Prepared to be flamed 😫

[DriveVerySlowlyPastNumber23IWantThemToSeeMyHat]

Since Christmas, DD's behaviour has been awful. Hitting, spitting, throwing things, shouting, screaming. This is when she is told 'no'.
As soon as anything physical happens, she's immediately put on the bottom step but she usually continues.
She then gets carried upto her bedroom bit refuses to stay in there.
We've tried praising all of the positives, taking toys and screen time away but recently, both myself and DH have shouted because nothing else is working.

I know the general rule on MN is to not shout but everything else has failed. Both neighbours have said its fine but I'm genuinely worried a passer by will walk by and think she's getting hurt or something.

Any tips? 😫

She is 4.5

Has she started school? Do you know how she is there?

Hey! She has and is fine there. I've spoken to them about her behaviour and they were shocked 😔

She’s not being naughty. She’s communicating something with this behaviour…she sounds distressed, overwhelmed.

Does it happen at any particular time, eg when she’s tired? After school?

It could be school is too much for her at the moment?

Shouting at her won’t help. It’ll make things worse. If you could work out what’s wrong it would help. I know it’s difficult.

Hi Op is your concern that because you are shouting so loudly or aggressively a passer by will think she is being hurt by you or her dad?

Oof. 4.5 can be a very tricky age, I’m going through a similar time with my boy now. Time outs don’t work, have you heard of time in? You just sit with them basically while they thrash it out, instead of leaving them alone, but say you’ll talk to them properly only when they’ve calmed down etc etc. But it’s no magic fix, there isn’t one. You have to ride out the phase, and try not to lose your head basically.

If you have tried all those things. You aren't giving any of them a chance to work. It takes time. Nothing will change anything overnight.

Can you try changing your thinking and saying yes more often? Of offering alternatives, explaining a bit more?Sometimes we automatically say 'no' when what they want could be accommodated if we weren't being so rigid.

Has anything changed at home? New baby? Pregnant?

Id definitely consider the possibility of SEN. Kids are good at 'masking' at school, but need to let it out in their safe space (home).
NT kids can be a bit like this too, it takes a lot of effort to be 'good' all day.

if it were me I'd make every effort for home to be as unchallenging as possible for her. Remove as many pressure points as possible (give her choices, but limit options). Lots of cuddles & calming activities. If you pick her up from school can you go to the park for a run around (or swim with the current weather!! 😵‍💫)

If your daughter’s behaviour is that awful, then I don’t think you’re awful shouting at her. At her age she is old enough to know that hitting, spitting and throwing things are wrong.

Does your shouting help her to stop shouting and realise calmness is a good approach?

does it perhaps scare her into stopping?

Yes I do have a couple of tips, the first one is do this simple progress checker.

Then order a copy of 10 Days to a less defiant child.

Let us know if the progress checker says she needs some me support and we can advice you on the next steps

Was she like this before she went back to school after the holiday?

Ok, tbh this sounds fairly normal then. It’s probably all just a bit much, being good all day and then she’s tired. Some of the other posters have given good advice already.
‘this too will pass’ - hang in there, try to stay calm and firm. Shouting back is unlikely to be effective, but forgive yourself if you occasionally get overwhelmed by exasperation.

Thanks everybody.

She's definitely not SEN. She went to nursery 3 days a week from 5.5 months old and nothing was ever brought up there. Same with school. Friends are also knowledgeable about SEN through their work and see no concerns either.

The only thing that has changed is DH has started a new job but she sees him more now.

Our walls are paper thin and we live on a very busy road with people always walking past. My worry is when she's screaming because she hasn't got her own way, I'd hate for passerbys to think she was being hurt.

I used to have a jar. It started full of sweeties. Every time ds was naughty, one would be removed.
just a slightly different take on giving things like stickers etc

good luck!

How does the jar work? Did he have access at all times or did he earn it?

Stop the naughty step altogether,it doesn't help.focus on praising all the good times notice then and speak them,'wow your playing so nicely,wow your do peaceful we can chat. Etc etc',give attention when good behaviour is happening.when bad behaviour happens it's time for time in,call her to you sternly and sit down together,discuss what's wrong,help her solve then problem herself -'oh were you kicking around because you you thought mummy wasn't listening to you,well that just have been annoying. I get annoyed when people don't listen to me thing is,we have to cook tea,do you want to chat to me while I cook tea, come on,sit up here,we need to chat about ponies(or whatever) anyway.no need to make a battle,make things fun.say things like,I love to hear about your day etc.

No acces to the jar at all!!
we put it up high so he could see it and could also see us remove one when he was naughty. He didn’t like that!!
he didn’t have to earn it. It just started full on a Monday and he got the sweets that were left in it at the weekend
it worked really well!

Keep an open mind on the SEND.

What is happening before the poor behaviour starts at home? Is she tired, hungry, lots of demands, too many choices, transitions?

What does her day look like? What time is she getting up and going to bed? Does she get enough exercise?

Also, the weather changed after Christmas. Is she getting too cold on the way home from school?

Or maybe not getting as much outdoors play, either in school breaks or at weekends?

Literally being told 'no' 🙈