When discipline doesn’t work?

[SpinningFloppa]

What do you do when children don’t care about being told off and just do the same things anyway, I’m tired of disciplining my children they just ignore me and continue to do the things anyway, for example throwing rubbish on the floor. I’ve told them time and time again, made them pick it up, but they still don’t care and will repeatedly do it. This is just the tip of the iceberg there is so much more.

I’m just saying it’s behaviour you associate with a toddler as I’ve heard of toddlers doing it, but I expect it to stop after 2/3. They have time out or things removed but the behaviour doesn’t change
Consistency is key, not expecting the child to grow out of it.

Nobody tells their toddler not to do something a couple of times and 'bang' their toddler doesn't do it again.

How do your set DC up for success?
Eg. Do they know where and how to eat, what the expectations are in advance, or do they snack on demand and wander round the house with their wrappers? If they wander with wrappers then no wrappers are given, if they wander round the house then decide on a routine for snacks.

Go up stream on the drawing on the walls. Are you giving them a yes space/yes time where they're able to draw and do craft? Do they have opportunities to play creatively? What's the expectations for craft play or messy play? What's the tidy up routine?

Look at the behaviour your children exhibit that you don't like and find a way of controlling it in a different way.

OK so one of then problems is DC drawing on the walls and you don't have a table. So channel this behaviour so that they get to do what they need and you control where.

Drawing standing up puts the wrist in a more natural position which is why young children like to do it.

Buy some lining paper, store it somewhere in reach of the artist with whatever medium you are happy with them drawing with. Tell them that if they want to drawer they do it in x room and unroll the lining paper. The still get to make big art but not on the walls.

Alternatively buy a whiteboard, hang it at the child's height and get berol board pens, they come in lovely colours. Would make a great present for this child.

Alternatively an easel or child's table but they take up alot of space. Or you can get craft trays that have areas to store pens and an area to draw.

I think lots of people underestimate the need to have routines for everything with children, not just a general routine for the day but we expect them to know things but actually they have never been told.

A good chunk of the first few weeks of teaching a new class is setting up expectations and routines and practising them. Even in secondary school you have to teach and enforce routines for things that you would expect them to know by that age.

So I suggested upthread to get a white board and pens for your child. I wouldnt just put it up and let them get on with it, I'd teach them how to use it or ask them how they think they should use it, ie pens on board not on wall, how to clean it, replace the lids and put them in the 'whiteboard pen' tub.

Look up and read about logical versus illogical consequences.

Time out and taking toys away for dropping a packet = illogical. No link to the behaviour, random punishment rather than actual teaching. These things don't work very well in the short term and really don't teach anything in the long term.

A logical consequence for dropping packets is not being trusted to have snacks with packets. But at the ages you've said, needing to remind them to put their packet in the bin is still quite normal. It's not really bad behaviour unless they flat out refuse when you ask.

A logical consequence of drawing on walls - they help to clean the wall and repaint if need be. For older children, they pay with their pocket money for specialist cleaning supplies or paint needed. They then have to ask for pens and be supervised using them.

What @Algor1thm said. Plus telling them what TO do not what NOT to do. So don't wait until they are finished their snack. Hand the snack while looking at them in the eye and saying, "package in the bin when you're done". Check for understanding, "where does the package go?" and praise for KNOWING so they feel the love. Short instructions if they do it wrong, "bin" while pointing at it. Never let one go. If it has to sit there until morning, it sits there!

Yeah lots of practising putting things in the bin with support. I wonder if the OP's children are used to having things done for them. I find with things like packets in the bin you have to be consistent from day 1 about independence. No good putting every packet in the bin for them until a certain age and then getting annoyed that they don't do it for themselves all of a sudden.

Well no that’s not the case my older children weren’t like this I already said so clearly it isn’t my parenting but people are quick to blame parenting, I won’t be responding to this thread again as it’s just a typical MN thread opportunity to judge and be bitchy when someone is asking for advice or support, this is parenting forum not aibu.

a typical MN thread opportunity to judge and be bitchy

Who's a what now? I thought I was being helpful. So was PP. No good deed goes unpunished I suppose.

my older children weren’t like this

Some children are biddable. Some need more support, some sibling relationships are different. Mine needed a MASSIVE amount of input when she was 5 but at 11 is extremely independent. Other children are better at 5 but don't progress very much.

Not trying to be bitchy at all, trying to help and give suggestions. You're literallt asking for help and saying you want things to change. No point getting defensive when people suggest things you could try changing. We all have room for improvement, and if you come on a forum asking for help you can't expect people to say keep doing everything exactly the way you are now.

You've literally said your discipline doesn't work and asked what you can do to get your kids to listen to you... then you've said people are "quick to blame parenting". Do you want us to blame your kids instead?