HELP!

[CelineK]

I am desperate. I have a 5 (yes FIVE!) year old daughter still using pullups for poos. Has been weeing on the toilet since about 3 1/2. Have tried on several occasions to wean her off of the dreaded things, but she holds the poo in - and she can do this for DAYS. She says she's scared to:

• use the toliet for poos
• do a big poo on the toilet
• do a poo sitting down

but can't tell me why. She says wants to try / be brave, but when it gets to the point where holding the poo in becomes really comfortable, she gets really distressed - even to the point where she was holding her wee in. At the end of another attempt today, she was so upset that I gave her a pair of knickers lined with toilet paper. It's so ridiculous that it's come to this. I feel like I've tried everything; health visitor, 'eric', promises of fantastic rewards (guinea pig, bike, Disneyland!). I can't see an end to it. Nothing seems to work.

Doctor? Maybe she has a real problem?

I really don't know. She's as regular as clockwork (mornings, hence no opportunity to toilet train because of the rush to get her to school / me to work), and everything seems normal. We had a health questionnaire sent home from school recently, and I mentioned my concerns. The school nurse wrote back and suggested I go to the drop-in clinic at the school at the end of this month. Maybe doctor will be the next step after that.

Does she think poo is dirty? Would it help for her to see you poo? Could she draw a picture of herself pooing? Act it out with dolls? I have read that some kids have a problem letting it "drop out", so perhaps sitting on the pot/loo with a nappy on and pooing into it at first - then gradually removing the nappy over a period of days?

Not an expert - still struggling to get 2.5 yr old trained !!

HTH.

No I don't think she thinks it's dirty - on the contrary, it's a favourite topic of conversation - and one she thinks is hilarious! We've tried the acting out with dolls - she even gives advice to the dolls who have the same issues as her! I do think the 'dropping out' might be an issue though: have suggested the sitting down with a pullup on idea already (to negative response), so might pursue....thank you and good luck with yours!

Would she use a potty? Maybe a potty lined with lots of toilet paper.

As she is 5, I would consider taking her to your GP and asking for a referal to a psychologist, who might have some great ideas..... but there is a really long waiting list so, the sooner you ask for a referal the better.

Yes have tried potty with paper option.
Am going to doctors this week, so will ask about referral. Thank you.

I did know a four year old boy who did this, so your daughter is not alone. I lost contact with his family,though, so don't know how they solved it... sorry.

If she is genuinely freaked out by pooing on the potty / loo, maybe you could try gradually moving her towards it. For example, initially encourage her to poo standing up by the door of the bathroom, then standing a meter away from the loo, then standing by the loo, then sitting on the loo with pull ups on, then sitting on the loo with nappy undone etc. You might have to take it very slowly though. Also, if she is withholding for a number of days, she may end up constipated which can then make it painful to poo. This can then turn into a vicious circle because the pain will make her more willing to withhold. If she is constipated, then I'm pretty sure you would need to see a doctor to help sort this out.

You have my sympathies. We battled pooey pants for months. Your situation sounds different to ours because my DD was not freaked out by pooing in the loo, nor was she constipated. She just would not do it, despite bribes of all kinds. However, I'll describe what worked for us because you may be able to use some of it. Once I started following this plan, my DD's behaviour changed almost instantaneously. This was what we did.

1. Absolutely no reminders about going to the loo. None, none, none. Very hard to do for me.
2. Casually drop into conversation every so often "Babies do poos in their nappies, but Mummy and Daddy do poos in the loo, and so do big girls like you. All your friends at nursery do poos in the loo" .

This resulted in the first poo in the loo for 3 or 4 months. I almost fell over backwards.

3. When there were accidents, then I waited for my DD to tell me. Sometimes I had to wait for up to 30 mins. The time got shorter and shorter.

4. After she had told me, I would say "Oh well just let me know when you want to get cleaned up" and then I walked away. This was to get around the marvellous game of running away from mummy. Sometimes I would have to wait for half an hour or so. I would occasionally remind her that if she wanted to get changed she should let me know.

5. When she said she wanted to get changed, I encouraged her to take off her trousers and pants by herself, as much as possible. I handed her some wipes and then let her clean herself up as much as possible. While she was doing this I turned away to clean up her pants, or would leave the room and just let her get on with it. When she was clean I would give her new clothes and tell her to put them on. I would not praise her for cleaning or getting dressed but I also wasn't nasty at all. It was all very matter of fact. Throughout I would aim for a zen like calm!

It was only through using this approach that I realised how much negative attention I had been giving DD for soiling. I had thought that I was being calm but actually I was so wound up by it all that my crossness came out through odd comments, gritted teeth and general tenseness.

That's a really good post, Neolara