Worrying for my pregnant friend

[StandTall]

My friend is due to have her 1st baby anytime and I don't think she's ready. Her house has never been that tidy but her cleanliness has deteriorated over the last few years. She has at least 20-30 various pets in the house including a huge untrained rescue dog that can be extremely boisterous. Her house smells of urine, her partner smokes inside, every surface has dirty cups/paperwork/beer cans and the garden is full of animal faeces. The cats walk all over the kitchen surfaces and they have absolutely no problem with this. She's the kind of person that if you push too much with advice she will cut you off and not open up and I am her last friend standing if you will. Her family have tried to help her in the past but she won't let them visit anymore as it causes her too much anxiety when they point out things that need doing. There is absolutely no way she would rehome any of the animals.
She's had no home visits from midwives so they aren't aware of the state of things. I've told her I'll help her sort things out but time is running out. I'm worried she isn't taking it seriously enough how much a baby needs a clean safe environment but if I push too hard she'll cut contact. How can I get her and her partner to take it seriously whilst still being a supportive friend?

Once the baby is born midwives will come to the house and will see the state of it, support should then be offered.

Midwives notmally do a home visit before the baby is due to check the sleeping arrangements.
I think if she slips through the net then you may have to ring ss because no poor baby should live in that filth with a boisterous dog too.

They don't always do home visits. My friend had her baby at the start of the months and she's had to take the baby to a midwife clinic.
If you're really worried you need to speak to her.

@addler

Once the baby is born midwives will come to the house and will see the state of it, support should then be offered.

That's what I was hoping but I want to help her understand things need to change before the baby arrives. I have to take my clothes off at the door and have a shower when i get home after visiting them - I know she would be devastated if she knew that.

@Riseholme

Midwives notmally do a home visit before the baby is due to check the sleeping arrangements. I think if she slips through the net then you may have to ring ss because no poor baby should live in that filth with a boisterous dog too.

I totally agree. I think I'm just going to have to be straight with her.

I don’t think midwife postnatal visits in the home are back to universal yet. They aren’t in my area. I think you should have a serious talk with her and, if nothing changes or she cuts you off, SS referral.

Can you start with something manageable and specific like where baby is going to sleep? Has she bought something, where is it going to go, will it follow safe sleep guidance (partner’s smoking aside) and how will she stop cats jumping in?

If you keep the conversation focused on one thing maybe that will not be too overwhelming for her and will allow her open up about some other things.

Does her partner live there too? What is your relationship with him like? Could you try to appeal to him if the refusal to acknowledge the problem comes mainly from her? Personally, I would contact social services now. Far better that she has intervention now than then she is in the throws of post birth chaos. Also, have you never been concerned for these pets? Clearly she has too many, get in touch with a charity or the vet and raise concerns there.

@Riseholme

Midwives notmally do a home visit before the baby is due to check the sleeping arrangements. I think if she slips through the net then you may have to ring ss because no poor baby should live in that filth with a boisterous dog too.

No they definitely don't do a home visit before baby arrives. I've had two babies recently, many friends, sisters and sisters in laws have all had babies over the last few years and no one has had a visit beforehand.

The MW do however come twice in 10 days after baby is born. Then the HV also visits the home.

This sounds like an awful place to welcome a child. Makes me sad reading stuff like this. This is not the home for a child ffs.

@cigarettesNalcohol my dd has just had a home visit at 34 weeks for this reason.
Must be her area.

I don't think there's any point in trying to talk to her. You need to tell Social Services about your concerns. It sounds a horrific place to bring a baby home to.

She doesn't have to let anyone in, midwife or HV, after the birth or before. Unlikely she will suddenly become co operative if she hasn't engaged so far. If it is genuinely that bad ring SS and raise it in terms of asking for their advice, flag it to them.

@Somuddled

Does her partner live there too? What is your relationship with him like? Could you try to appeal to him if the refusal to acknowledge the problem comes mainly from her? Personally, I would contact social services now. Far better that she has intervention now than then she is in the throws of post birth chaos. Also, have you never been concerned for these pets? Clearly she has too many, get in touch with a charity or the vet and raise concerns there.

Yeah we get on well, he's just a bit immature and will go along with what she says. I think i could get him on his own for a chat or a walk with the dogs. The pets are loved and fed well it's just the cleaning up and number of them that causes the issue i think. Totally agree with sorting it now and i think i will keep SS in mind if nothing changes.

@ActonBell

Can you start with something manageable and specific like where baby is going to sleep? Has she bought something, where is it going to go, will it follow safe sleep guidance (partner’s smoking aside) and how will she stop cats jumping in?

If you keep the conversation focused on one thing maybe that will not be too overwhelming for her and will allow her open up about some other things.

I think you are spot on with her being overwhelmed. I might suggest a tip run or something. The smoking thing I'm going to say something - it's just not on

@LemonChiffon

I don't think there's any point in trying to talk to her. You need to tell Social Services about your concerns. It sounds a horrific place to bring a baby home to.

I know, I was kind of hoping it would give her a kick up the bum but nothings changed since she found out. I wouldn't want to cause any extra stress for her and would like to see if I can help her before they have to be involved. The closer her due date gets the more worried I am.

@OakRowan

She doesn't have to let anyone in, midwife or HV, after the birth or before. Unlikely she will suddenly become co operative if she hasn't engaged so far. If it is genuinely that bad ring SS and raise it in terms of asking for their advice, flag it to them.

This is my worry, and also if i push too much she'll stop letting me in too. I work within adult services so could probably find someone to ask off the record.

Report it.

Also if you try and speak about it off the record with colleagues within services aren't they then under a duty of care to report it as child wrlfate/safeguarding concerns, aren't you already if you work in a similar field? Clearing her house out for her, to help her is enabling her isn't it, not helping her change.

@OakRowan

Also if you try and speak about it off the record with colleagues within services aren't they then under a duty of care to report it as child wrlfate/safeguarding concerns, aren't you already if you work in a similar field? Clearing her house out for her, to help her is enabling her isn't it, not helping her change.

I don't know about duty of care for something off the record and how could they act on it without personal info from me? I know how to make a safeguarding referal from a past job and have no issue doing it. I am one of the few people she has though I don't think I could do that to her without trying to talk to her. I think before she got pregnant I just accepted thats how she lived - obviously now thats all changed.

I don't know, sorry I guess it just made me think of what would you do if someone else came to you and described the same situation at work, would you be uneasy about it, concerned enough to advise reporting, or is it something that SS wouldn't be concerned about, at this stage. The house is dirty, heaving with belongings and animals and he smokes indoors? I suppose SS see a lot worse, midwives too, but it does sound awful. Wpuld it last if you offered to have a big clear out and clean before baby arrives, would she accept it, has she ever asked you for help before? Would it make any difference really trying to help her.

@OakRowan

I don't know, sorry I guess it just made me think of what would you do if someone else came to you and described the same situation at work, would you be uneasy about it, concerned enough to advise reporting, or is it something that SS wouldn't be concerned about, at this stage. The house is dirty, heaving with belongings and animals and he smokes indoors? I suppose SS see a lot worse, midwives too, but it does sound awful. Wpuld it last if you offered to have a big clear out and clean before baby arrives, would she accept it, has she ever asked you for help before? Would it make any difference really trying to help her.

Definitely if I had concerns with someone at work I'd report it. I think I just don't want to run the risk of falling out with her. She'll know it would have come from me you see with nobody else visiting. She's never asked me for help despite me offering loads, especially recently.

I think you have to break down concerns and consider whats unsafe and whats not up to your standards.

For example - cats walking on worktops amd paperwork on surfaces is standards, boisterous dogs, smoking inside and animal faeces is a safety issue so that where I would start with any advice.

Ultimately, I would imagine that any advice may fall on deaf ears as you have mentioned she is defensive around this. It's honourable that you want to support your friend, but I do think if baby is that close to arriving, a discussion with social care might be better - if you're waiting to see whether friend will allow someone in after birth, what if she doesn't or baby comes to (unintentional) harm? I think my advice to a professional would be to encourage more engagement and to try to work to support her and her partner, but as a friend unfortunately you don't have much duristiction here.

If you work with SS you know you need to report your concerns.

@Duracellbunnywannabe

If you work with SS you know you need to report your concerns.

I don't work directly with SS now but my current area of work is connected! I haven't been very clear about that but if I say too much and she happens to read it it would be pretty obvious. My issue is that she's my friend and i don't want to make her life harder.