Help, mum and sister are autistic and it’s so difficult to have them to stay.

[MaryMum1234]

After two years of working in a school with SEND it’s hit me hard that my own mum and sister appear to be high functioning autistics’. In one way it’s super helpful as it explains some of the things from the past but on the other hand it’s so painful and I just don’t know how to proceed. It started this summer as my mum (an ex part time teacher) rang up and confided in me that she thought my sister was autistic and confessed she covered it up despite teachers and doctors saying things to her. My sister is two years younger than me and although I remember playing with her when we were very little up to the age of about 6 after that she barely spoke of interacted with me or any children she would just be really quiet. She eventually found a couple of friends who are just like her and don’t really talk much but would stand around with each other. She didn’t have any interest in make up/hair/going out/ adventures/reading story books or things that felt pretty normal to want to do…. She has never really had boyfriends or girlfriends at all but then said very matter of factly this summer after a family event that she had slept with hundreds of people but not found out what she liked and that sex was just a thing and didn’t have love attached to it. This was heart breaking to hear and even now makes my stomach sink. I tried so many times to talk to her about all of this and she just wouldn’t engage. Despite asking a thousand times growing up she’d never opened up about this at all and said the whole thing very matter of factly without wanting any kind of advice or discussion on it. She doesn’t really talk about love or spirituality but does say to her daughter that she loves her. Then the next day my mum confessed that my sister couldn’t cope so had moved back in with her and she is now helping care for my niece with her. She said my sister couldn’t cope because she couldn’t keep the house clean, cook or get the food and nappies in. She can cuddle and look at her little one, but not create any kind of routine and regularly (every other month) has some kind of emergency drama dash to A & E which turns out to be nothing. My husband and I have offered hundreds of times to have our niece over and look after them both to give my sister a break or have them both to stay but she won’t ever let us have our niece at all and she only finally came to stay for a few days this Christmas as my niece is pre school
now and wanted to see her cousins. As my niece is from donor sperm she doesn’t have any other family so when she was born my husbands family offered to become grandparents and extended family too and she was non committed about it all and basically said nothing and then said no in a very wish washy way, this came from them and my husband and I had no involvement in that although when it was mentioned we thought it would be great. Shortly after her birth my husband and I then received a document from a solicitor saying we are guardians alongside two
of her work colleagues if something happens to her. My sister hasn’t told my niece about her ivf journey or anything about her creation. She got pregnant before my niece with another baby and lost it at 13 weeks, she drank 6 cups of coffee a day in this pregnancy and ate a lot of the food you shouldn’t eat when pregnant (blue cheese etc…) it was so hard to deal with and as soon as I visited her during that time when I found out from my mum she was pregnant and could see what she was doing I got her decaf in and healthy foods and vitamins. It was weird though as she had chosen to live with my mum at this time and my mum had been letting her eat and drink like this and said she didn’t want to upset her when I asked why. Growing up I argued with my mum constantly not when I was very little before my sister came along but from about the age of 9 onwards. My mum and sister don’t wash much (once a week) and don’t have routines, they spend a lot of time talking together about things in an abstract way and are not practical. They both came to stay over Christmas and whilst I was cooking my sister let my two open all their presents without any kind of system of who was getting what it where from so things got lost and mixed up. She didn’t ask she just did it. In the evenings I would put mine to bed and leave the room and she would lay with my niece who is 5 now and can’t sleep by herself. She never shouts at her or has a routine so most of the time my niece would just ask for milk in a baby bottle which she gets and then get up and run round the house with her and then inevitably one of mine would get up. She hasn’t let my husband or I look after our niece at all not even barely hold her as a baby and it’s really hard to have a relationship with her as she squirrels away with her. She also takes our children to a room or whatever to do something fun when we are cooking or something and obvs in her mind she thinks she is being helpful but she will do something silly like give them all a selection box before dinner or open the presents. My mum is very judgmental about other people and her conversations are always negative and derogatory to someone/anyone else. She never spoke to me about relationships growing up and was incredibly controlling. She filled out my UCAS form and selected the Uni I went to and created a huge drama and stress when I challenged her and said my dad would die of a stress heart attack if I didn’t go etc…and she blocked me from taking part in dance/gymnastics completions I was selected for at county level (a couple
of years later my dad did die anyway of a massive heart attack). She also wouldn’t let me be friends with anyone she thought was a lower class than us . I was quite sick growing up and needed lots of treatment so it wasn’t till I finished uni i felt strong enough to distance myself from her. I am not polite and see her at holiday events for a day at a time but anything else is too
much. For the sake of the children my husband and I are friendly and civil but it was exhausting when they stayed because to us they are very out of control and although you can argue they don’t mean to be it feels very difficult to navigate. My partner says it upsets me too much and we shouldn’t do it again and have them to stay. I am ultimately worried that my niece will grow up trapped like I did. Any thoughts or advice would be so helpful x

I'm unsure of the problem? You don't like how she is raising her child?. It's different to how you would do it ? . That's the same for most families .
I have read atleast 3 other posts today with similar problems . You have too decide if you can put aside those things like opening presents in the wrong order or chocolate before a meal. And continue to have contact with them .
She sounds like she is really trying to be a good mum .
I dont think you should compare your childhood to your niece's.
My sister in law has a hectic crazy household with no routine and 5 kids .
When they visit it is stressful and I notice how different are routines with our children are . But they are loved and safe .
So it's not my place to say anything . She probably thinks I'm annoying in the way I do things

Being controlling is not autism.

Guilting someone else into doing what you want isn't autism.

Being judgemental, negative and derogatory isn't autism.

ok thanks that helps a lot. I suppose the problem is it’s just because I can’t talk to either of them and for years I thought it was me that very gesture/conversation I made wasn’t right but since working out they are probably both autistic it makes sense. I know I have to just deal with them and my niece is loved. Thanks for your advice

I think you come across pretty judgmental of your sister in your post. Instead of judging her, why don't you try to help her out? Help her establish a routine with her daughter. And to blame her drinking coffee and eating certain foods while pregnant on her miscarriage is really unfair. I don't know if your sister is autistic or not but it's clear you and her are just very different people and don't agree on a lot of things.

You can't change them at this point but you can change how you look at it all and how you see them. You can change how you respond and how you internalise it.

It sounds as if your mum has tried isolating you and your sister for reasons of her own, and it has been successful in the case of your sister, whom she has isolated and infantilised and truly hobbled. Where was your mother when your sister was sleeping with hundreds of people??

I would be concerned that your sister has had a baby almost for the same reasons people get a puppy - the unconditional love, etc.

I would be concerned enough to notify child protective services tbh. The child's needs are not being met at all.

Paragraphs please can't read that

On what basis do you think protective services need to be informed ? Tad dramatic.

What needs are not being met ? Because she doesn't have the same routine as her sisters kids ?

I dont think child protection services are necessary. It reads to me like her sister is a doting mother, albeit different parenting styles. She doesn't shout at her kid is one thing OP said. Hardly criminal offence stuff

The sister doesn't keep her house clean, cook, buy enough food or nappies. The child has no routines or predictability in her life, and still uses a bottle at age 5. She prefers to cuddle the child as if she were a doll.

The sister is not an adequate parent to a five year old child and needs at minimum the support of a social worker to set and achieve parenting and home making goals.

I think that's something for OP to answer in terms of notifying child protective services. There are other ways to get some support, though, and calling CPS on a relative seems the less gentle approach in my eyes and probably a fast track way to a family feud.
Unless it's to do with DV, drugs, alcohol issues, patterns of severe neglect and there is evidence to show, there would be a reluctantly for them to tear the child away from the mother. I still don't think what's been mentioned above is enough to warrant a CPS call.

OP it’s strange to read this as both my mother and sister are very, very similar. I I have some experience of autism through work and I am certain they are both on the spectrum.

After various events in my sister’s life they now live together in some squalor and chaos. It is very upsetting for me. For most of my life I have tried to take responsibility for their chaos. I only succeed temporarily and I now realise I just do it to make myself feel better for a while. I can’t change the course of their lives.

I can really empathise with you. It is horrible to see people make such bad choices because they suffer a poor quality of life and in my case (maybe yours too) I feel quite a bit of shame and embarrassment too, that my family live that way. Both my mum and sister are educated and interesting people but they live quite squalid and chaotic lives. I guess you feel some shame too and also quite a lot of anger towards them, especially your sister. You are very judgmental of her. This is what I can really relate to. For years and years I would be angry and upset about my sister’s strange behaviour.

I am now 60 and have been through a lot, as well as having some professional experience of autism. So, it’s perhaps easy for me to say this but you have to detach yourself a little and stop judging and being so angry. Yes, they are both living lives which will cause them problems but they are probably doing the best they can. Being angry with them will really not help. If they have autism it definitely won’t help at all, and probably makes things worse as it causes stress whenever you are with them.

It is a sad fact that there is very little you can do to change most of this. They are adults. Many of the things you say about the way your sister is raising her child are not harmful in themselves but the picture overall is concerning. I do think it might be an idea to get in touch with social services at some point. The main thing you can do is to try and stop being angry. It doesn’t help them and it makes your own life miserable. Try to focus more on making your own life happier. Do what you can for them, and your niece, but understand that you probably won’t be able to change very much. It’s sad, but you will need to accept a lot of it.

@Lexi868

Who said the child would or should be 'torn away from her mother'?

Social services can provide support and guidance and can monitor the sister's progress as she tries to parent. Above all, they can check the welfare of the child, whose interests should be front and centre here.

When a parent and grandparent are not able to provide the absolute basics for a child, then social services should be involved.

Not cooking or cleaning or having nappies on hand means the child is being neglected, and the home life is chaotic and insecure.

There is a lot more to adequate care for a child than simply not shouting at her.

@Lexi868 where do you get the idea that social services ‘tear children apart’ from their parents?!

95 percent of their work is to do with supporting parents so that their children can stay with them. That’s because keeping children in their own family is usually the right thing to do for the child. But on top of that, there are lots of other factors inhibiting social workers from taking a child away. It’s distressing for everyone involved ( including the social worker) and a hell of a lot of extra work for the social worker. I don’t in the least want to sound cynical I just mean that taking a child away is very low down on the list of options for them to consider.

Not all children are raised the same. Not all parents like strict routine and rules. This can be an educated parenting choice and not negligence! Laying down with your child to get them to sleep and bed sharing is very common is many, many cultures and letting small children and babies have their own room is seen as negligent and cruel so it’s all about perspective. She sounds like a fun, independent, loving and protective mum who is very close to her child who she is raising alone. I don’t really see how her being different to you is a big problem? Not everyone is the same. If you don’t like your mum and sister much then don’t see them much?

Thanks for all the advice and insight on here, every point is relevant and I have lots to think about. I didn’t think I was at all angry about this just upset but it’s true it’s not making me happy so I do need to make some peace with it all while keeping an eye on my niece and not carrying any anger over to my own family. I do feel shame and it’s helpful to know that someone else on here has a similar situation.

Isn’t the DD 5? Won’t she struggle with rules at school, being disliked and avoided because she smells, be unhealthy with bad teeth due to dire diet, high chance of going off the rails when older due to inconsistent lifestyle/ bullying by outsiders?
Poor kid.

I said very clearly that they would be very reluctant to do so- I didn't say they would. I have not idea why CPS would be called in this instance. Its a bit dramatic.

@Lexi868

Read the post of 06:04 just before yours to see exactly why the involvement of social services would be highly advisable.

As soon as the child arrives in school my guess is the teacher amd safeguarding lead will flag her and the necessary call to SS will be made.

Must I read it though? Ive already forgotten about this and its not my problem anyway. I said my bit and that's me done
✌

I sympathise with you so, so much OP. My brother is markedly autistic as is my mother, although she isn't diagnosed. My son is diagnosed but the autism is farrrrrr more observable in my mother.

My first point would be that for your mum to neglect pursuing a diagnosis with your sister is incredibly selfish. She had so much chance for help & intervention but that has seemingly passed by.

As a child I found my mum to be strict and unreasonable. She would make up a rule on the drop of a hat and if I enquired about it, she would tell me that "she is the adult and I am the child" so that was the end of the argument. I see as an adult that my mum is actually quite vulnerable, but when growing up she was controlling and inconsistent. She doesn't like any unpredictability, so I think that was her way of dealing with her neurodiversity.

My brother is adorable, but can be such a pain in the bum 😂 I sometimes have to ignore his calls or limit my time with him as I burn out after a while with him!

Unfortunately I think all you can do is limit your time with them, because ultimately they won't change.

Gosh that sounds exhausting. What a shame your mother’s steadfast belief in her own “rightness” dominated everything.

Moving forward, poor executive function (leading to chaotic lives and no routine) is often helped hugely by meds, as it’s a part of ADHD, which has a high correlation with autism. If your sister was to pursue a diagnosis it could really help her.

She's moved in with the mother due to the inability to adequately clean, cook, etc.
She's appointed OP and her DH as well as others as guardians in the event one is needed.
I don't think it's clear to judge from the OP's posts that the mother treats her like "a doll" - she has a different parenting style to the OP and didn't follow a structured opening of presents.
Maybe there are concerns which the OP should flag to SS but I don't think it's clear from their posts.
OP, it sounds like you had a difficult childhood and now have difficult relationships with your mother and sister. If you are able to maintain a relationship for the sake of your niece, then do. How does DN get on in preschool? Have the staff there raised any concerns? Does your DSIS allow any conversation about it? If you expressed surprise about a 5 year old drinking from a bottle still, what would she say? Would she react differently if you emailed something about tooth development and prolonged bottle drinking?

She moved in with her mother who presumably is buying food and nappies And I don't see the issue with cuddling a five year old.