Anyone else with an older child that doesn't sleep?

[EnglishGirlApproximately]

Not particularly looking for advice (unless you have any gems of wisdom aside from the usual sleep routines), just some friendly ears to listen to me moan. My eleven year old has never been a good sleeper but the last month has been the worst in years. He just can't sleep alone, is worried about trying to sleep and failing and the thought of bedtime really upsets him at the moment.
I don't think there's anything going on aside for the natural anxiety of leaving primary school and friendship worries.
Other tired parents come and have a moan if you like!

Bumping from DS' bed again! He's snoring I'm staring at pokemon posters wondering if its worth trying to creep out 🙄

Didn't want to leave you with no answers. I had two who were bad sleepers till about but not that old. He sounds anxious, would probably benefit from taking away the pressure of 'bedtime' over school holidays and let him stay up till you go to bed and he's really tired. My first one didn't go to sleep till midnight for years but was happy if allowed to read and eventually dropped off.
Don't know if you are into natural remedies but might be worth trying something (even if is placebo affect as many will say). My better sleeper went through an anxious phase, I used a Bach's flower remedy called 'mimulus' which helped him almost instantly (he didn't know I'd given it him as put it into his squash so i refute placebo affect but await the mumsnet hordes telling me doesn't work😂)

Funnily enough I was just googling potential sleep aids so I'd be open to trying something. I'll look out for the bachs one you said. Knew I should have bought melatonin gummies when we went to Florida 🤣
He is anxious for sure, leaving primary, his body is starting to change and he's had some difficult times in his hobbies. He's a natural worrier unfortunately so will be over thinking everything.
I'd love to let him stay up if it meant he'd go to sleep alone and lie in but even at midnight he won't sleep without someone there - and he always wakes at 6 regardless of bedtime!

No idea why my reply has been hidden maybe my bad joke about medication 🤔

Oh its there again!

There’s a lot of pressure at school and more than likely year 6 is in free fall - no set time table, plays, games, movies etc It’s surprising how lack of routine upsets the kids and they are worried they’ll forget it’s sports day or the class photos or bring your granny to school.

I doesn’t do them any good! And they haven’t even started to strip the walls yet.

Relieved to hear I'm not alone. My 10 year old won't go to sleep without someone with him, and never has. This can take over an hour of sitting in the dark before he falls asleep. He then wakes every night at least once, and sometimes up to 4 times. He then gets in with me, once he's there he'll sleep until 6.30am. He starts fidgeting about an hour before waking up, which wakes me even though it doesn't wake him.

I've forgotten what it's like to sleep through the night. Things I've tried : Piriton, cry it out, magnesium liquid, gradual withdrawal.
Nothing has really made a difference, so no advice I'm afraid. (I might give that Bachs thing a try next.)

Have you tried letting him do something very relaxing like colouring in bed and then listening to an audiobook to fall asleep to?

My 9yo has a similar problem. DH and I sleep in separate rooms and DS has got into the habit of sleeping in DH’s bed as he likes the company.
I’d love to find a solution as DH is getting fed up with the lack of personal space.

Solidarity. My autistic 9yo is in bed with me - he tosses and turns like a rotisserie chicken! He’s on melatonin which only works enough to get him to sleep. He wakes every night, sometimes several times, and always want to get in our bed. We keep trying to take him back to his own bed but he’s always up again within the hour, so musical beds it is.
my oldest is in yr6 and has developed anxiety and can’t go to sleep without someone there. SATS stress and all the changes this year has really messed with his head.

What does he say when you talk to him about his anxiety. How are you addressing the core issue - ie his anxious personality? Deal with each issue and appease his concerns. This amount of stress over SAT's is not good. When you talk about his best being good enough. And how SAT's create targets for GCSE's but when you really think about that, it's hardly significant in every day life, is it?

Very similar here. Has never ever slept on his own - ever. He’s currently curled up next to me.

i assume there will be a point when he doesn’t 😂like 25. I’ve tried everything - he will sometimes sleep with a dog or his sister but he’s a sneaker - sneaks in and under the duvet and lies still!!

My ds was like this. The thing that worked was just removing bedtime altogether. He went to bed when he was tired/when we did and listens to an audiobook until he went to sleep. it took all the pressure off. He went to school really tired a few times, but that worried more than it did him. We're so programmed to think they'll break/not get into a good university if they don't get enough sleep but they won't!

DS14 has phases of anxiety where he'll come to bed with me until he's falling asleep then I send him to his bed as he's a fidget. But even when he's having a happy phase, he's still awake til past midnight and up by 6. I just leave him to it. Bedtimes were always problematic with him.

Thanks do much for all of your messages, I'm relieved that it isn't just us! Its easy to think you're on your own when his friends are having weekend lie ins!
I've tried magnesium in the past, relaxing music, audio books, not having a set bedtime etc but it makes no difference. I'm going to give the bachs a try.
@Oblomov23 it isn't specifically SATS hes worried about. His school was very low pressure around them and so were we. Its more the changes happening in the next few months I think. But if it wasn't this it would be something else.
I do encourage him to talk to me about his worries but I think its a bit counter productive really as he then treats everything as a worry that he needs to get out of bed to talk about!
He's always been a bit of a worrier but this was amplified during covid - right at the beginning when the news was co.ing out if China he was convinced I was going to catch it as I travelled with work. Its been downhill from there really.

@Ivesaidenough oh the hours wriggling before waking 🙈 Hes tossing and turning and kicking me while happily snoring while I'm wide awake!
@BlueRidgeMountain rotisserie chicken is a perfect description!

DS2 didn’t sleep through until 12.5 so I know how you feel! He was just always worried about being alone, nothing specific just a general unease. Happiest most confident child by day so we never really got to the bottom of it…….. He just gradually stopped and now a year later has no issues sleeping at all, biggest test was DH was away for work earlier this year and I was sure he’d ask to sleep with me but he stayed in his room and bed the whole time.

We tried so many things when he was younger and nothing made any difference so we stopped stressing and just let him sleep wherever he felt comfortable with the view he’d stop when he was ready, admittedly we had hoped it would of been slightly earlier 😂

That’s encouraging @DominoRules . He’s happy and open with his feelings.

That's reassuring @DominoRules . DS is generally an easy going kid and is happy to share what's worrying him.
So you're promising me he'll sleep by 12.5 right? 🤣🤣🤣😁

😂 I’ll keep everything crossed for you @EnglishGirlApproximately ! It’s really hard as you feel like you’re the only one but I think it’s probably more common than people realise but they just don’t feel comfortable to talk about it.

I think you're probably right, I'm just too tired and grumpy to think about it rationally!

My eldest DC is a poor sleeper. She is autistic and prescribed melatonin to help her fall asleep.

My son is like this. I know you just want to vent, but one thing that's really helped is a weighted blanket off Amazon. (£20 approx)

I find a slightly later bedtime and a long time to wind down helps. He likes to draw or do Lego in his room. Lately has been reading but also likes audio books.

He said he likes the blanket and although we still get the odd worry etc he settles much quicker with it.

Looking back he has always been like this. Either on or off...there is no inbetween. We haven't broken the cycle of the multiple visits back downstairs after bedtime!

DD finally cracked sleeping once she was at high school.
Weighted blanket, calm approach to bedtime, we're a family of owls so it's never early! She writes in a journal if she needs to get something off her mind and we chat for 10-20 minutes. Lights out and it probably takes her about 15 minutes to start to fall asleep. She would never get up once in bed but it used to take a lot longer to fall asleep.

My 11 year old is exactly the same and the problem is made worse by him having to share with his 7 year old brother.

I got him a head torch and he likes to read himself to sleep. I try and not make a big deal how late it is because that stresses him more, but he does struggle to wake in the mornings sometimes.