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Original poster

How beneficial would a few weeks of "total language immersion" be for a 6/7yo?

41 replies

castille · 19/06/2008 11:41

A French friend, who is very concerned that her children should grow up speaking good English, is considering sending her nearly 7yo to stay with friends in the UK for a few weeks. She would live with them and go to school for that time.

We were talking about it and I said I thought that in that time she would learn plenty of playground English and learn to get by in domestic situations. But I'm not sure how much of it she would remember long-term.

Would she pick up and hold on to a good accent, for example?

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RuthChan · 19/06/2008 12:05

For children to learn language the most important things are regular use (ideally daily) and continuation in the long term.
Children (especially the under 10s) learn at an astonishing rate, but they forget equally quickly.

As an example, I have a friend with a 7 year old son. They lived in the UK from the time he was 1 year old. He went to school in the UK and spoke English on a daily basis, making him completely fluent.
They returned to Japan in January of this year.
He has already forgotten pretty much his entire English language and can no longer hold a conversation with me without reverting to Japanese or asking his mum for help.
He maintains his accent, but has lost his vocabulary and grammar already.
This is by no means an isolated case. I have known many returnees who lost their English equally soon after returning to an non-English environment.

I think immersion is a great idea for children, but the parents must be aware that it is a real struggle to keep what has been learned after returning home. Weekly lessons for example are not enough.

getbackinyouryurtjimjams · 19/06/2008 12:10

RuthChan - can I hijack.

Do you know anything online that would be easy to dip in and out of that would teach Japanese. I lived there for a year many years ago, have had lessons on and off since, but would really like to refresh it and improve it. But have little time and want it to be fun!

castille I wonder whether it would benefit by making it easier to remember the 'flow' of English when she learns it properly. If she enjoyed the trip I suppose it would be a good cultural exchange anyway.

ingles2 · 19/06/2008 12:15

we go to France for a month every year... at end of the month ds2 particularly is speaking great french...good accent, grammatically good...totally forgotten by the next year despite french lessons...

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Bucharest · 19/06/2008 12:22

It would be useful nonetheless, even if she forgets it all in a fortnight, as it will hopefully have given her a positive experience of the life in the country IYSWIM? Without that positive attitude, a L2 can rarely be learned efficiently. (my degree is French and Spanish, hated my time in France= my French is useless)

stealthsquiggle · 19/06/2008 12:30

My DB did a 6 month either way exchange aged 8/9 through En Famille

His French is perfect still and his accent is perfect for the region he went to - it is in fact so strong that other French people assume that is where he is from and it never occurs to them that he is not French at all - whereas they assume I must be Dutch because I am clearly foreign but everyone knows that the English can't speak any other languages

Original poster
castille · 19/06/2008 12:34

Yes, RuthChan, my girls (re)learnt French in a term when we moved back here, and their English has suffered a bit from lack of use despite me insisting on it at home, so they have a tutor, but even so it's not as strong as their French.

Ingles - shame that the French lessons don't help - you'd think they'd at least maintain what he'd learnt. Odd that he loses his accent too - I'd have thought that at least the accent, and a "feel" for the language would remain?

Bucharest - I wondered about the main benefit being cultural rather than linguistic, though that isn't what the parents have in mind...

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castille · 19/06/2008 12:38

Ah stealth - it worked for him then! That's pretty impressive - how did he keep it up so well?

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ingles2 · 19/06/2008 12:40

it's strange isn't it....he's a bit of a thespian though, a kind of chameleon, so he adjusts to other peoples accents, language etc
I think when he gets older (he's 7.1) he's going to be good at languages so I'm not too worried

stealthsquiggle · 19/06/2008 12:40

Accent and feel should indeed remain, I would have thought. Maybe a month isn't quite long enough? By the end of 6 mths DB found it hard to speak English. He went back into standard school French (via 3 years in Japan when I don't think he spoke French at all!) and that was evidently enough to maintain his accent.

stealthsquiggle · 19/06/2008 12:44

Castille - he remained (and remains) in contact with his French 'brother' and they talk/email. He also did a stint working in France as a student which helped revive it, I think - and gave him what I am completely missing, which is the ability to swear in French!

I am not sure it would be much good if he was actually working in Paris though as it is a Bordeaux accent

francagoestohollywood · 19/06/2008 12:56

I think it would be useful nonetheless too.
We moved back to Italy in December and for various reasons decided not to send the dc to the English school here. Their English accent is still pretty good, but I notice that they are loosing their fluent English

Original poster
castille · 19/06/2008 13:12

I'll teach you some French swear words stealth

Franca - my girls (10 and 8) still have a "normal" English accent but after 4 years back here their vocabulary, grammar and overall fluency have suffered a bit. They have a tutor which helps but it's not enough

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francagoestohollywood · 19/06/2008 13:19

I need to find my dc a "tutor" as well, someone who came 2 or 3 times a week and teach them how to read in English etc. But I don't know how to find him...
I went to the British Council but they run courses for Italian children, and their English will never be as good as my dc's (not boasting, but obviously they aren't "beginners")

francagoestohollywood · 19/06/2008 13:20

him/her.

The English school was too expensive for us, too far, and too "posh"...

Fennel · 19/06/2008 13:23

Franca, you need to bring your dc back to the UK for a few weeks, that would make a huge difference

I have thought about this as I always wanted my children to be bilingual, but in practice, living in the UK, with parents who are native English speakers, it's too hard to organise. We do "intercambio" holidays with my friend in Spain, his children go to a bilingual school and their English gets exponentially better every time we see them (about once a year) but my dds only learn Spanish during the week or two a year we spend with them. It's nowhere near enough.

francagoestohollywood · 19/06/2008 13:32

I know, I know! End of August, maybe?

Original poster
castille · 19/06/2008 13:34

Franca - I advertised on a website for expats (and got a gem, she's fab). Try that if there is one, and/or pin up an ad for an exchange student at the nearest university

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francagoestohollywood · 19/06/2008 13:50

good idea the website!

Fennel · 19/06/2008 13:54

Franca, also advertise at the language schools. When I was a tefl teacher abroad I used to go to homes to do "lessons" with small children (with pushy parents who wanted their children to be crammed for selective schools, but that's by the by, I know you are not like that).

francagoestohollywood · 19/06/2008 14:02

Yes, it's a good idea, but wouldn't the school mind? they seem so bloody uptight here in Italy .
I must confess I do have some pushy parents fantasies, where they win a place to study medicine/politics/literature etc at harvard ... .

must go, have the leavers party at the dc's nursery school.

Anna8888 · 19/06/2008 14:06

I think a few weeks of total language immersion would only be beneficial to a 6/7 year old who was going to hear/speak/study the language in question regularly throughout the year.

It might be rather traumatic, however, for a 6/7 year old to find himself in a foreign country, in a family he doesn't know well, going to school and trying to communicate in an unknown language.

Not sure I'd ask this much of my own children. In fact, thinking about it, I know I wouldn't.

Original poster
castille · 19/06/2008 14:07

Who doesn't, franca?! Mine are going to be a leading medical specialist, a prima ballerina and the new Jonny Wilkinson.

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Fennel · 19/06/2008 14:13

The 6yo I'm mainly thinking of, he went to a bilingual school, wasn't keeping up (it was in Guatemala, his family spoke arabic at home so he had to speak 3 languages) so I came for an hour a day to do extra English with him. It couldn't be play based, his parents wanted it at a desk, proper learning. Poor little boy was so tired. But his English improved (due to my expert tuition ) and his parents wanted to up the lessons to 2 hours every day, after a fairly rigorous school day in his 3rd language. Poor child. I refused the 2nd hour a day.

Original poster
castille · 19/06/2008 14:14

Anna - I must admit my first thought was for how she would cope with 2 months away from home and family. But my friend says her daughter is very keen...

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Anna8888 · 19/06/2008 14:21

Hmm. I know far too many French parents in my generation (40s) who were so traumatised by their own experiences of language exchanges etc in England and Germany as teenagers that they refuse to send their own children.

Sounds a bit much to me. But I suppose some children can cope.