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Day time sleeping problems - help!

11 replies

adifferentwoman · 13/02/2008 18:36

My baby is now 5 months old - she's had a turbulent first few months - a milk allergy and bronchiolitus. Whilst she now sleeps well at night, having settled herself to sleep from being fully awake - 7pm to 11pm, a feed and then through to 7am, she is terrible at day sleeping. On average she sleeps for 30 mins at a time and only 3 times a day. I have tried a multitude of potential solutions - putting her down awake / asleep / drowsy, at set times / different times, dark room / light room. Even pushing her in the pram doesn't work any more, plus I'd like to get something more sustainable in the long term i.e. in her cot. When we tried controlled crying, she went hysterical and when finally asleep, thrashes and whimpers, then wakes again in 20 mins time. By 4.30pm she's shattered...and so am I! Help please!

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bunnysgirl · 13/02/2008 20:39

Sounds just like my DS 6months old. Terrible sleeper in the day, cat naps of 30 mins bout 3-4times a day, always seems tired.He is just too nosey! But fortunately does sleep 12 hrs 6.30-6-7am so can't complain!

kaballie · 13/02/2008 20:53

This is what my 9 month old does still! Sleep at 10.30 (usually for 30mins but today for 40!) Then sleep at 2 for 20-30 mins then sleep at 4.30 wakes up in a mood and hates easting dinner! Then bath and bed by 7. Rubbish! She does sleep through though. I think some babies just do this - daytime controlled crying is really hard as you have to relent at some stage! Much easier at night. I think this is just the way some babies do it - is your baby especially 'interested' in everything? I think maybe some of the fairly bright, active babies find it hard to stay asleep...My theory anyway!

bunnysgirl · 13/02/2008 21:02

I agree with that theory kaballie, we have bright nosey sparks!!

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onepieceoflollipop · 13/02/2008 21:09

Hi, my dd2 is 6 months and almost the same day time sleep pattern as your dd. adifferentwoman 30 minutes at a time, around 3 naps a day, generally in cot, but sometimes in car seat or sometimes on me. I have noticed that early afternoon she is clearly still tired.

What I have done for the past few days is go in at the first whimper and replace dummy/stroke face/hold her hands. She is thrashing about but still looks very tired and pulls at her ears, rubs her eyes etc. She has for the past 3 days got restless for around 20-30 minutes and then settled back for an hour. [smkile] I am hoping that over the next few days she will need less help from me to re-settle - if not I will be back starting a thread of my own!

It is a pita but I now have my sandwich then sit outside her door with laptop/book so it doesn't seem such a hassle to have to keep going in. Also I figure that if she wasn't tired then she would no way go back off for an hour. It suggests to me that she need more like 1-2 hours rather than a quick catnap.

bunnysgirl · 13/02/2008 21:18

My ds today fought to sleep this afternoon clearly exhausted really needing 1-2hrs sleep but woke up after half an hr so Dh had to take him in the car to ensure more sleep otherwise he wouldn't have lasted til bedtime it would be a nightmare, why do thet do this when they are clearly still tired?

onepieceoflollipop · 13/02/2008 21:25

It's to do with going into a light sleep after 30-40 minutes I think. dd2 sometimes does it after going to bed at night as well, especially if she has been really tired.

Some days it feels as if they "know" you have just put the kettle on and suddenly you hear that little wail over the monitor...

EachPeachPearMum · 13/02/2008 21:55

You could try pick-up, put down method from baby whisperer. It worked for us...dd was a nightmare, but we used this to train her to go to sleep. It has made a huge difference to all our lives!

adifferentwoman · 14/02/2008 09:57

thanks for all your comments - it helps to know you're not on your own! Eachpeachpearmum - could you describe what the pick-up, put down technique is please?

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EachPeachPearMum · 14/02/2008 13:45

well, I'm sure baby whisperer explanation is better than mine (try library or charity shop, or friends etc) but...

basically she advocates putting them down to sleep while they're still awake. There is however a 'window' of opportunity when baby is kind of geared up for sleeping, and you need to recognise the signs so you can go for it then ... but I can't recall what they were- I just know what my dd does when she's tired IYSWIM.

She uses a 'routine' but without timings, just whats right for your baby- EASY- Eat, Activity, Sleep, You time. So that they eat when they wake, not just before. This is so they don't associate food with sleep, and expect to be fed off to sleep IIRC.

Pick-up, put down is where you've put them down to sleep, left them and they're crying, so

go back to them, pick them up. Pat their back, saying 'shh shh' only for 30 secs or so, so they calm down. Apparently babies cannot concentrate on the patting and shhshing at the same time (ie more than 1 thing) so they calm.

Put them back down, leave room.

When they cry again, go back, pick them up, pat them, 'shh shh' etc.

Repeat ad infinitum.

When they wake after 20/30 mins etc, and cry, do the same thing, till they go back to sleep.

With a slightly older baby (8mo??) she says, leave them lying there, and pat their back saying 'shh shh'. The patting thing really helps- in fact dd does this with her cuddlies now when she's playing at putting them to bed , so it obviously stuck!

There are bound to be other threads on this in 'sleep' if you search, and I think there's a baby whisperer website.

We were in an awful state with our dd (turned 2 this month). She could not sleep anywhere. She did however have reflux which caused her lots of pain. There were days when she could not remain asleep for longer than 5 mins and it was taking 1hr each time to drop off- exhausting, infuriating, overwhelming for us and for her. The problem was that we couldn't tell whether she was in pain, or angry at not sleeping, so we had to crack the sleeping problem IYSWIM.

She claims it will take 3 days with 5 mo old, and about 5 with a 8/9 mo. We took 3 days, and it was hellish, but we did it. She now sleeps 13 hours a night, and naps 1-1.5 hours after lunch, which is pretty good for a 2 yr old- though she has always needed a lot of sleep.

If you think there may be reflux, you could try raising the head of her cot (eg on thick books)- this made a big difference to the length of time dd could stay asleep for, and meant that once she could resettle herself she would have proper sleep- and so could we!

What also made a difference was switching from blanket and sheet to sleeping bag/grobag. Even with all her thrashing/faffing she was still toasty enough.

I do think how you feed them makes a difference- the most you're going to get a bf baby to sleep at 5 mo is 4 months, most will do 3 max. I think dd switched to 4 hour 'routine' at around 7 or 8 months- made a big difference to my sleep! I also cut down to 1 feed per night around then, so she was sleeping in 6 hour blocks or so.

Hope some of this helps! I really feel for you, those days are prob a big part of why we still only have 1 child! It will pass, I promise.

charliemama · 14/02/2008 13:54

I opened this thread with trepidation because I feel such a failure that DS2 is such a bad napper. He too rarely sleeps longer than 30 mins. Most of his naps happen on the preschool/school run. I would love him to have a block of sleep but I am beginning to accept that this might not happen.

adifferentwoman · 14/02/2008 19:05

Thanks for the detail on the technique. All I know is that babies are far from consistent - today's been an odd one. She's done about 3 hours today...mainly due to long car journeys and pram pushing...but now I'm listening to her whinge at evening putdown time, when she's normally silent!

I think I'll try the PU / PD technique - not sure about babies calming when 2 things are going on though....my previous attempts at sshushing and patting have just resulted in more thrashing, but maybe I need more patience and time! Basically, I think I'm going to need perseverance and endless patience for anything to work!

Agree about the grobag...also stops her waking cos she's travelled down to the end of the cot, turned 90 or 180 degrees and keeps bashing various body parts on the sides!

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