Please can you help me manage my 3.5 year old behaviour??

[81scribbler]

My DS is 3.5 and seems to be going through a phase (I hope) where his behaviour is quite a challenge to manage. For context he's at nursery Mon-Thurs with Fridays at home with me or DH. Generally he's a very happy, lively, confident, sweet, funny boy with some sensitivity. In particular the challenge is around transitions, such as going to nursery, drop-off at nursery, nursery pick up, going up to bath, getting dressed etc.

He says he dislikes his nursery (this started when he moved up to preschool room where the ratio of staff means less 1-1 attention) and never wants to go in although I'm confident he does enjoy the days there as I see photos, get feedback and have even seen him enjoying himself when he didn't know I could see him. He also likes most of the carers there and has friends. Drop off and pick up have been absolutely awful though (crying, clinging to me at drop-off or throwing things at pick up- doesn't want to go in and doesn't want to leave!) but nursery have been helpful in applying some strategies to try and make it easier.

At home he's saying No a whole lot more all of a sudden, and disagreeing with everything / anything. He's being incredibly picky about food and very demanding. We never eat sweets or biscuits etc at home but we will occasionally let him have a treat, if we are out, such as a gingerbread man when we visited a museum cafe or lolly on a hot day or whatever. Recently he's started demanding biscuits/ lolly etc at other times when we are at home or on the way from nursery, and then having a massive meltdown when we say no not today. We can't pass the local shop without him demanding lolly / biscuit etc! He is refusing to go up to bath shouting no, etc. Basically everything has become a battle and he's wanting everything now, whatever he wants etc. he gets really frustrated and screams or screws his face up.

He has also started hitting out at us when we say no to him. This has been followed with him saying things like "I don't love you anymore", which is horrible to hear but I try not to take it personally! (When he woke up in the night last night he mumbled "I love you mummy", so when he's asleep he's his true self!)

We are very loving with him, however quite a few times he has reacted strangely when I've said "well done" or complimented him about something he achieved eg "how clever to know what that word means" - he will shout "No, don't look at me / no don't say that / I'm NOT clever" or similar.

I just don't know where this behaviour is coming from, or why he's suddenly putting on this defiance all the time and where is comes from. Could he be angry with us for sending him to nursery? Or am I reading way too much into this and is it normal 3 year old / teenager stuff just about him not managing and regulating his emotions???

In regards to how we manage this currently, we never shout but just stay calm and firmly say no. We try to find opportunities to distract or foresee transitions where possible and provide lots of structure but it's exhausting and I'm constantly aware of the next "battle" trigger. If he flat out refuses (eg bedtime) we just pick him up and carry him upstairs and then once he's in the bath he's fine, although then it's a battle to get him out!

On demanding sweet treats I just say no, and then commiserate with him "yeah I know I get it, biscuits are tasty and it's disappointing we can't eat them every day, how about an apple?" until he moves on to something else, but he gets very cross and frustrated. He can sometimes throw a toy in anger.

With hitting I always get down on his level, hold his wrists and say a firm "no, we do not hit".

How can we manage this better?

...............

Other contextual stuff in case it's relevant:

• no sudden changes at home or anything. Only child.

• The only thing is he recently moved from cot bed to junior bed - quite late but since he never tried to climb out and slept well we didn't see the need to switch earlier. A couple of times he's got up and come to our bed but then stayed awake so now we are training him to stay put in his bed until morning and call out if he needs anything.

• feedback from nursery is he's doing really well (once he's there), very helpful, amiable, switched on, engaged etc.

• I've read the How To Talk...books and follow Big Little Feelings.

I can't comment on much of it but when my daughter hits us we get down to her level and say "in this house we don't hit we hug. Shall we have a hug". It defuses the situation much quicker than telling her off and she rarely hits us as she gets nothing more from hitting than she does the rest of the time. It removes the neon spot light that can make a behaviour a game and encouraging as reprimanding her can do.

Thanks @Superscientist that's interesting. I do try to diffuse by naming his feelings and saying that's ok to feel x but not okay to hit etc. I'll try this.

I'm just wondering if this is normal or if he must be deeply unhappy...

Yep sounds familiar to me! It'll pass at some point I'm sure... I ignore a lot, cry when I can. It's exhausting some days. No advice just solidarity

In my opinion you need to change things, like reset him. Can you meet up with his friend at the gate? Can someone else take him? Can you get someone to bring him out to you when you pick him up. Can you get him to have a say in things. Right bathtime tonight do you want to read a book first or after? Do you want yellow bubble bath or green? Can you help find some pj's. Do you want me or daddy to bath you. No sweets today but if your good I've got a lovely sticker you can have (useful for most things). Try ignoring negative behavior and award positive. Oh well what a big boy you are for picking up your toys, you were super fast. Wow how amazing are you for finding your boots for me. Small achievable things. Also remember to praise him to others.

Thank you. To be honest @Ohdearwhatnow4 that's exactly what we are doing. I've followed the How to Talk advice to a tee and he always gets choices. It's just not helping.

When I offer A or B he will say No, he wants C. Classic example this morning, coat time do you want green coat or blue one - nothing I'm not going outside.

My son, who has just turned 4, sounds very similar, particularly around transitions/drop off at pre-school. The one thing that has really helped is a reward chart for good behaviour. He gets a sticker if he goes into pre-school nicely and when he gets 10 stickers he can exchange them for a small gift. Pre-school report that since implementing this the change in his behaviour is miraculous.

I think it is probably just a stage a lot of children go through. My son was never motivated by stickers alone but the prospect of exchanging them for a little gift has had a big impact!

So what did you do?
My youngest is 15 and has sen but he's 1 of 4. I've never heard of how to talk so can't comment on that. What about if you don't ask? He's your coat put it on if he says no say fine and let him get cold (obviously not freezing) what happens if he has a melt down do you leave him to cry it or or always try to comfort him. My older children were born when smacking was allowed and this was how we were told to parent, I never smacked my kids but we weren't told to go down to their level or anything so some of my ideas might not help. And just before anyone goes for me I'm NOT suggesting any form of punishment I'm just explaining my ideas might be out dated.
With my 2 younger kids we used visual timetables. Get up, breakfast, wash, dress and teeth, and so on could this help. Also great time to use a clock and even get him a little watch, so at 7pm it's bathtime.

Sounds like a 3 year old to me! Transitions are often difficult; my friend's almost 4 year old, no matter how many warning countdowns you do of 5 more mins, 3 more mins, 1 more minute, fundamentally he doesn't want to stop playing the game he's in the middle of to get in the bath or have dinner. And once in the bath and having fun, he doesn't want to leave it to get ready for bed. Repeat ad nauseum! It may not help but his 7yo brother is much better these days when given the warnings about X many more goes or timing countdowns - but still often says no about getting in the bath and now and then you get a collapse into tears at leaving somewhere fun.

Everyone always trots out "give them two choices of red t-shirt or blue t-shirt" but that doesn't work for every toddler just the compliant ones. Plenty will just refuse or shout NOT GETTING DRESSED full stop. Not sweating the small stuff or picking your battles, distraction, bribery/rewards, turning things into a game - just got to struggle on where you can and remember you're the adult and small children often don't know what's best for them and literally can't control their small developing brains and emotions so you have to soldier through sometimes forcing them to do something for their own good and while they're screaming and kicking about it.

My nearly three and a half year old has had a couple of these phases in the last year, normally lasting 3-4 weeks each. And each time after it he just seems so much more grown up coming out the other end, like he's really developed during the phase. So I assume it's related to that, and his brain is undergoing some kind of change which is all just a bit overwhelming. A bit like with a baby where they don't sleep for a week and then wake up one day and start crawling or something!

Mine are school age now, but this sounds normal. You created an independent being that doesn't have to want the same as you. Even though put on clothes because it is cold and wet outside is perfectly reasonable!

To you it is just moving a room at nursery, but to him the people who were with him vanished one day and he didn't want it to happen. My eldest loved the key worker in the 2-3 room so much that going to the preschool was like a bereavement. He would cling to the old door handle as we went past. Of course he remembers none of it now.

I would go with lots of cuddles and I love you always when he says he hates you. He is probably testing that you won't leave him like the nursery people did. I go with you don't want to hit me, instead of stop hitting. It makes it less of a demand and (hopefully) makes them think about it. Also totally agree with previous poster that a natural consequence of not agreeing to a coat is that he gets cold etc. He will learn a lot more from that than you telling him.

Thank you, this is so helpful reassuring.

I don't think Big Little Feelings is that good, I think they have gone very "instagram gentle parent influencer"-y and it's a lot of fluff not much actual useful substance, and some of it is even a bit mixed up and confusing.

How To Talk generally great :) but sounds like you might need something more, like the next level if that makes sense. Also, remember that these are just tools - again to go back to the instagram thing again, you can end up with the impression there is some gospel to be stuck to. In reality it's a lot of experimenting and finding out what works in this situation, what works in that.

The missing piece of the puzzle here might be self regulation/understanding how the nervous system reacts to stress? Mona Delahooke is very good at this - see if you can find her interviewed on a podcast maybe. Or I like the book "Help Your Child Deal With Stress and Thrive" (Self-Reg) by Stuart Shanker.

I don't think it sounds like he's deeply unhappy, but it sounds like perhaps he doesn't have that many skills at ramping down when he starts to feel something uncomfortable. Sometimes with the gentle parenting emphasising feelings stuff I think you can go a bit overboard with this (I know I definitely did!) and it seems to make all the feelings even bigger. Or the other common pattern is that we are uncomfortable with the feelings but we don't want to do the "old" way of shouting, saying "That's enough, stop crying" but we still feel like they are big scary things that we need to soothe or stop ASAP and I think this doesn't give children very much practice at self regulating, because they are basically always reliant on you to help them calm down. It might be that he needs some space and to learn some tools to calm himself down. The "old" method probably wasn't good for some children because it told them: Your feelings are shameful and forbidden - but for others it might have been a nudge at the right time to say yes, you're sad, but you don't need to keep marinating in it forever. Janet Lansbury has some really good writing on this on her blog.

I don't think he's angry about you sending him to nursery; it probably doesn't occur to him that you have a choice (and even if he did, that's not his decision to take on anyway).

How long is the nursery day? And are there any specific teachers that he warms to there more than others? My 5yo really struggled when his nursery day was long. We have recently moved him to a shorter day and it seems to be helping. I appreciate that may not be possible with all situations but it might be something that you can work around with the staff, I think with my DS it gets to a point of the day where his capacity (for sensory input, or social contact, I don't really know) gets overloaded and he needs to decompress but there is no scope for him to do that at nursery.

PS he sounds almost identical to my DS1 who was very emotional and sensitive at that age. He is now a giant teenager, very chilled, still funny and sensitive, we did SOOOOOOOOO much work on emotion regulation and it seemed to pay off.

I do wish that I had just put the coat on him though. (He still won't wear a coat!) I was so very earnest in my insistence that he make decisions for himself and I wish I had been a bit more confident in my role as the adult with more life experience. (It is all fine though and he has not yet succumbed to hypothermia or lost any digits to frostbite!)

Sounds completely normal to me! My son definitely did similar things at that age and still does at 5.

He'd say he hated nursery but then have a lovely day there. He'd be extremely difficult. The only thing I noticed that seemed to trigger it (aside from just growing up and asserting his own will) was tiredness. Even thought they nap nursery does take it out of them. Ours would nap at home after about 2.5 and hated doing to bed. I used to just drive him around in the pram sometimes to get him rest. But he resisted sleep. His major meltdowns were always when he was a tired. So trying to get him off to bed somehow worked.

Failing tgst we bribe. He definitely responds better to a promise than a threat. So instead of saying no to sweets/ say if you go home and have a bath you can have a chocolate button for example.

But most of all you ride it out. Ours is definitely getting better. But it took time!

It just sounds like you’re going head to head with each other and caught in a catch 22. There is a time and place for saying no but it sounds like you’re telling him all the time. It might be more helpful for him to know WHEN he will be able to have a lolly … ‘yes you can have a lolly on Saturday when we go to the park’. Also give him limited choices so he feels like he has some control…. ‘Would you like a bath or a shower’.. ‘blue or red coat for preschool’. Allow lots of time for transitions, get up earlier, get to nursery earlier before the crowds arrive and play a game with him before leaving. He seems to struggle with the attention of a compliment, maybe there’s a less direct way of complimenting? Lastly, stop giving him attention for hitting. Walk off, don’t engage, go have a cup of tea in the kitchen or garden. At the moment he’s getting attention for poor behaviour and is probably too young to truly be sorry for his actions

It could be normal 3.5 year old behaviour, he's trying to find his boundaries etc. Are there any "hitters" at nursery? Older kids after school that he could be learning from?
Or if it lasts a while it could be something more, my son struggled with transition at that age we thought he'd grow out of it, but it turned out to be autism. I know another child who was like that and has oppositional defiance syndrome. What is he like if you say "shall we go up for your bath now?"

My son was the same at this age.
I was at my wits end but started reading about strong willed children.
Saying No is a trigger so we give him choices. It’s not about do you want a or b is saying “what shall we do first - get dressed or have breakfast?”
“Which carer do you think will be in nursery today? Shall we see if you’re right?”
“which 2 books do you want to read?”

I also found giving 5 min warnings were helpful too.
Like ‘5 more minutes of playing then we’re going to get ready for bed’

it’s exhausting having to think one step ahead and you won’t get it right every time but it can make life a lot easier.

As for picky eating we’ve still not got that one yet! I’ve read the phase usually starts around 2 and last til around 6.

I follow Stephanie Lagendre on tiktok, she has some really good advice

I remember saying good morning to our child aged 3.

” it’s not a good morning don’t say good morning” followed by grumbling and muttering for at least 20 minutes.

She used to say “I love Daddy” and give me long hard stares.

this went on for weeks/ months

she was an absolute delight 😂

now she is 5 and people tell me regularly they have never met such a happy child.

i always felt that she was trying to gain little slices of control in our family’s busy life. We had a reward chart with magnets which worked well at focusing on certain behaviours and routines. Now we have treat day on Saturday for the whole family.

although today she looked so like DH - I commented. And she burst into tears and said I want to look like Mummy and wouldn’t speak to DH for hours- in case his middle aged man looks rubbed off on her I guess.

good luck!!! It’s a joy!

I think I'm about to say something unpopular here, but i rhino we are often giving little children far too many choices. Do they really need to decide what colour bubble bath / which coat etc? Because I know, as an adult, it's exhausting making all the decisions and in my opinion it's too much for little ones.

Have you considered if he's tired and /or hungry? 4 full days at a nursery can also be extremely tiring to a little one. He may need more sleep/down time and could possibly be hungry, hence asking for treats.

It does.sound like you're being consistent and he will likely grow out of it, bit I'd consider the things I've mentioned.

My 3.5 year old is very similar. I think it's a phase.

In my experience, you can’t just say ‘no’ to a child without giving an explanation. At the very least, you need to make sure he is told every time that lollies are only treats for hot days when you have a day out. However, I would also offer an explanation as to why they’re not allowed something at home that very clearly makes them happy.

See if from his POV. How do you feel if someone tells you no without any explanation? “Mummy knows I love lollies. What have I done wrong that I am not allowed one?” The frustration at this will send them into a meltdown.

My best and oft-repeated advice is that indifference is powerful. Not feigned disinterest but as genuine indifference as you can get yourself to. I think he may be out of his depth with choice and consequence - his choices aren't going to be rational always and I think this is a really big age for him to explore/assert power dynamics.

I don't think my kids ever had a coat on before we went outside at this age regardless of what it was like outside. This sometimes applied to shoes too - not ideal but they wanted them on soon as the door closed. I'd ask a couple of times for them to put shoes on and lightly mention it might be cold/wet etc but as we were leaving start an interesting conversation and just carry on, don't mention the shoes/coat just and carry them out whilst leaving. I really think he's too small and power mad at this age (they mostly are) to navigate this with so just diffuse & distract.

Also, with the transitions thing, I found carrying something in they 'had' to give/show etc was a great way for them to forget about other stuff.

Keep it light, be busy, smile a lot and I think he'll follow your lead. Good luck.

For the most, sounds like a typical preschool age behaviour.

What does strike me is when he is saying things like "don't look at me" and "I'm not clever." That, to me, sounds like something staff at his preschool are saying to him and he is becoming confused - because that's likely what he hears most while he is there, possibly doing something that he shouldn't and that is how they are addressing his behaviour. As you said, he's no longer getting one on one attention, so my guess is he is doing anything regardless of what attention it gets to get their attention from them - and those phrases are what they are using back at him. At this stage of their life its strange to use phrases that aren't used by parents, so if you hear him saying things you wouldn't say, there's a good chance he's learned them somewhere else.

Addressing the hitting, if you've never hit him before - it's possibly another child who is being hit at home finding it acceptable to hit others as they get hit and projecting their life onto him. I would contact the staff about this, don't rule out that he isn't being hit by someone there whether it's other kids or staff. I am aware resources are very stretched at preschools and things going on do get missed by staff.

The arguments over "no".
The worst thing you can do with any kid is argue with them, you're just provoking them into reacting.
You say "no" or "not today" ONCE. End of story - move on to something else. Start talking about car colours driving past (Oh wow, look at that beautiful red bus! Do you think mummy would look good driving a bus? No? What about Daddy? mimic driving a bus like you'd have a great time, maybe asking if your child has a ticket, tell them where you are going) how big the trees are, how blue the sky is - and make something small way more important than a biscuit, make a game of it. Bath time issue? Set a clock and ask your child if you can get in the bath and out again before it goes beep, make a big fuss of winning against the clock.
From wanting a biscuit or something unhealthy, what your child most likely actually wants is stimulation - have a look at their environment. Are you walking somewhere? This is a great time to have conversations about the world around them. Going shopping? Get them involved by getting them a shopping list with pictures and words on it and getting them to spot things on the shopping list. It doesn't have to be detailed, you can print off images of stuff you want or use clip art drawings, maybe provide a few crayons so they can colour it in or check it off once it's in the trolley and if they ask for something, tell them it's not on the list today. This can backfire however, I forgot to put tea bags on the list once, tried to put some in the trolley and my dear sweet child told me to "put it back, it's NOT on the list!"

Sounds normal to me. Try to imagine life from his point of view. He has absolutely no control over anything. His every minute of the day is decided for him and it’s natural they start to dislike that. It moves them to independence. I think once they start to get more opportunity to have control over their day they do calm down. You’re not doing anything wrong but I think you are overthinking everything. 3 was certainly the worst age with my son, 2 was bliss in comparison. He’s now 7 and we’ve found a balance with him feeling a sense of control. It gets easier.