Maintenance

[isntfunny]

Just wanting some help. CMS have sent us a new maintenance payment calculation which is wildly wrong but they are saying they won't review it and if we disagree we have to take it to tribunal.

When we run our salary through the online calculator, what we are being told to pay is more than double this calculation. Even if I put in a salary of £60k after pension the payments are still higher than this. The salary we pay off is nowhere near £60k.

If people wouldn't mind sharing their salary and what they pay I would really appreciate it before we open up a tribunal. There is just no way we can afford to pay this.

Who is this we? It needs to be based on the paying parent's salary.

How much does the non resident parent earn? How many overnights does the non resident parent have the child in a calendar year?

Do you mean 'the salary you receive'? Not 'pay off'?

It will also depend on how many nights the children stay over with the non resident parent.

The only salary that is relevant is that of the non resident parent.

There is no 'us' and 'we' in the calculation.

Is there a lot of backdated payments that are being factored in?

The salary we pay off is nowhere near £60k
what does this mean exactly?

Is this a straightforward employed paying parent? Or is there self employment or a company structure involved?

The salary we pay off - does this mean the amount you allocate as salary from a business? It’s a bit unclear. Also who is the “we” - should just be one person paying.

I helped someone at work with their CMS calculations. In his case, there were significant arrears, because he'd job hopped a bit and not kept CMS up to date about how much he was earning etc.

Are you sure CMS has all the right information? Once we (finally) got through to someone who could look at the calculation, it all became clear and they could explain how they arrived at the number. You have to ask the first people to put you through though, and the first people who answer the phones can be hard work. My colleague wasn't getting any further because he kept losing his temper and being rude to them 🙄

Who’s we? Only the non-resident parent should be paying.

What does the salary you pay off mean? I’ve got to be honest and say this sounds a bit dodgy, like there are other incomes you haven’t disclosed.

It does sound like their own business and they pay themselves a very low amount. And the ex is going for a more accurate amount.

It isn't dodgy he is a civil servant 29k salary after pension. He is being told to pay £680 a month 2 kids no overnights. When I put it through the calculator it comes out at about £420-480 I think. Monthly payments of £680 are on a salary of over £60k when I put the details through.

CMS think he owes arrears because they didn't update the new salary despite us declaring it for over 18 months. He paid the correct amount he worked out by calculator anyway. He has proved this by bank statements. They haven't explained how they've come to that number and are now just saying he has to have a tribunal.

So has he been paying £420 or £480?? If he disputes arrears then tribunal is the only way to get it reassessed

CMS is calculated on gross salary before deductions so that could account for some of the difference

It's based on salary after pension. Based on their figures, he should have an 11% reduction on considered salary due to another child and then pay 16% of the gross income after pension before tax and insurance.

The figure he is being quoted is almost 30% of his gross income. It is almost 45% of the monthly take home pay after tax and insurance so it simply cannot be correct.

If something has been wrong for more than 18 months you'd have had one annual review at that time where they take figures from HMRC so I'm not sure how they could be wrong.

If you're sure they are then it has to be a tribunal unfortunately.

Where are you getting his pay from? You're not taking his P60 figure and deducting pension from that are you?

Yes, is that not right? Regardless on how I calculate his income, it is almost £25k less than what they must be putting through to reach the quoted figure.

CMS did this to my DH, essentially his ex told them he had income he didn’t which not only inflated his current payments but created a load of arrears - he had never not paid - his ex went to CMS saying she wanted more money for it to be “fair”.

Anyway. I had a look at the Child Maintenance Act 2008 and outlined in a letter the information they should be using to calculate the maintenance figure and demonstrated how in using the info they had, they’d acted outside their statutory powers. I sent the RIGHT information. I also made clear this was a complaint.

It still took 5 months and a case worker who admitted my letters had been ignored, opened but not added to a worklist. But we got there and the payments were reduced and arrears removed. It was very stressful exW was insistent she wanted the arrears which CMS said should be paid in two 4 figure sums over 2 months. She said she’d “pay it back” if it was wrong but she always says that and there’s no way she would have. It also put a lot of pressure on us as a household with two other children being asked to hand over the equivalent of 1.5 months salary because of some erroneous info exW supplied.

You need to press to speak with a decent case handler and make clear you follow their complaints procedure.

I hope you get it sorted, it sounds as though it might just be a faff and take some time.

However, it is rather shocking that a father who never has his child over night is only expected to pay 16% towards their upkeep just because they had another child afterwards. I'm quite amazed by how low that is.

Thank you. That's helpful.

He doesn't willingly not have them overnight but that is a whole other story. It doesn't impact the amount you pay until you have them more than 102 nights a year.

16% before tax and insurance is over 20% of take home pay which is quite a substantial amount.

An allowance of £7 per week per child is made for additional kids.

I would say send everything by the portal AND post.

Be prepared to wait on hold for a long time - over 90mins for me and insist on speaking to a case manager - they have people who just direct calls and try and deal with superficial enquiries - you need to get past them.

I had to tell them how they had errored in their own calculations because their case workers just do not understand when it becomes slightly complex.

I got a case worker who was actually engaged and slightly horrified who took ownership of our case. We’d been asked to front over £2k in the two months before Christmas because of their error and exW confusing things. I would have sent that case worker a box of chocolates if I could!

MN will think you are an awful person for not financially crippling yourselves at the whim of another person.

DH was annoyed as he had always paid fairly and for extras and CMS will NOT take that into account when deciding he’s in thousands worth of arrears. Its like you need to be on your guard all the time.

Also watch out because EVERY year they drop our two kids off the claim and every year I have to spend several hours on hold where I’m asked to send evidence they still exist. DH says what do you want a photo - surely the absence of a death is evidence enough. They’re an absolute farce. It takes so much of our time and energy and DH has always agreed with the principle of paying maintenance.

Rant Over good luck OP.

Are you on direct pay or collect and pay? If the latter, have you factored in collect and pay fees?

I believe (certainly where I work, which is also public sector) that the number on the p60 is the actual received salary after employee pension contributions, because that is my taxable pay . So you don’t deduct pension again from the p60 figure.