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4 year olds deteriorating behaviour PLEASE HELP

23 replies

Allme501 · 19/01/2025 20:40

We are currently being with our 4 year old boy's gradually deteriorating behaviour (back chat, defiance, completely ignoring us, shouting and even growling!). I fully appreciate that some of this comes with age and may even be his own personality but some aspects of his behaviour are frankly unacceptable.
It appears to be only happening with us as opposed to at school etc...
We naturally gravitate towards the gentle parenting way of things to a degree but we are finding that he is pushing our buttons so much that we are snapping and undermining the whole process.
We really want to learn how best to manage this to avoid making it worse (if we can) and my question is can anyone recommend any books or other resources which may have helped them deal with similar behaviour please x

OP posts:
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LittleBearPad · 19/01/2025 20:42

When you say gentle parenting, what do you mean?

Clear boundaries and expectations or ineffectual instructions?

GrandmotherStillLearning · 19/01/2025 20:45

Allme501 · 19/01/2025 20:40

We are currently being with our 4 year old boy's gradually deteriorating behaviour (back chat, defiance, completely ignoring us, shouting and even growling!). I fully appreciate that some of this comes with age and may even be his own personality but some aspects of his behaviour are frankly unacceptable.
It appears to be only happening with us as opposed to at school etc...
We naturally gravitate towards the gentle parenting way of things to a degree but we are finding that he is pushing our buttons so much that we are snapping and undermining the whole process.
We really want to learn how best to manage this to avoid making it worse (if we can) and my question is can anyone recommend any books or other resources which may have helped them deal with similar behaviour please x

Whilst 4 is a tender age. Any mixed signals will create confusion and chaos.
A no is a no and said once and no amount of screaming back down amd a yes is a yes even if your tired.
Boundaries and age appropriate repercussions done in love.

Ie Bob I really want to go to the park but because you threw that plate we are not going.
Let's try again tomorrow ok as tomorrow is a new day.

Notgivenuphope · 19/01/2025 20:46

We naturally gravitate towards the gentle parenting way of things

Here’s your answer. Set some firm boundaries and be in charge.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about these subjects:

Allme501 · 19/01/2025 20:49

When I say gentle parenting I don't mean lazy boundary-less parenting, I mean clear calm parenting. We use things like time outs where at the end we sit calmly and discuss why he had a time out (99% of the time he is able to tell us exactly why) etc....

OP posts:
OldTinHat · 19/01/2025 20:54

Okay, so this is probably not going to go down well but...

You can't discuss with a 4yr old. They are guided, told, have a consequence.

You can't discussion with them because, well, they're 4!

Tell them. They do or they don't.

Allme501 · 20/01/2025 07:48

Sorry, just bumping in hopes that anyone can suggest some actual books or resources as per my original post. Thanks

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Pantheon · 20/01/2025 07:50

The most useful books/resources I've found are How to talk so kids will listen and Janet Lansbury

MinnieBalloon · 20/01/2025 07:55

Allme501 · 19/01/2025 20:49

When I say gentle parenting I don't mean lazy boundary-less parenting, I mean clear calm parenting. We use things like time outs where at the end we sit calmly and discuss why he had a time out (99% of the time he is able to tell us exactly why) etc....

Okay, well this tells me you don’t understand what gentle parenting is and are just using the term because you think it means calm parenting.

Time outs are heavily discouraged in gentle parenting, and its true name by the way is authoritative parenting. If you’re interested in parenting this way then you need to do some research on it.

Lyn348 · 20/01/2025 07:57

It doesn't sound like you need a book tbh, just that you need to stay calm and consistent and not take him pushing your buttons personally. Just keep calmly reiterating your point or if you feel yourself getting annoyed distract him with something else - no we can't go to the park because it's dark and rainy so lets play a game instead.

The more you engage with him, the more he will want to please you that so you continue to engage with him and the better his behaviour will be. You can then withdraw engagement (ie end the game or activity) if he is not behaving.

iwillfghhjjj · 20/01/2025 08:53

The explosive child has some good strategies. Also the high needs child.

I would aim to have consistent routines so he knows what to expect, lots of warning of change of routine. Set bed and meal times, screens etc.

Don't expect more of him than he is capable of. Manage his environment if you know he is going to struggle with something preempt it and manage the situation before it escalates.

Look for early signs of an issue and distract/move forward to avoid it. Offer alternatives so for example toy throwing- give him some cushions to throw.

Make a list of the things he struggles with and pick a couple of them to work on at a time. Really break them down so say hitting -talk about being kind as a general rule and kind hands, redirect if he is going to hit, something like offering a cushion to hit or a ball to squeeze. Praise times he doesn't hit. Discipline if he does but then immediately move on and keep trying.

Massively lower your expectations to avoid being constantly on at him. Loads of reward/praise for behaviours you want to see.

Have one consistent discipline, personally I quite like a time out, if he's doing an undesirable behaviour, you (or other adult) take him out of the room . No shouting or telling off just sit with him for a few minutes in the hall or similar. Do some calm breathing , limit communication but give him a hug if he needs . When he's more calm go back in the room and try again. What you are teaching him is to regulate himself.

Role model the behaviour you want, when you get cross that you getting overwhelmed. And you're a grown adult responsible for your own behaviour. We as adults fund it hard to manage our emotions/frustrations at times yet we expect children to do it.

Your role is to advocate for your child and try to ensure they can manage their environment. Teach them strategies for when they can't and show them safe/acceptable ways to express their emotions.

It will be an ongoing process which sometimes will go well and sometimes not. Try to be on the same page as the other adults in his life. Don't compare him to other 4 year olds and think he needs to be doing xyz because he's four. It's your job to look at what he needs to learn and figure out how to get him there.

Don't fall in to the trap of thinking well he can do it at school or grandparents so he's just playing up. It's far more likely that he's masking his struggles at school and letting them out at home because he feels safe to do so or he's more distracted/stimulated at school or the the structure works better for him.

iwillfghhjjj · 20/01/2025 08:55

Or and also the book you wish your parents had read is excellent

Allme501 · 20/01/2025 09:02

@MinnieBalloon
How is your comment the least bit helpful? Just negative and condescending. Please don't bother to comment on my posts again. Thank you.

OP posts:
iwillfghhjjj · 20/01/2025 09:03

Oh and resources-

Sand timer or alexia can be useful for time warning
A picture chart of the daily time table
Sensory toys- fidgets may help distract him
Age appropriate books about emotions
Yoga and meditation- calm app has some great child friendly meditations. And cosmic yoga is fab on you tube
Twinkle has some good resources for understanding emotions or you could buy some feelings pictures (real faces are better) You could do a posting activity where you identify emotions on the cards and post them in a letter box- shoe box decorated with a slit in it.

Also one last thing make a list of triggers for his behaviours and look at his you can avoid/manage them .
Create an emotional toolbox for him to use when he is struggling to regulate his emotions- this could be a special book to read, a favourite tv show or computer game. A toy to cuddle or a sensory den. A snack. As he gets older (if needed) he could create his own toolbox but while he's young I would just facilitate it.

Happyinarcon · 20/01/2025 09:07

There will be some stressful unpleasant stuff going on at school and he doesn’t feel safe there. So he brings all his emotions home and vents on you guys

Allme501 · 20/01/2025 09:38

Happyinarcon · 20/01/2025 09:07

There will be some stressful unpleasant stuff going on at school and he doesn’t feel safe there. So he brings all his emotions home and vents on you guys

I don't think it's that. He actually loves school and ask to go on the day he's not there.

OP posts:
MummaMummaJumma · 20/01/2025 09:58

@iwillfghhjjj makes some good suggestions. I second the timer to help with transitions.

OP, fwiw I’m going through a similar experience with my (just turned) 4 year old boy. I’m with you and I’m no expert, but some things that make the days a little easier are

transitional objects - for example if the timers gone off and it’s the end of screen time, I’ll have his favourite book ready and guide him towards that

Relating - telling him stories of when I was a child and feeling to similar to him. He loves this for some reason, I also have a pic of me so he can see I was once small too

Books about emotion to read to him - OP, I’ve read so many books and although they are very good at explaining child brain development (Dan Siegel - no drama discipline is a good one), I find kids books about emotions far more useful. We have ‘sheep is scared’ ‘alligator is angry’ etc.

We have good weeks and we have bad weeks. My main piece of advice is be really gentle with yourself because it’s tough. My first was the complete opposite, so calm and chilled. When other parents would share stories about their kids tantrums, it was a foreign concept to me. Until my son came along 😂.

Just take the little wins and move forward during the bad days. You’re not alone, even though it may feel that way sometimes. Good luck to us both!

Katherina198819 · 20/01/2025 12:27

Allme501 · 19/01/2025 20:49

When I say gentle parenting I don't mean lazy boundary-less parenting, I mean clear calm parenting. We use things like time outs where at the end we sit calmly and discuss why he had a time out (99% of the time he is able to tell us exactly why) etc....

I never really understood "calm" parenting.

How they supposed to understand and learn to control they emotions if they don't see how the parents do it?
I'm not saying you should be screaming at them, but anger and frustration are complitely normal emotions that they won't learn to control unless you help them.

He is propably feel "patronised " by the calm approach. I know I would be!

Stop explaining. He is 4. He knows everything! He just testing you and pushing boundaries to see what he can get away with. Complitely normal.
Be firm, say no, have consequences.

Theextraordinaryisintheordinary · 20/01/2025 12:31

Praise him where you can for even the smallest of positives. Talk about him being wonderful to others so he can hear you. When you’re lying in bed together on an evening tell him the good things he did.

MinnieBalloon · 20/01/2025 12:35

Allme501 · 20/01/2025 09:02

@MinnieBalloon
How is your comment the least bit helpful? Just negative and condescending. Please don't bother to comment on my posts again. Thank you.

It is helpful because you are saying you are gentle parenting when you aren’t and don’t understand it, so if you actually want to be a gentle parent then you need to do some research on it.

Parenting this way will actually help your child, especially in your current predicament, as long as you follow the ethos.

RosesAndHellebores · 20/01/2025 12:40

If your child is doing OK at school nursery, and I am assuming he is in reception, imagine him as a bottle of pop. All day he is being good, hearing new things, seeing new things, doing new things, in a busy environment where he sees others behave well and badly and observes the teacher being assertive.

That bottle of pop has been shaken up all day and when he comes home to his safe place, where he is loved unconditionally, it all spills out when the lid comes off.

Keep your expectations clear, give him space to decompress and be kind. If he is good at school it's a sign of a good child who is loved and feels safe at home.

The export model is fine. You are great parents. He needs time, you need patience. He might also need a quick snack as soon as he gets home, in a quiet space having a bit of chill.

SuperMaybe · 20/01/2025 12:44

Every kid is different but mine responded well to very clear and calm parenting. I never shouted at them. It's not in my nature and I don't think it works.

I did a warning then a time out or a loss of screen time privilidges. Then I sometimes did a quick short chat. I didn't let punishments drag on.
I also did a lot of role play chats. I'd ask them how they could handle different situations, how things would affect other people etc.

The main reason I think it worked with my kids is that they loved their screen time so a threat that they would loose it worked a treat.
I was very strict on screen time but they were able to earn more time. I even let them earn back screen time if they lost it. I was (almost) never lazy with discipline though even if it was annoying for me.

And no, it wasn't always perfect but I think it was pretty good. I was lucky that my kids had the right temperament to match my parenting. We are all calm people and don't have bad tempers. You have to parent the kid you have though.

My 4 kids are adults now and all lovely and happy people.

BusyExpert · 20/01/2025 12:53

I have a friend, a school teacher, who always maintained that the child she was always really worried about was the one that had behavioural problems at school but his parents said that he was well behaved at home, This is because if the have problems they may only manifest in the place that it is safest to do so.

My son was well behaved at school and would be very difficult at home. A complete demon when he came in from school. It turned out that he has dyspraxia and is highly intelligent. He was bored stiff at school and angry because they did not do the things he liked to do and talk about, he hated ball games and team sports, ad did not want to engage in the things that most children of his age did. But being a well raised little boy his behaviour was contained until he came home and his mother got it in the neck.

it might be worth questioning the school about what s happening during the day.

Rkp1991 · 08/01/2026 07:35

Allme501 · 19/01/2025 20:40

We are currently being with our 4 year old boy's gradually deteriorating behaviour (back chat, defiance, completely ignoring us, shouting and even growling!). I fully appreciate that some of this comes with age and may even be his own personality but some aspects of his behaviour are frankly unacceptable.
It appears to be only happening with us as opposed to at school etc...
We naturally gravitate towards the gentle parenting way of things to a degree but we are finding that he is pushing our buttons so much that we are snapping and undermining the whole process.
We really want to learn how best to manage this to avoid making it worse (if we can) and my question is can anyone recommend any books or other resources which may have helped them deal with similar behaviour please x

Hello! This is like reading my own post! As you’re a year on, would it be possible to let me know if it passed for you? Was it a phase and did you do anything different to help things? Thanks so much!

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