Newborn witching hour

[Mushroo]

I have a 4 week old and so far she’s been very easy. However, about every 3 evenings she will be extremely fussy and grumpy between about 7pm and 11pm.

Incessant feeding, crying, the works. I think she gets overtired but she won’t sleep!

It’s causing me to be extremely uncomfortable as she’s feeding every 10 mins and I end up resorting to formula as my nipples just can’t handle it, i then feel guilty and upset for not being able to cope. I think the latch is ok but right boob in particular is uncomfortable.

Is it normal to be uncomfortable? I’m ok with ‘normal’ breastfeeding but just can’t handle the cluster feeds at all. I wouldn’t say I find it enjoyable though that people talk about.

Is there also something to help with the ‘witching hour?’. I hear people talk about bedtime routines, but you can’t leave a newborn in her own room? So she’s just in the living with us until we go to bed about 10/11. I then feed her to sleep and she normally settles ok in her next to me.

I just feel really overwhelmed and torn between ‘feed on demand’ ‘give her lots of cuddles’ and ‘we had a bedtime routine from day one’.

Please help!

Nobody has a routine with a teeny newborn surely?!

No advice really, other than just ride it out and the cluster feeding will be over soon. I used to cry when my baby cried because it hurt so much but breastfeeding is like breaking in a new pair of shoes: once you’ve suffered for it a little bit, it’ll all settle down! Have look at La Leche League in your local area on fb for help with the latch etc.

Multi mam nipple compresses helped a lot too.

It sounds like you’re doing an amazing job, well done (and congratulations on your baby!)

We had similar with my DS around this age (he's now 2). I don't think it lasted more than a couple of months but it was a massive pain at the time, as rather than going to sleep at 7, when we had hoped to put him to bed, he would get seriously fussy.

DH and I would take it in turns to put DS in a sling and do short walking laps around the neighbouring streets for 30 minutes or so and then DS would eventually fall asleep.

She needs to feed like that - it's about increasing your supply. You have to roll with it.

Think about routines in a few months.

The first six weeks are for survival. If you all get washed and dressed at somewhere near a normal time, you celebrate a win.

Don't even think about a routine until beyond 6w. If you follow her cues, she will fall into her own little pattern and you can take it from there if you need to tweak it.

It's hard enough with a newborn without making it unnecessarily harder

I used to put baby in sling and walk around the house which helped him. It’s awful at the time but I don’t remember it exceeding a few weeks. Be kind to yourself and also share the burden.

Thanks all, good to know I shouldn’t be in a routine yet.

I keep reading how ‘feed to sleep’ is bad but it’s the only thing that works! I guess normal when she’s so tiny and I should just stop reading tips on instagram reels!

any tips on how to stop a baby getting overtired when she refuses evening naps?

Lyndsey hookway on IG was a great resource for me (and still is now DD is 12 months!)

You'll get lots of opinions either way re feeding to sleep, but for me it's the easiest way to get babies to sleep, if you weren't feeding to sleep you'd likely be doing something else to get them to sleep anyway and it's strange that only feeding to sleep is seen negatively when it's very natural. If you need to make changes in the future about getting baby to sleep, you can cross that bridge when you come to it, just survive for now.

In terms of pain when BF - lather on the lansinoh! Can get HV advice if you feel latch isn't good. I also didn't 'enjoy' BF until about 5 months but since then it's been easy peasy.

Fussiness in the evening is normal. I used a shush pat method from Baby Wisperer Solves All Your Problems book. It's not about sleep training or routine training, it's about following your baby's cues. I think the method starts on page 181, too long to fully explain on Mumsnet. The second hand copy is available for a few pounds from Amazon. It really helped me with both my children. They were both exclusively breastfed

Re: feeding to sleep, my most helpful advice came from a friend of mine. For the first 3 months, you can do whatever it takes to get them to sleep. You won’t set up “bad habits” at this age. After 4 months, start thinking about what works for your family and investigate routines, training etc. if you want to. But don’t fret about bad habits at this stage. Seconding that it’s all about survival.

Sorry, disagree. I work with babies and some time ago I attended a conference which had a world renowned baby brain development expert guest aa a speaker (I forgot his name). Some babies aren't capable of learning routines until 8-9 months of age. Which is why routines should be avoided with babies

Note that I said “investigate”, not “get your baby into a routine” or “sleep train at 4m”. I know this is a contentious topic and I didn’t intend to start a debate on when to start routines, other than “not now”. Every baby & family is different and I don’t have any skin in the game either way.

My point was that the OP said she was reading about feeding to sleep being bad, presumably because it sets up bad habits. Her baby is only 4 weeks, so the point I was trying to make is that she doesn’t need to worry about that right now, just do what’s needed to get baby to sleep. To encourage her to go easy on herself and do what works for her and her tiny baby, not worry that she’s doing it all wrong and creating a rod for her own back at this stage.

Congratulations on your baby OP! Hang on in there, hope it gets better soon.

Absolutely agree with everything. 3 month olds do not have sleep habits, so at 4 weeks feel free to do whatever it takes to get the baby to sleep!

This is a pretty brutal stage for your because you're probably still building up your supply.

Invest in a sling. My son went from screaming in newborn to fast asleep within 5 minutes. Apart from that, just cuddles until the screaming stops. For us the witching hour disappeared between 5-6 weeks, so it doesn't last forever! Baby doesn't know how to communicate needs and feelings, but having Mummy close is the best thing you can do for them.