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Normal tantrum or possible neurodiversity?

6 replies

forthesakeofdignity · 25/10/2023 09:36

Please excuse any naiveness or ignorance with this question, this is my first child and I've never had the exposure to toddlers to know where the limits of "normal" lie.

Here is a typical example of the sort of tantrums/meltdowns that we ("we" being DD and I, never with anyone else) experience on a daily (sometimes several times) basis.

  1. DD (17m) wakes up and starts crying (normal, never really sure why). She'd calm down till I so much as smiled at her and then it'd set her off again. Arched back and lashed out if I even suggested (physically) that I might touch her/pick her up.

  2. Wanted to breastfeed for the second time within 30 minutes of waking, which I refused. Began stamping feet and thrusting self up and down, grabbing onto my legs and getting in the way of me trying to walk (without risk of kicking her). Again if I so much as then put my arms out to offer her a hug she will throw herself to the floor (on her bum). If she's sat down and I do the same, she will throw her head back to the floor too. Doing nothing but quietly observing her leads to her running back and forth getting more and more wound up, to the point that she becomes unsteady and risks hurting herself by falling into something/throwing herself into something. She will grit her teeth to the point her head trembles doing it. She'll trash around if I do have to pick her up and repeatedly hit me (which I tell her a firm no and put her back down for doing, but obviously that escalates things further).

  3. Calmly, kindly but firmly telling her to "be gentle" and other similar disciplines kicks off the same response as #2.

The only way she will calm down is with the boob. I know she can't self regulate and I'm not expecting that, but if the tantrum is over that very boundary of not feeding her then I try not to "give in", however she will go on for literally over an hour despite me remaining calm and trying basically everything else.

Is this really just normal toddler tantrums? She is described as an "angel" by grandparents and I don't know if it's possible for a 17mo female to be "masking" if it is ND, which could be why she only does it with me? Maybe I'm over analysing...

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BertieBotts · 25/10/2023 09:55

It's much too young to think about neurodiversity.

She just sounds grumpy when she wakes up, which, honestly, fair 😂

I would just give her a little time to come to. If you don't want to breastfeed maybe offer her a bottle or cup of warm cow's milk or a dummy if she uses one. Or try to get her attached to a comfort object like a teddy or blanket. It sounds like she's comfort seeking with breastfeeding, which is absolutely fine and age appropriate, but if you don't want to offer that with bf, that's your right too. But I'd try to meet that need in another way or redirect the bf requests if you would like to cut down or have a boundary around when you feed.

They do sound like totally normal toddler tantrums, which can vary enormously, as can the age of onset. She's on the early side but it's not unusual. Whereas on the other end of the scale some children don't start this until about a year later, so don't worry if she seems different to other babies that you know. It's like walking and sitting and rolling - there's a range of what is normal and none of them are wrong.

At her age while there's no harm in getting into good habits of using language like "be gentle" they are really physical and not so much operating in the language centres of their brain yet, so I'd look to more physical ways of intervening (I don't mean physical punishment) like for example, if she wants to hit, teach her "high five" and redirect to this, or if she wants to hit things to make a noise, hand her a toy drum or plastic hammer or something that can suffice for those purposes and is appropriate (like a wooden spoon and saucepan).

It also helps to back up any verbal instruction with physical demonstration, so physically blocking something while saying "no touch" or "ouch. Hot."

Control the environment as far as possible simply to make life easier for yourself and reduce the amount of time you're spending trying to stop her doing something all day every day. That means make your home toddler proof, and use some form of containment (buggy, reins, carrying, sling) when you're out and about unless you can tell that the environment is safe like a park with a gate, or a toddler group.

If she's being very physical during a tantrum the focus is simply on making sure she can't hurt herself or others and is safe until she calms down. It's totally normal for a one year old not to have emotional regulation skills yet. It's common and safe and healthy for them to use breastfeeding as a source of coregulation, but if you don't want to use that, then try googling "coregulation methods for toddlers" and try out some of the suggestions.

forthesakeofdignity · 25/10/2023 11:17

@BertieBotts This is a great post, thank you. It's not that I don't want to use BF as a means of co-regulation, if anything it's probably one of the reasons I'm reluctant to stop because it is easy and very powerful. I'm being made to feel like it's the cause of her dysregulation though and that I should stop for both of our benefits (by DP,/familywho have been adamant BF is the reason for a lot of non-ideal things). I'm mostly concerned that she is now too old to remove it without it really impacting her because she's known it all her life, but too young to understand reasoning. I had hoped to go till closer to 3yo when I can gradually wean her and she'll understand boundaries like "only after we wake up/before bed". Plus she can also then communicate with me so if she's in pain or something, I can help her in other ways which I can't always determine now.

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BertieBotts · 25/10/2023 13:38

It's totally fine to stop/cut down breastfeeding at any age, but you should do it because you want to or think it would be helpful, not because other people think so - IME it's just people who are unused to breastfeeding over the age of 1 seem to find it very threatening for whatever reason. It's their issue, not yours.

My guess is the other "non ideal things" - not sleeping through the night, maybe co-sleeping, fussy eating, and separation anxiety? All of these things are totally, totally normal at 17 months old and they will improve with time especially if you can be relaxed about it and not try to make it into a huge issue. Again if you wanted to wean off night feeding and/or co-sleeping, this is possible to do if you wanted to.

Don't worry :)

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forthesakeofdignity · 25/10/2023 16:08

@BertieBotts Wow, they are literally all of the things, no more no less!

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mindutopia · 25/10/2023 16:26

I don't necessarily think any of this is anything more than a serious tantrum. I mean, my youngest is now 5 and sometimes he has tantrums at the level you've described. Maybe not for an hour, but certainly 20-30 minutes. He's in Year 1 in school and completely neurotypical, very social, does well in school, all completely fine and 'normal' in terms of development. 17 months is a tricky age. They are not babies but also not old enough to communicate with and reason with.

But it is a perfectly fine time to wean off breastfeeding, if you want to. I weaned mine at 16 months. It's just about replacing with something else - a cup of milk - for filling them up, distraction and being consistent.

BabaganooToo · 25/10/2023 16:44

Your DD sounds a lot like my DS, but he's only 15 months. And just fyi he quit breastfeeding at 10 months and we still cosleep and have separation anxiety and I STILL get the odd comment insinuating that his lack of sleeping alone and tantrums are due to BFing...

The waking up crying thing drives me mad but I'm hoping he'll grow out of it. Getting angry when I offer hugs is also one of his things. And trying to push me/my legs when I'm not doing what he wants. And he's an angel for everyone else 😅 it's very tiring isn't it. Solidarity.

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