out of school play with muslim friends

[bluecow208]

we are not a muslim family (not an anything family really!) but some of DS's friends at school are. I am delighted about this as i deliberately chose a school with lots of different cultures.
He chose friends for his party (5th)and not one of them even replied let alone came. He was really disappointed.
After chatting with other friends he decided that X can't come to parties because 'he's a muslim'. "why can't muslims come to play mum?"
can anyone explain the ettiquete (or spell it)? I am choosing to believe that it is misunderstanding rather than rudeness but it sends mixed messages to my son when i tell him colour should not matter when choosing friends but he gets the opposite back

QueenMeabh - all gone ahead driven by the capital gain tax changes. Msg from Chris Woodhead was no changes - the school is currently profitable and sought after, so don't fix what isn't broken. Current owner's Webb Estate house, and passion for botox probably underlines profitability. Main downside is that Cognita will carry out inspections as well as ISI & Ofsted so always a risk that staff feel over-scrutinised or having to comply with inconsistant standards.

Given that owner would have wanted to sell (her dh is very ill, and there would be an extra 8% tax from yesterday), then either W Foundation or Cognita is best bet. W Foundation may have resulted in some bursaries though!

mimizan, agree that schools need to do more to encourage integration. Our PTA events (quiz nights, bingo nights, xmas parties etc) invariably involve alcohol which means that most muslims cant attend. When we suggested a 'womens only' event (to try and encourage the muslim mums to come and feel relaxed) it was vetoed by the head for discriminating against men. arrrrrghhhh!

I think it's not just about Muslim families, it's different cultural groups who maybe are unsure how to, or just don't feel the need to socialise outside their comfort zone.

My dc have been at inner-city Catholic schools where everyone was the same religion although from hugely diverse ethnic and social backgrounds. Kids and families did mix across ethnic and social differences, but you always knew that some ethnic groups would not reply to invites or come to parties -- the vietnamese families in particular tended to socialise only amongst themselves, as did some (but not all) of the Nigerian and Ghanaian kids. Conversely the chinese and hispanic families were much more likely to reply and attend, possibly because they didn't have such a large or cohesive ethnic community locally.

my friend has similar thing, her ds is one of a handful of white children in class (whitechapel) and while the school is really great, i remember she was really upset and angry the first time nobody came to her ds party.

perhaps we should all be a bit more aware of each other's customs. i am very ignorant on such matters, if muslims don't celebrate birthdays is there something else they do or are 'individual' events not done?

And I think muslims can be ok with birthdays -- we used to have muslim neighbours whose dd used to invite our dc to her house sometimes, including on her birthday.

Hi - just a thought - have you chatted to your childs teacher? I am a primary school teacher and would love to hear this sort of thing from parents - it is just the sort of thing that could cause minor issues in the playground etc and could easily be solved (well certainly made a bit easier for the chn to understand) with a couple of circletime sessions within the class! Once you explain things to children they are really receptive to things - just sometimes needs to be someone who isnt connected - also the teacher will know all the chn and can discuss all the different points of view etc.

Just an idea! good luck xx

I'm a Pakistani muslim and my family are religious and very involved with the mosque. We celebrate birthdays and have parties and my kids and my nephews and neices have always gone along to their friends parties. Both my sister in laws are from Pakistan and they have integrated in their local school community which is 80% white and their kids are not segregated at all, they have both learnt to speak perfect English. There is no reason why you can't go along to a party, pub, event where alcohol is served, you are just no allowed to drink it yourself. I worked in the city for 18 years - very heavy drinking and socialising culture, but I have remained tee-total and was respected for it.

There were the separate groups in the playground at my DD's school, but I went out of my way to talk to everyone and try to breakdown the groups - it has worked as now everyone in the playground mixes.

Riven Can you think of anything non-muslims could do to make the situation better?

There are Pakistani muslims at our school who are really open, even Mums who wear the niqab who let their DC mix after school.

As all white British people are very, very different so are muslims.

The food not being Halal is an issue. Also pork. Gelatine (made from pork) finds itself everywhere esp. in jelly. An issue for veggies too. Always makes me cross. I would never give my kids gelatine at home but have decided to allow it at parties because there's no way to avoid it.

ditto what mimizan said. all tips on 'making the first move' welcome.
big up yourself handbag queen. thanks for so many really interesting posts. looks like things are pretty similar everywhere......will keep chipping away even if i don't start a revolution!!!
Riven you don't have an easy life do you?!! sadly you've missed the party - though as a sit round and stroke insects do it would have been really wheelchair friendly and (apologies for sounding insensitive) would be great for ds to spend time with kids with disabilities as well as different cultures.

right off to hang out with my scantilly clad, promiscuous friends to eat pork and beef sausages, get drunk and blaspheme....better get kids tea ready first though!

We've ended up opting for hot meals to avoid some of the dietary issues at parties (so muslims can have fishfingers and chips or pizza and chips, with chicken nuggets and burgers also being on offer). Party bags tend to be an issue though as people often forget when it comes to sweets for example.

Birthdays are enthusiastically celebrated by Muslims. As someone else said, it might be the food they are wary of.

In any case, it's downright rude not to respond to an invitation. This has nothing to do with religion.

As for "white women were all whores and couldn't be muslim", I invite that dimwit to visit Western Turkey and repeat that sentence. I bet even money that the world will have one less dumb racist

Gertie, re PTA events so far we have focussed on family events and we haven't ventured into adult only events. Our aim is to get everybody together. If we sell the event to the children, then they are likely to put pressure on their parents to come along. Most parents want their DC to have fun.

At our last event parents brought food to share and it was so uplifting to see people carrying in trays of samosas, chickpea curries, rice and peas, chocolate cake, tiffin washed down with smoothies, tea and fruit juices. There were smiles all round, and not a drop of alcohol consumed.

brilliant!! will never look at the 'full gear' in the same way now I'm imagining agent provocateur undies!!.............though this has never been the case in my trips to the 'womens only' leisure centre!
If you're ever in south manchester t'would be a pleasure!

Riven - sorry you don't live near me would love to meet up, but you don't always need someone muslim to talk to about religious issues. One of my best friends is the wife of the minister of the local church and she is a great sounding board as there are so many similarities between religions.

It makes me so angry when you get idiots who give muslims a bad name - I'm just glad that people realise that you get undesirables in all groups of people!!

Firstly I want to say that I have friends of man different races, religions and backgrounds, and I always have done, I have always respected other people's customs and know I won't be eating bacon at my Jewish friends house and there won't be any wine at my muslim friends, that is fine with me, when we visit one of my muslim friends and his parents are there I wear a headscarf, it's their house its only polite, they send us christmas cards and understand if they come toa dinnerparty at ours we are likely to have a glass or two of wine, we are all cool with this.
But what I struggle to understand is if some people hate british culture so much and have views such as 'all white women are whores' then why do they chose to live here? I'm not trying to be provocative, I really do not understand the logic behind it...

i have friends of MANY different races...

Peapod, perhaps they have come here because life was intolerable in their country of origin?

However I do agree with you, in that if you go to another country to live then you should make an effort to live by their rules, traditions etc. The 'host' country should be allowed to continue with its own traditions etc.

Although 80% of the children at our school are Muslim the school is working hard to celebrate christian traditions because we are fundamentally a christian country. I believe this is the right way to go. I say this as an athiest.

For me the issue is that to be Muslim is fine, but as with other religions once it is used to oppress others due to their gender, sexual orientation etc, then it is not ok.

I had this issue when inviting two muslim girls to a party for my DD and was given to understand that I had caused offence by inviting them as birthdays were not to be celebrated. I was most embarassed as I hadn't a clue this might be the case.

Message withdrawn

DD has a muslim friend from school (age 11) they often arrange to play over and birthdays are celebrated. She's a very clever girl and lovely to have as a house guest, however,.....she's not allowed to do many of the things my DD takes for granted like playing in the fields or generally anythng unsupervised (not that my kids are wild btw ) I thought that was mostly as she's a very precious only child .. but maybe her religion had something to do with it too.

The only thing that used to really really wind me up at first was that I had to do all the collecting and drop offs as mum 'only knew how to drive to school and back'

Thankfully managed to overcome this by drawing a idiot proof map of how to get to our house

I don't think it's rule that's strictly followed tho'- I have been to at least one b'day party of a Muslim child- his parents were very religious, too.
I am afraid it's a case of many muslims not wanting to mix with people outside their culture- which is a real shame and a bit worrying.
I think that it's important to adapt to the culture around you