How do children with ASD/PDA think?

[Toloveandtowork]

My son is 11 and may have ASD/PDA. He fits the profile for ASD very loosely, seems more PDA. He refuses to engage in getting a diagnosis. I acknowledge it could be social/ emotional problems, so I don't know what is going on.

This morning, I am very sick, sore throat, fever, cough. I told him several times, but he forgets and is as demanding and unreasonable as ever.

He tried to fix one of his bikes and couldn't. Insisted I help. I reminded again that I'm sick. He goes on a huge rant, shouting to the point of screaming so that neighbours can certainly hear.

Shouting that he is more sick than me, that I must really hate him and that I never do anything for him and that I'm not helping because I want him to be upset.

I'm not good at fixing bikes, and am genuinely unwell. He doesn't care, can't fathom that I could refuse a request. There is nobody else to help at the moment, and he won't wait. He's basically abusive.

He's like this a lot. Highly unpleasant to live with.

Can anyone explain how he might be thinking when he is so unreasonable?

Have you read any of Ross Greene's books, especially The Explosive Child?

It helps because it gets you to view things through a lens of: My child is doing the best that they can, even though it looks unreasonable from the outside. It's likely not that he doesn't care that you are ill. It's more that he has trouble with (in this case)

• Waiting until you or somebody else is able to help with the bike
• Lowering his expectations of you when you feel unwell (maybe even further upstream than this - understanding that you are unwell, understanding that being unwell can cause people's capacity to be lowered, understanding that other people can experience things differently to what he is currently experiencing)

What he is actually doing (shouting, screaming, accusing you of things) is less of the point - those are his reaction to a situation where his skills do not match the expectations placed on him, and the way you get less of those reactions/explosions, according to the book/method, is identify those situations where the expectation outpaces his current level of skill, and problem solve for those situations before they come up. Not easy, not a quick fix, but it does go to the root of the problem.

Try reading parenting rewired. I've only just started it. My ds1 is like this although we are jsut beginning the diagnosis pathway

Thank you both. His behaviour is draining and exasperating and it is s like I'm not a person to him at times like this.
If he's not getting his way, it's unacceptable to him and he can't see or doesn't care about the affect on others.

My son has autism too. I think it's really important to remember autism means lack of theory of mind (the ability to see thing from another's perspective) - he genuinely can't put himself in your shoes (my son can if it's fairly simplistic but when he's stressed and anxious he can't) and because the thing he is expecting doesn't match with reality - anxiety is taking over and making him behave inappropriately and then he again can't see why his behaviour to you is unacceptable. It's not easy though.

Well we don't all think the same, but it sounds as if your son simply hasn't got the understanding required to process you not being able to sort it for him right now. His outbursts are due to his frustration.

Op I feel for you, my pda dd is worst at night when I want to sleep and she’s wide awake. Despite me telling her if the light is off and I am laying still I don’t want to be interrupted she still thinks she can wake me up to demand a conversation. It’s exhausting that I’m not allowed to sleep and even though I know she has poor impulse control and can’t stop jumping on me that’s the time I’m most likely to snap at her. fortunately we now have a melatonin prescription so for five nights a week she sleeps well and I can sleep too.

I find it hard to understand his perspective on things when he kicks off because the behaviour is what would normally be labelled bratty, entitled, cruel, nasty and unempathetic. The behaviour also tramples over my personal boundaries causing anger, bewilderment and dispair.

However, I'm keen to not take a victim stance because that won't help anyone. It's hard to live with this behaviour perhaps several times a day, along with clinginess and neediness.

Learning about where he his coming from helps.

Have a similar situation going on here OP. It’s hard.
I hear you.
Book suggestions very welcome.

@whiwhiteradiatorsun autism does not mean no theory of mind.
Some people who are autistic struggle with this to a certain extent but its not everyone and that is not what autism is or means

Op when my daughter misbehaves I try to think that it’s the end stage of a buildup of sensory and communication issues. I think I’ve seen it described as being like a rucksack that will only contain 3kg of stuff. Each pressure adds 250 g, 500g whatever. A neurotypical person might be able to hold 6kg in their rucksack but when the pda / autistic child hits their 3kg it overflows. It also takes longer to empty their rucksack of the things that cause pressure.

When my dd is waking me up at 2 am or stopping me watch TV because she wants something I assume that she’s upset and try to work out what the cause of that is to help her cope with it. Some children with autism don’t know what emotions they’re feeling so we’ve done Zone of Regulation to help her explain what has upset her. We’re making some progress but obviously it takes time. She is developing strategies to help her when she’s anxious, we see a psychologist who is quite pleased with her progress.

So to answer your question the behaviour you experience is likely to be a result of stress and anxiety and you need to support your child to understand those stresses and reduce their impact. In dds case I dont think she decides it would be a good idea to poke me when I’m asleep because she has no empathy or is a nasty child but because the pressure she’s under has reduced her cognitive ability and empathy and then combines with a natural impulsivity she just can’t stop herself.

I think you need 1:1 help after 11 years it’s going to take active help not reading books to help reset your relationship with your child. Contact your local branch of the National Autistic Society - you don’t need a diagnosis. They do parenting classes and can point you in the right direction of other therapy.

It sounds like you need to have a break from your child is there anybody that you can leave him with for a weekend and just have some time away.

His words and actions come from a place of anxiety and feeling overwhelmed.

He is stressed and anxious because you are ill and therefore not "normal".

My son n is now 18 he is Autistic and has sensory processing issues. I have definitely experienced outbursts of the kind described in the op from him, particularly aged 8-13. I have learned from him what causes these outbursts of unreasonable/ rude seemingly heartless behaviour from a child who is kind and very polite on a day to day basis.

So for example he has an extremely limited range of foods he eats and high anxiety around food / mealtimes. A few years ago I made dinner including oven chips part one of his small menu of acceptable meals. When removing the chips from the oven my oven mitt slipped and I dropped the heavy baking tray on my foot spilling the chips in the process. I bruised my toes badly there was a possibility one may be broken, it hurt a lot, I was trying to not scream or cry. My husband got very angry as ds was seemingly unconcerned about my foot but highly distressed about the chips! I found ds response amusing and he could not understand as he felt our son was being rude and unfeeling.

The way I deal with D's is to separate out what is "expected" from what I need to happen, what outcome is wanted. If I want D's to be a "normal" kid that is not happening. He is a bright sensitive and loving young man, and has to navigate a world where people speak an emotional language that doesn't make sense to him. He can understand it intellectually but that is different to it being instinctual.

So as a boy who cannot eat a large range of foods seeing his dinner spilled on the floor elicits a panic response. He can't do anything about my foot so he sets aside any worries about that and asks if I can put some more chips on, and how long that will take.

He has matured hugely in the last few years and I am getting ready to wave him off to uni in a few days. Fairly certain he will be ok, as we have helped him to put in place support at uni from ASD mentors, other autistic students are in his flat, he has DSA funding in place

Emotional maturity takes longer for autistic young people, the difference between Ds and his 13 yo NT sister are obvious when it comes to emotional intelligence. But the anxious, angry little boy has been replaced by a mature young person, who understands who he is, what he needs and how to explain himself. Those tools come through time, patience, a sense of humour and a diagnosis