Three year old WILL NOT go to bed. I am at my wits end. Please help

[Helppleaseeee]

I am at the end of my tether. She will not go to sleep.
i have tried everything.
Ive tried quiet time before bed.
I’ve tried walking her back to her room again and again but she just resists and screams and screams.
she cries.
every excuse going to not to her bed. I need toilet, I want to ask you something, there’s monsters in my room, there’s monsters in your room. I’m hungry (she’s not hungry)
it worked for a bit if I let her go in my bed. Now that doesn’t work.
doesnt work if I sleep in the bed with her or stay in the room.
singkng her to sleep doesn’t work.
cry it out doesn’t work it just makes her scream more.
no screen time and reading books before bed - doesn’t work
bath before bed / no difference.

i work full time. I literally go to work then spend all evening with my child. I’m starting to cry at work because I’m drained.
my husband works shifts so is barely here. I have no life to myself.
I want her to just go to sleep.

the only way she will go to sleep atm is if I let her lie on the sofa and she will fall asleep on there.

she’s gone from a chilled two year old that sleeps to a three year old who is demanding, won’t sleep and wants her own way.

what am I doing wrong? She had such extreme reactions I imagine my neighbours hate me.
if I try to be firm she just cries and gets hysterical.

im fucking broken. My only downtime is being at work which is fucking stressful. I’m really struggling. I just want to relax for an hour in the evening by myself without going to battle about brushing teeth and bedtime. Why does she hate sleep?

My youngest used to insist on going to sleep in my bed and then I’d move her later, she still does sometimes. Takes about 5 mins to fall asleep in my bed, if it’s her bed and she doesn’t want to fall asleep it’s 2 hours. They all sleep in their own beds eventually so I just move her

Does she not go to sleep if you stay with her? I do bath, story with a nightlight on, then lights off and I play lullabies on my phone and read lying next to her while she goes to sleep, usually within 15 mins. I've never left any of my kids in bed awake until they were old enough to tell me they'd prefer to read by themselves.

What time do you want her to go to sleep OP?

My 3.5 year old is a 9 pm kid most of the time, no routine will get him to sleep much sooner. If he does go to sleep 7 or earlier I'm up all night reassuring him back to sleep. So I aim for 8pm but more often than not he sleeps around 9pm or 10pm.

Mine is very much like yours. Constantly putting him back to bed would just turn into a game for him and wind him more up. So if he really doesn't want to go to bed he needs to play quietly and he can only come and find me if he is ready for bed.

We also have the three picture book rule. Only three picture books before bed after that I'll only read a non picture book to him. So things like Winnie the Pooh, wizard of Oz, the hobbit. This works well because he cuddles up to me with a toy and just listens to my voice as he is playing. It takes about 10 to 15 min of reading like this for him to fall asleep.

I find fighting to get him to bed more exhausting than letting him have a late bedtime. He wakes at 6am on nursery days, 7am on non nursery days. He is a happy, healthy and energetic boy during the day. Spends most days outside, also is in forest nursery like yours. He hardly ever throws any tantrums. So I don't see the late bedtime doing him any harm. Maybe for now accept this is what it is and find ways to get your me time with DD awake.

It’s really hard when they do this but some kids just don’t need as much sleep as others. My 5 year old doesn’t go to sleep until quite late, around 9.30pm. We do all the usual routine with her, taking her upstairs, getting ready, story book, even stroking her hair in bed but she will just get up again. Now she’s 5 she just plays in her room, reads books, draws and writes stories by herself until she’s ready to go to sleep. We’re pretty sure she has ADHD though (family history and lots of other traits).

Would a sticker chart help with this?

I think a stair gate keeping her in her bedroom would also help.

Is it dark and quiet enough in her room?

OP, do you have the money to pay a sleep consultant for a session? We had this problem with our boy at this age and I was recommended an amazing woman by another parent, who was like magic. I had to send her a form with all of our routines and timings on, then we had a Zoom chat and I implemented her strategies that evening. She was “on call” on WhatsApp for the first week giving me tips on what I tried, and by day 6 it was completely fixed! We have continued the same routine since then and my son is 5 and goes to bed on the dot every night! She was absolutely amazing and knew exactly what would work with my son - money well spent.

Does she nap still? I’m assuming not as you would have mentioned. I’d sit beside her bed until she goes to sleep- no conversation, just return her to bed every time she gets out. A very occasional shh it’s sleepy time when she keeps trying to talk to you. Shell hopefully learn to give up and go to sleep when she’s getting nothing back from you..

Same problem here. My 3.5yo insists on us sitting holding his hand or it triggers a 45 min tantrum if I refuse by which time I'm thinking it would've been faster just to agree. I'm actually quite happy to sit with him for 10-15 mins, that used to work fine, but now it's later and later. I sit there feeling increasingly resentful that I've spent ALL day caring for his, his sister's or others needs at work and I'm not even allowed an evening to chill. And then I'm not down doing my own relaxing until gone 9, and I find it so hard to go to bed and give up my precious free time. Here I am still MNing at nearly half 10...

Some useful tips here from PP which I think we need to seriously consider as our current situation is totally unsustainable.

What did this involve? Was it like sleep training where you gradually move further away from child? I've tried a version of it and every time we moved to that chair at end of bed he lost his mind sobbing and I felt so bad.

Perhaps she misses you when you're at work? Could you take a couple of days off and spend the time with her?

I was going to suggest this too. A week or so of being relaxed before trying a routine. And if she sleeps sooner on the sofa I might just let her sleep there then transfer her.

I did the super nanny thing. Had to be consistent for about a month but he didn’t then leave his room after bed time until he was about 10 so well worth the time investment. Get a book and a comfy chair and accept it’s going to take a lot of consistent behaviour from you.

In your position I would decide what you want the routine to be (teeth, story, bed etc - doesn’t need to be complicated) and then do a visual timetable to show her. Chat gpt is really helpful for doing this v quickly). Then print it out and stick it somewhere at her height. Explain what will happen from now on. And then stick to it. Good luck, this sounds really tough 💛

Exactly so. 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻

I wonder if she could be scared and then even the times you are there she just can’t switch off because she is worried about when you go and leave her. I have many childhood memories of being scared at night time alone in bed.
I personally agree with the suggestion to let her fall asleep on the sofa with you even just for a week or two to reset and then start trying again with going to bed

I read something a while ago about letting off steam at bedtime, not trying to calm down, quiet time etc. I think there's even a workout for kids bedtimes on YouTube.

Anyway, we did this l when it was apparent our 4 year wasn't ready for sleep. We just let him crack on with his energy and he quite often fell straight to sleep once he was in bed.

We also had a tonies phase and attempts to come down. Each one was met with a cuddle and a back to bed now. We just carried on with our evening. Promising to check on him worked too, when I would go up, he'd be asleep!

I think go the opposite way for a bit.

Let her stay up but you continue to have your evening. Make your evenings as quiet and dull as you can. OK darling, if you’re not tired that’s fine. It’s quiet time after 8pm though, so either bring a book or your colouring through while Mummy reads her book type thing.

And when you’re ready for bed, she doesn’t even have to go to sleep then but she does have to stay in her room and play/ read quietly (obviously make sure it’s safe for her to do so first)

Just completely take the battleground away for a week or two. See what you’re left with.

We have some very similar things going on in our house.

Reward charts made no difference, didn’t get tired of a quiet return to bed, could open a stair gate, wasn’t fussed about having a consequence for the behaviour, didn’t care if I stayed in the room or left the room…

I unfortunately don’t have any advice but wanted to say it is bloody tough, especially solo, when you are just craving some time to yourself.

Hang in there x

You could try asking her about bedtime when it's not bedtime if her language is at all up to it. Sometimes they can reveal things you don't know about like a specific fear or issue and sometimes you can even reason with them a bit (I need to have time to watch grown up telly or whatever). But don't try it at bedtime.

Well she is 3 years old if you let her sleep in your bed she will sleep then

DH took over bed time and did the elastic band style routine. Once he was outside their door he had a set exchange with them: 'Where's Daddy going to be?' they would reply 'In your bedroom'. Then he'd say 'And where are you going to be?' 'In our bedroom'.

Then he'd go and sit in our bedroom until they were asleep.

Tbh, the exchange continued. Despite the fact that he gradually went downstairs earlier and earlier. Then he went straight downstairs. But they enjoyed having the 'in my bedroom' exchange so he still said it.

Exhausting times, it does pass, but it's so difficult. Ignore after bedtime routine, put back to bed no chats. As above, if you can tell them they don't have to sleep, but they do have to stay in their room/upstairs hall. You need sleep , tell them that, also you love them but your tired and have work in the morning. They won't care but it reinforcing boundaries, your human and deserves things, day time is all about them, nights are for adults to do what they want. Good luck

We used to do bath, milk, little bedtime snack, teeth, a couple of stories and songs and then lights low but we did stay with them in their rooms until they were asleep. If they couldn't settle DH would read them one of his old university textbooks without the usual 'story voices' and that used to work pretty well! They were worse if one of us was out a lot that day so maybe it's a way of wanting to spend more time with you. If that means sleeping at the same time then might that be worth a try?

Put her bed, then go to bed yourself. if she gets up tell her to go back to bed whilst you stay in bed. Take a drink, book, whatever, make that your chill time. If not bed then have a bath. Make yourself unavailable.

Make her bedroom somewhere she wants to be at night. Put on audio books or relaxing music in her room, you can get light projectors that will put pictures or stars etc on her ceiling and walls. Get her some pillow spray and let her spritz her pillow before getting into bed.

all of these things will make her excited for bedtime routine and make her want to be in her room.

If all else fails tell her that she doesn’t need to be in bed asleep but she does have to be in her bedroom. Have books or simple toys on the floor and Leave her to it and she’ll knacker herself out.