12 year old (year 8) and lunches

[keepfaith22]

I've kind of trusted my 12 year old with her school lunches - she started secondary school last year where they had a fab menu.
All different dishes to try, street food, sandwiches the lot.

Anyway, I've noticed her appetite has dropped over a while and now she is saying she's not hungry for breakfast and wants small portions at dinner so I'm getting concerned

I don't want to make a big deal about it but would like some advice how I go about it

When she has a big plate ( my portions I give her are big enough ( but if we are out and it's a big plate she gets overwhelmed.

Anyway I've checked her account as she has a food fob which automatically tops up

It looks like this

Monday - bread roll and butter
Tuesday- sausage roll
Wednesday home made cake
Thursday home made cake
Fri panini

Monday panini
Tuesday roll and butter
Wednesday home made cake x3
Thursday bread roll and butter
Friday - pasta pot

So pasta pot and even panini I think are ok but some days she's just having a bread roll?

I know the simple thing to do is talk to her which i will but I feel I need to be sensitive rather than come across if I'm not happy with her etc

I know she struggled with the transition from primary to secondary coping with boys, mean girls and being poplar etc however she's a good girl who tries her best and is doing well in my opinion and seems happy

Any advice ? Thank you

To add we do have a good nutritional value dinner every night. So she does eat a good evening meal but again she has to have a fairly
Small portion and I don't wanna force her to eat and give her any anxiety over food as I can tell she gets full quick but generally enjoys everything we have x

DTs are also in y8 and their eating habits at school are dire - they get half an hour and don't want to queue for the hot food in the canteen so they go to the snack bar which is 'grab and go'.

Yesterday one of them had a slushie and a cake and the other one had a slushie and a bagel.

Can't get them to eat breakfast either.

They do eat a normal dinner and are raiding the kitchen for snacks when they get in though.

Difficult one, I developed an ED in y8, definitely keep an eye on it.

My DD is the same age, and I would definitely be a little concerned as well in your situation!

Has she reported any particular issues? Any specific names being brought up regularly in a negative way?

I was older than that at the time, but I went through a spell of eating very little at secondary because the bullies were holding court in the canteen, and none of the few friends I had stayed for lunch so I wanted to be in and out as quickly as possible so I wouldn't be a target just sitting on my own. Sometimes I skipped lunch altogether. (I did, as far as I remember, have normal portions at home though)

Have you tried offering some of her favourite meals more often to try and tempt her into eating a bit more, and maybe use this as a gentle opener? "you usually eat a little more than this when I make xxx, why do you think you're less hungry today?"

What's the pastoral care like at school? Does she have a tutor who you can contact to get a sense of any issues in class?

I remember being embarrassed to eat in front of people at secondary school. Very rarely would've I ordered a proper meal like pasta etc, most of the time I'd pull apart a sandwich or get a dessert (cake or cookie).
I'm sure I felt like it wasn't "cool" to be sat eating a meal.

Hi OP
This would worry me. My DD developed AN at the ned of year 8.
Is she eating snacks? Is she eating breakfast (even though she claims to be not hungry?)
If not and she is dropping breakfast you need to take action.
Sit her down and explain that the amount she is eating is not sufficient or nutritious enough for her needs as a growing teen. Then come up with a plan to address it. Proper breakfast. A commitment to eat something sufficient at lunch (which you can then monitor!).. and some snacks as well as her evening meal. No mention of 'healthy eating' just enough volume and variety.
She may have no idea she isn't eating enough (young teens are often quite clueless about cals!)
Or she may be at the start of an ED
If its the later she is likely to react badly to the conversation. And then you will have an idea which way the land lies. If it doesn't go well and you need more advice please join us on the Carers of teens and young people with Eating Disorders thread. (I'll link it if you want it)
Please don't pussy foot around it. You won't give her food anxiety. If she has an ED that's already there (because of the ED!) If she doesn't, sensible conversations about food are fine!
What does your gut tell you?

Thank you. I feel over the years it's been an issue lingering but now I do feel really feel it's a problem. And I am really worried about an ED so I don't feel as silly as I did typing it out.

Pastoral care is amazing. I have a good relationship with them since she suffered some girls being mean in year 7 which has got better and she has a better friend circle now.

She does snack but it's very unhealthy. Crisps and chocs so that's my fault!

Our dinners are yummy and she really enjoys them - it's just portion size and she is looking thinner then she ever has. She's really shot up in height but she's always been on the slender side.

We have good communication and she has spoken to me about food before but she's also not good ( never has been ) at drinking any water / squash etc. it's like a block so I don't want her becoming this way about food.

She loves helping in the kitchen, she will always want to chop if it's the salad or any veg.

Tonight we have jacket pot cheese beans and salad and she does eat a whole jacket. It's the breakfast and lunches when I'm not with her.

I will insist on breakfast as I currently don't but make it fun and not a demand etc.

I will also speak to the school.

Thanks all x

Don't worry about the 'healthiness' of snacks. It's the cals she needs. So I would just focus on breakfast and lunch.
And encouraging her to eat more. And load her dinners with extra cals (so cream in mash etc) so the volume doesn't go up but the cals do.
But if she isn't cooperative act quickly and join us on the ED thread for some sound advice.
My gut told me my DD was not well. Everyone tried to tell me I was over reacting. Mums rarely are. And over reacting is better than not. EDs need prompt action if that is what she has.

Oh and 'helping in the kitchen is a classic ED trait. It helps them control what they eat.....

Thank you, that's great idea. She has favourites like most kids and she loves mash so ideas like that is great. I'll definitely re think her diet and make sure she has nutritious foods and have a chat with her. Does bmi mean anything? Just because I wouldn't even know what she weighs but maybe her bmi is low as she is quite thin looking.

BMI is not used for children. The ED services use weight for height. In a percentage.
So for a child of your DDs age and height they use the weight an average child (50% BMI) would be. Then divide her weight by that weight to get a percentage. It's hard to work out.
If she looks like she has lost weight she prob has.

Ah ok

She's 6stone 7 and 5foot

We've had a good chat. She was open and happy to talk about it. She says she just doesn't find food interesting, sometimes isn't hungry and has said yes she had a bread roll sometimes as that's all she fancies !

I've told her we can get some help if we want ( should we ?) or just see if we can help her feel better about food

This is all new to me so no idea if I'm doing the right thing

She's told me she feels overwhelmed if her food is too much ( I actually get that too as I've never thought I have an ED)

So we have made a plan that I will always dish up and she can tell me if it looks ok / too much etc so she has some sort of control over it rather than I have to eat what mums put on my plate

She does love a desert so I've always said she needs to clear her plate first ! I've said now ideally if she can but if she doesn't then don't worry ( is this right to do this?)

She says she doesn't know why she feels like this but has done since as long as she can remember and doesn't see it as a huge problem as in it's not on her mind etc I think she means

any other help or anything I should be doing?

According to my (back if fag packet) calculations she isn't very underweight (c 95% wfh assuming Dob 01.01.11).
And she hasn't reacted poorly to your questions.
So prob not an ED.
I would suggest she eats breakfast even if she doesn't fancy it and tries to eat more lunch if poss. But the fact she wants to eat pudding and high cal snacks is good!
I'd just keep an eye on her and keep going.
Phew!

Thank you, I feel so much better and I'll see how she goes
Thank you for all your advice x

Please do seek proper medical advice if you are still worried. I am only qualified from having been through my DD having an ED!

i never ate lunch at school, (to be fair i spent my lunch money on 3 cigs everyday) my teenagers rarely eat the school lunch food either and won't take anything from home. I think a lot of kids are like this at school

And have NO breakfast, a bread roll for lunch and not be hungry for dinner? Really?

Thank you, I will if I need to but for now this has been so helpful and reassuring thank you x

Hi, we spoke a while back
My daughter does have an ED
We've been to the GP, tried to deal with it at home and I thought we were doing ok but it's not got better, only worse
Can you please link the thread where I can get some further advice
I'm stuck as what do so next.....
Watching her gag and eyes water the last few eves breaks my heart

Things I've done -

Found some smoothies she likes so if she doesn't fancy breakfast one morning the deal is she has a small glass so least it's something

I let her be in control of when I dish up so she tells me when

I ask is that enough? You can always have more ? So she doesn't feel like it's a big plate

Making the portion fairly small so it's not over whelming

Not worrying so much on the sugar content
If crisps and choc are a snack so be it

Asking if there is anything she fancies when I do online shop so we have 'yummy' stuff like her faves - Mac cheese/hotdogs/pizzas etc but always try to do a bit of veg or side salad

Taking a multi vit

'Treating ourselves' so making it enjoyable and having film/choc/popcorn night

What else should I be doing or anything in that list I shouldnt?

X

When we went to GP they referred us and said from what she has heard then yes she has a ED but couldn't diagnose obviously
She was a nurse practitioner and really lovely
She weighed her and said although they do not use BMI they do use it as a guide as she's a very well developed girl. She's 5ft 5 and she looks like a 15/16 yr old!! She came out very underweight
She said not to sweat the small stuff on the crisps/chock etc as I was worried about unhealthy eating - she said pancakes/pain au chocolate for breakfast is fine as she needs rhe sugar, sugar turns to fat etc
To put double cream in her mash
To get the calorie intake up in whatever way I can
I had been doing this but this was a while
Ago now and it's getting worse x

Hi OP here is out thread. Please do come over and tell your story and get some advice.
So sorry to hear you are faced with an ED.
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/eating_disorders/4901861-support-thread-10-for-parents-of-young-people-with-an-eating-disorder?page=10

Hi @keepfaith22 so sorry to hear about your daughter. Which eating disorder clinic has she been referred to? Why is she gagging at meals - is it because she’s full and trying to force more in

i recently had something similar with my DD, where she lost her appetite and developed stomach pains due to anxiety. This meant she basically stopped eating as she associated the food with pain (due to the stomach pains) and had no appetite at all

Firstly we ruled out any medical issues causing the stomach pains. Then we were lucky enough to get a referral to the Maudseley within 2 weeks of the GP appointment - definitely push for a referral there if you are in the right area as they are world leading for eating disorders and ARFID in particular. They diagnosed my daughter with ARFID tendencies

my daughter was severely underweight at referral (78% weight for height). Their advice was to let her eat / graze whenever she could. Getting enough calories and liquid in was a lot more important than nutrition. She was already taking a comprehensive multi-vitamin gummy every day though which they were pleased about

they were also clear that we shouldn’t try and force her to eat as that would just make the anxiety worse

thankfully once we started treating my daughters anxiety her appetite came back and she started eating ALL the biscuits (we let her help herself to them whenever she wanted, even after bedtime as long as she brushed her teeth afterwards)

she is doing much better now, her weight has gone back up and her anxiety is under much better control

good luck, I know how worrying this time can be

My y8 doesn't like eating at school - I just make sure she has breakfast and she always has a good dinner (and usually a snack when home from school)

I think she would probably eat (crap) at school if if she could buy it every day but I don't have £100 a month for that when she can take lunch.

@keepfaith22 how is your DD now? I came across your thread as my DD in year 8 is having trouble eating lunch at school and I'm worried. She's seeing the school nurse and we have a GP appointment. She eats breakfast and dinner ok but refuses lunch at school saying she's not hungry and will often lie and pretend she's had it when it's still sat in her bag. At weekends and in the school holidays she will have lunch since we make it and it's hard for her to avoid it.