True University Costs for Bank of Mum and Dad

[Richielogic]

Nothing anyone can really help me or advise on, its more of a gripe / moan really:-

I have two teenagers both going to UNI. Daughter this year and Son who is a year two student. My wife and I work our socks off full time, usual costs as you can expect and cost of living crisis will hit us like everyone else.

For child 1:-
The uni tuition fees are paid in full at £ 9,250 - great
The maintenance loan is £ 4,524 discounted from £ 9,706 due to means testing.

So Bank of mum and dad are on for £5,200+ to make up the short fall according to SFE.

In reality the uni accommodation alone is £8,096. Yes there were some cheaper ones but due to covid last year and deferred applications for this year, numbers are high and its difficult to secure them.

Also allowance on top to support whilst they settle in, for food and costs to support whilst they find part time jobs etc. So i estimate it is going to cost bank of mum and dad about 9k per child per Uni year

I guess my point is we talk a lot about student debt but in reality it doesn't even cover all the costs associated with them going to University. The maintenance loan doesn't even cover accommodation. Bank of mum and dad cop for a chunk of it.

So in my case i need to net £18k earnings to ensure my two children can go and despite that they will both finish a three year course with £41,322 student loan debt - ridiculous.

What about those children whose parents don't support them??

The way its going, seriously its going to end up that only the elite go. The costs are just obscene.

Some children are having to factor in accommodation costs at the specific university in deciding the University Rather than going to the one that's best for the subject matter and their development

Anyhow it is what it is

Any parents out there helping support this years costs i feel your pain..

@downtonupton tuition fees are paid to everyone who wants them so isn’t really an extra consideration for families. I get that families currently are sometimes taken by surprise about this but as someone else in this thread has said this needs to be brought to parents attention at the very latest when kids start secondary school. A government sponsored information booklet would suffice. Not sure what you mean by “corporate sponsorship” for a degree though - I’ve never heard of this

They can of course stay at home but it is no way the same experience

Corporate sponsorship does exist but it's vanishingly rare (we'll pay your fees and then you work for us). Some big employers are gradually taking up the "degree apprenticeship" scheme -- work for us while doing your degree part-time and we'll pay your fees. However, this doesn't really apply to the more purely academic subjects or essay subjects.

The government should be more upfront that the maintenance loan system is actually a tax. And how much tax a student pays at 18 is based on how much their parents earn. They know it's not right though. The system can't continue this way imo. Something will change when so many people find themselves unable to obtain accommodation as rent increases, maintenance loans do not and parental income and therefore the ability to support dc financially is eroded by inflation.

I've never really thought about this before. I can see why it was never discussed in our house whether me or DB would go to Uni. It would have been impossible.

Can you pay off the student debt in a lump sum once it's been accrued, or does it have to be paid back as a percentage of earnings?

When I was looking round uni accommodation with one of my children the student showing us round said, "Go for the cheap accommodation, that's where you have the best social life." So she did and she was quite happy sharing a kitchen and a bathroom.

You can pay it off whenever you like. Only worthwhile if you don't think it will be written-off after 30 years, obviously!

Thanks @PhotoDad

Apparently it is going to be 40 years for students starting in 2023 (eg mine!)

@downtonupton I doff my hat to you because you are right, that is exactly how it is:

"As parents we go without to ensure our DC can go to university"

Some here posting to the effect that the student should lower their expectations, they never had it so good, "In my day, i shared 20 to a toilet, lived in a cardboard box and eat dust" well i'm sorry but as far as i'm concerned the current gen have had a sh@t time. Covid destroying their recent years, destroying their confidence, friendships, examination fiascos and maybe just maybe class of 2022 starting Uni now have a shot at three or four years uninterrupted university study and experience and some fun. I do hope so. If i can help on their little quest i'm going to do so. I want to do all i can as a parent to make that happen.

My DD does not have ANY high expectations. Yes, she wants to share a kitchen with 6 to 8 others its all part of the experience, the vast bulk of accommodations have the rooms off with en-suite that's the designs now and the way it going and of course she would want the same if possible BUT as i posted, you get what you are allocated - take it or leave it.

But i repeat again, i'm not talking The Ritz here, watch the video i posted in this thread on page 1 - that example room which shares 6 to a kitchen costs £8,703 and illustrates my point. Yes other university's might have more budget accommodation and might do deals and more attention needs to be paid to that when looking at choices but you know we are in 2022 now, we can do things better and we should.

For me personally it wasn't possible until recent years to start to save anything and yes in truth i took my eye off the ball because i was oblivious to the likely parent contributions that would be required. I had no idea and worse i didn't even know if University was something my two would want to do.

Part time jobs are also thin on the ground due to the covid and reductions in retail and hospitality options short in numbers. Also the course needs a minimum of 36hrs a week to work at it and they need some fun time outside of that not just work work work.

At the end of the day, it is what it is. If my thread here brings attention to some parents aware of this situation early its been worth posting it.

Finally, the US style saving schemes sound like a brilliant idea but we don't have that here likewise, giving details and parent talks in year 7 when they start high school also a good call.

Good luck all, i was told once in parenting its just the first thirty years that are the hardest! We do what we can.

Yep, @CloudPop . Rules change for next cohort; again, a lot of parents just aren't aware. My DS is just going into Y11. Seriously encouraging him towards a degree-apprenticeship, as he's a techy sort.

Young people starting now have also been hindered in their ability to earn in a part time job once they turned 16. My child had a job for less time due to this, and I didn’t want them to have a year out earning money for university due to the student finance changes.

What gets me is the huge disparity between the ways universities do things in terms of room allocation etc. It's utterly appalling, and even though we researched things as much as we could, some things are completely out of our control and we lucked out. Then, even once a choice is made, uni systems seem to be very outdated and are a nightmare to navigate.

True anecdote, not meant to be a brag: I guessed that uni fees would go up and up, and we saved too much into DD's CTF (later JISA). I got the sums wrong and put in more than we could really afford in when she was younger, so we went into short-term debt recently. First thing I asked her when it transferred to her name was whether I could borrow a few grand? Luckily she agreed.

Fees were introduced in 1998 - it was pretty obvious then which way HE was going even then in terms of costs. That’s 24 years ago.

If only the NMW for 16-22 year olds was £9.50!

Under 18's - £4.81
18-20 £6.83
21-22 £9.18

And I can't see many parents advocating that their child works a 40 hour week every week of the school holidays (16yo can only work max 35hrs, btw).

People have to think creatively. My father died when I was 17; my mother was clear that she had no further financial responsibilities to me from my 18th birthday. So I worked, got promoted etc. Went to uni 10 years later (whilst working) for a vocational degree related to my work.

I will support my kids as much as possible at that age. But already l am encouraging them to consider apprenticeships, working for a while, vocational FE courses etc. Uni is not the be all and end all, and not right for every child. Mine aren’t hugely academic at this stage. I think too many people see Uni as a prerequisite for all young people and it doesn’t have to be like that.

doing something like medicine where you can't work extra then staying at home is an option.

Ha ha ha ha, that is really funny. I am guessing you haven't had a child apply to medicine. Each uni has a different checklist and a student who might get into one uni wouldn't even be shortlisted at another. That is even before you consider that we don't all live within commuting distance of a university which offers that degree. The same applies to many other degrees which might only be offered in some places or some places might offer degrees which have much lower future value for the student.

Retail and hospitality are crying out for staff since Covid/Brexit - it has never been easier to get shifts. It will probably get harder as the recession hits, but in the last 12 months there have been loads of part time jobs advertised.

Yes the NMW is rubbish for 16-18 year olds, but some jobs pay more than that. Not in retail or hospitality, but things like basic admin work pay more. Both of my older DC have had jobs paying £9.50ph this year, aged 17 and 19.

which was 2 years before DD1 was born - we weren't aware of the impact - we'd done our degrees and were concentrating on our new family.

She did a vocational apprenticeship but DS will go to Uni - sorry we didnt see it coming - same as I am not prepared with savings to pay for my healthcare now the NHS is being run to the ground

I didn't see it coming and didnt want to see it coming

It was the year our eldest was born. DH’s father had a friend that was a (very good) financial advisor. We got told off for not starting saving as soon as we knew I was pregnant.

@shaunathesheep

Most are 18 by the time they sit their a levels so can work 40+ hours a week over their 4 month holiday before uni. What should we be recommending they do? Slouch around smoking weed?

IME most 18+ year olds are paid the 22+ nmw rate in places like supermarkets.

There are more vacancies for young inexperienced workers in cafes and shops than at at any other time in my lifetime. Almost every second window has a vacancies sign up. There's no excuse for a young person not having a PT job. Many current students even got furlough for not working for months!

The stuff that's fun at uni is free. Living with a group. All the uni societies. So much is subsidised. 10% off in lots of shops. Discounted transport etc.

When people talk about living conditions for students and being spoiled not wanting to share 8 to a kitchen etc.

I think it’s worth bearing in mind it’s a substantial amount more debt to be getting in for your substandard housing compared to when many posters here would have gone to uni, and around here rent is crazy expensive! You can rent a tiny room in a repurposed family house for about 2/3 the cost of renting a flat.

Im sure many wouldn’t mind something like sharing 8 to a kitchen and bathroom, if that was reflected in the price.

Accommodation costs have soared because unis make money renting them out in holidays and so decided to upgrade with en suite etc. Also to attract international students. There was nothing wrong with the
cheaper shared kitchen/bathrooms all unis used to have. What people don’t realise is that it is the families on minimum loans that are subsidising this. If the rent is £8k it is likely the students on large loan are getting an automatic bursary because otherwise they would be left with £1k a year to live on and the rents couldn’t be justified if no one on full loan could attend that uni. As single parent DS got max loan, catered hall £8k and £2k bursary reducing his rent to £6k. Bristol also has up to £2060 bursary based on family income - usually income up to c£40k will get some bursary money back off rent. So students on max loan will be getting £11k+ to pay rent of £8k.A student getting min loan would need parent top up / job £6-7k to have the same £11k to live on. Students on max loan can afford to go to uni as there will be financial help to make it affordable to offset the high rent. Those with wealthy families used to paying private school fees etc won’t have a problem paying for studios and en suites. It’s the middle income group that are screwed and effectively paying twice once to make up the loan to full amount and then again to cover the excess rent the loan doesn’t cover so the unis can have conference style accom to rent out. Of course my dc will leave with more debt as have max loans to repay but their loan and bursary will leave them with £100 week termtime to live on meaning they only need to work in holidays. Which is how it should be for everyone. For those who got expensive accommodation allocated they can’t afford they should be apply to uni hardship funds.

@felulageller - calm down, I was merely pointing out the facts.

And there isn't is a 4 month holiday between A levels and going off to uni. This year between DC's last exam and their moving in date is exactly 3 months. Many have left for uni already.

Oh, and did you forget that Covid has screwed over the last 3 cohorts' lives, let alone opportunities to work part-time, learn to drive etc?

The simple fact is that very student should be able to access the full student loan, regardless of parental income.