had sandwiches spread sandwiches every day at school. Every day. I can hardly stand to look at the stuff now - although now I think of it.. could eat one right now.

The problem with cold meat is taht we never eat plain meat ever ourselves - it's too dry for me - we eat a lot of curries and soupy splodgy spicy food that dd won't touch. We never eat meat as just meat. Seems OTT to cook a hunk of meat just to make a couple of sandwiches - and it never slices thinly enough. Prawns are no so great after 3 warm hours ina lunchbox.

I have thought about felafel. I could live on dahl but dd won't touch it. It's amazing how totally unalike our tastes in food are.

I think the odd sliced meat or tuna sandwich will be around for a while yet.

'You can blitz sunflower seeds and add to your bread flour.'

Ah yes. Home-made bread. It's on my wish list with so many other things I will do when I finaly get a few extra hours added to the day