Are there different levels of screen time 'badness'?

[SerendipityJanet]

Accepting that there's a strong case for absolutely no screen time, are there differing levels for how bad it is based on content?

From what I've read, concerns are primarily around colourful images, fast-paced animation etc

I ask because DS is obsessed with watching trains on YouTube on the TV. He likes it on in the background mostly while he plays, or when I'm prepping his breakfast. It's literally video compilations of trains chugging along. No frills!

Are the 'dangers' (for want of a better word) the same as if he had cartoons on?

He's 20 months if that makes a difference. I'm sure it does.

I have no evidence for this but my theory is that screen time is largely seen as ‘bad’ because if a baby is in front of a screen they may not be interacting with their parents or playing with real things all of which is so important for communication and physical development. So it’s the sedentary screen time that is the issue. I think like everything it’s a moderation point and so long as you’re not plonking baby in front of a screen for hours on end and not communicating or interacting with them I really don’t see it being an issue. My mum swears I was hooked on corrie as a baby as her and my dad were both obsessed, it did me no harm 🤪

I like to think the same! But I've seen it said on so many threads that there's scientific evidence about how it over stimulates young children and can cause all kinds of issues in the future. So hard to know what the right thing is!

My take on it is everything in moderation. Screens are part of our world.

My 4 year old doesn't know how to use my phone and has never seen an ipad. TV is the only screen he uses and that's limited to set times and I'm picky with what he watches. He went through a stage of just watching steam trains too!

I think it becomes harmful when screens are 'used' rather than it being part of an active and varied life. For example, using a screen while the child is in a pushchair or trolley, instead of interacting with the world. Or at meal times. (I'm not talking about kids with additional needs here, but rather parents who use screens as an everyday parenting crutch).

But I'm not going to worry about my child watching some tv while I have a break too. Or at 6am when I can't function!

I saw a comment the other day, pompously pointing out that our previous generations didn't have screens to fall back on so we don't need them either. I bet most of those previous generations would have snapped your hand off for a bit of a break courtesy of paw patrol.

Yes there are different levels - so for example engaging with someone else via screen like talking to a grandparent on FaceTime is the “best” if you will and passive consumption is the most problematic. The type of content matters to - do something slower paced and pro social like Bluey is better than fast paced like cocomelon. YouTube isn’t great as it impacts their attention span - it’s not recommended for under 13s I believe? Might be slightly off with that but really not for babies or young kids! Essentially under two is not recommended at al but after that limit it and think about the content. A rough guide is if it’s created for profit, they will try suck your kids in to keep watching and aren’t too careful about the impact eg cocomelon, peppa pig etc. Some things developed by bbc etc are better. Real people, no flashing colours, slower paced are some key things to look at.

I think if they're struggling to pick up language then having something on in the background can be "bad".

But if he's developing fine, and he's doing other things at the same time it seems fine to me 🤷‍♀️

My daughter is absolutely glued to the TV whenever it's on so I can't judge

Your son is maybe a bit young for it yet, bit my 4yo loves Cbeebies pantos, ballet and Shakespeare 😂

I feel like at least she's getting some culture

I’m a mom who always has the TV on—it’s my background noise. My kids have grown up with this. Nursery rhymes played daily in our house since they were babies. Now they’re 8 and 5 years old. Both started reading at 3, and my 8-year-old is gifted and excels in school. We’ve never had any issues, and surprisingly, they’re not even interested in TV anymore. Even when it’s on, they hardly glance at it.

On the other hand, my friend married a “posh Oxford man” who has strictly banned screen time for their kids since birth. Yet every time their children come over to my house, their eyes are glued to YouTube on my TV. They barely play with toys or interact with my kids. I even installed a mini playground in my backyard, but they don’t touch it—they just sit in front of the TV the entire time.

In my opinion, screen time isn’t inherently bad. Of course, if your child is still a baby and you rely on YouTube without any interaction, it can have negative effects. But completely depriving kids of screen time can also backfire, making them crave it even more and fixate on the TV every chance they get.

I always had the TV when mine were growing up. DS2 in particular was addicted to cartoons. He is 20, very high achiever, career lined up in finance. DD also academically brilliant (all 9’s at GCSE. I never restricted screen time or phone use, both very self motivated. None had a tablet before 8/9 as they weren’t as popular then, phone at 11.

There are some ‘rules’ which experts recommend following for a better use of screens with toddlers. The ones I remember off the top of my head are as follows:

1. slow paced story lines. Things where the picture changes all the time or it’s a fast paced, action-packed storyline are addictive and bad for attention spans. Some of the shows people recommend are Puffin Rock, Tumbleleaf and Trash Truck. I’m not sure how the train videos would fit in with that but you can assess for yourself if they’re gentle / slow paced enough!
2. Its better to sit and watch the show with your child as a social activity where you can interact with them about it than to leave them to watch it while you do other things
3. it shouldn’t be on in the background while they eat or play, but should be a sole defined activity for a specific period of time then stopped
4. the child shouldn’t be able to flick between different shows or videos, it should be one show from start to finish
5. the bigger and more static the screen the better. TVs are better than iPads, iPads better than phones. The worst is a child watching something like YouTube on a phone or iPad and switching to a new video any time they get bored.

Its not always possible to follow all of the rules all of the time but they’re a good basic framework for managing screentime.

I agree with this

I and most of my peers watched more telly as babies than is advisable today (born late 90s)

My grandmothers' stories of parenting might be screen-free, but what was normal back then would absolutely be seen as neglect today. I really don't think it was some golden age of parenting!

Is putting your child in front of the TV at 6am when you can't function not using it as a parenting crutch?

No judgement - I do the same. But I would describe it a parenting crutch tbh

@DuckDuckPenguin funnily enough after I posted I thought the same! My brain was a bit tired last night. What I meant was, the screen usage which is used constantly as default parenting is probably not healthy (ie oh we're in a supermarket, whip out you tube on yhe phone) whereas using tv as a set time ie early morning is probably ok.

I don't know if I'm making much sense but hopefully you know what I mean!

i definitely think everything in moderation and the situation is relevant too. We try not to give an iPad if we go for a meal somewhere but if for eg we was at a meal with a large group (once in a blue moon) and you know you’ll be there a long time, I might let him watch something on the iPad.
If we’ve had a day out the park and to the shops or wherever, I don’t think watching a bit of TV as downtime is a bad thing. It’s more when you see little ones with a phone stuck to their hand watching cocomelon, just for the sake of it that I think is probably an issue.

My Nan said she used to put little ones in front of the washing machine and let them watch it spin as entertainment haha! Old school version of screen time.

One of the issues with screen use is children lolling about, not using their muscles to sit up properly and therefore not having the core strength to write when they get to school. I can't be bothered to look up sources but this seems to be pretty universally acknowledged within education. Interventions like Fun Fit are partially designed for helping such children.

I would say he's way way too young for screen time at 20m. My 22m old has none. Her 4y old brother has a little - usually so I can shower in peace or do half an hour's work:

Mine is nearly 3.

She goes to nursery 2 days a week and unless she wakes up very early (6/6.30), she has no tv those days. We read books and play before (if time allows) and after nursery

The other week days, she will only have tv during younger siblings nap (tho not all if it, as we bake when younger one is out of the way!). We're out at playgroups, softplay, farms or parks for several hours in the morning, and the supermarket, park or garden in the afternoon. So 45 mins here and there a few times a week is ok by me! YouTube programmes in French, ceebeebies or things like Zog, Stickman or BBC orchestra Gingerbread man on player. Definitely not Cocomelon etc!!