Religion

[Interracialbabysmom]

Hey mommies!

I am very new here so excuse my mistakes. So let me quickly introduce my family. Me and my partner have been together for 8 yrs, i am catholic, and he is muslim. None of us are very religious and never tried to force the other to change theirs. We had an islamic ceremony, as my partner's parents would not let us to be together otherwise, and i did not have an issue with it. I became pregnant with a boy last year October. As we live with my partner family, i knew he would be influenced by islam more then my religion, and again i have no problem with that, as he is free to choose even later whatever he wants to be. We decided i can celebrate my holly holidays with him if i want to anyway.
So there is the problem coming now. My parter has stated our son has to be a muslim and nothing elsee, and he has to be circumcised and has to have his hair shaved. I have always said when it came to our conversation that i would never do that to my child, i mean circumcision. The haircut i have never heard about it, ans one day when baby was a few days old his father without asking me caller a barber to shave his hair. I nearly passed out and sent him home and refused the procedure. Now my partner since that time been trying to force me to both things with baby, and blaming me to be disrespectful, racist. He says i shud be grateful for all the things his family has done for me and i shud let their wish to happen. I know the haircut just a haircut but because the way they wanted to do it, and because i adore my babys beautiful hair the way it is i keep saying no. Circucision is an other no. Never i woukd hurt my son.
Now because of this he doesnt talk to me or his son. He said he will not accept him as his son until i say yes.
I dont know what to do. I cannot let any of these happen, but i know this wasly i will probably go tk depression because of the continious blackmailing. Break up would be the best decision maybe but even tho he is not talkimg to us now, he will never let his son to go away, especially because i am from an other country.
I really in a bad situation so if anyone can help with am advice, or been in similar situation and can talk to me about it i would appreciate it.
Thanks xx

Ok so you commented on my thread, let me comment here to maybe explain some things :)

1. your husband is an ass for blackmailing you. I think we should revisit this point as this isn’t right, but for the time being I’ll focus on the head shaving and circumcision issue.
2. your husband isn’t religious. This to me is a biggie, it’s about keeping up with appearances of the ‘community’. Could I ask what ethnic background your husband is from? That will play a huge role here.
3. shaving of the head, well your husband is a bit late here, it’s meant to be done within the first week of life. It may seem alien but it’s actually a beautiful tradition. The babies head is shaved and the weight of the hair in gold or silver donated to charity. It’s the baby’s first of many acts of charity. I think it’s beautiful. But it’s a sunnah so a commendable voluntary act or way of the prophet. So islamically speaking there is reward if you chose to do it but no sin if you don’t.
4. circumcision is also sunnah not wajid or fardh (duty or obligatory) but it’s been so adopted by culture that people think it is. There are varying schools of thought, that a) it has to be done on the 7th day or on the cusp of puberty. Also for converts circumcision isn’t a necessary part of conversion so one should question if it’s necessary if you’re born into the religion. Could you state to your partner you’ve done your research and you’d rather wait until puberty, because a) buys you time b) your husband will probably forget c) your son can actively refuse d) if he decides to go ahead with it whilst painful it’s unlikely to be as damaging or dangerous

But back to point one, I’m really concerned that your husband is being abusive and blackmailing you into doing something you don’t feel comfortable with. Is he always like this?

@Kanfuzed123
Thank you so much for commenting:) yes he has always been like this but i thought he will change for the baby. He is pakistani and his family is quiet religious, but himself not really following anything. He mostly wants to do it for his parents and because he is saying he wants his son to be a muslim and nothing else or otherwise he will not accept him. They never really forced me to change my religion, ans i really respect that, and i would not have a problem if they teach islam to their grandson. It is really hard to be in this battle alone, and even if they dont say anything to my face my husband does and it hurts that he cares more about his family, religion then my feelings

You need to explain that you know its a sunnah. There's no sin from not being circumcised, otherwise new male converts would need to be circumcised to be accepted and that's not the case.

Sadly, being a Liberal Muslim, as you thought he was, is, a piece of string and its most definitely a spectrum that is not forever static.

If you want to message me, we can chat more, I know a lot!

[quote Interracialbabysmom]@Kanfuzed123
Thank you so much for commenting:) yes he has always been like this but i thought he will change for the baby. He is pakistani and his family is quiet religious, but himself not really following anything. He mostly wants to do it for his parents and because he is saying he wants his son to be a muslim and nothing else or otherwise he will not accept him. They never really forced me to change my religion, ans i really respect that, and i would not have a problem if they teach islam to their grandson. It is really hard to be in this battle alone, and even if they dont say anything to my face my husband does and it hurts that he cares more about his family, religion then my feelings[/quote]
He wouldn’t accept his own son if he wasn’t circumcised? Or if he wasn’t Muslim?

Your husband needs to brush up on his deen (religion) being circumcised isn’t a condition of being a Muslim. This is an ignorant and stupid cultural attitude. I’ve had it a lot from my in laws too but they are just stupid so I don’t listen to them. My husband does want our son to be circumcised at one point but I’m adamant it will be his choice.

Could you maybe show your husband some facts around the anatomy of the penis in infancy that would make him change his mind. You know how the foreskin is fused to the tip of the penis and it has to be ripped off, and it’s very easy to take too much skin and that can cause unnatural painful tightness, curving or worse a buried penis. Plus there is the fact that the baby doesn’t have an anesthetic, if you think of how sensitive the penis is, to operate like that without anesthetic, needlessly painful when there is clear Islamic precedent for the procedure being done prior to puberty and at least then, they are in a sterile operating room, under anesthetic and given pain relief after and more importantly can consent and more importantly refuse to have the procedure done. I know this isn’t ideal but it kicks the can down the road.

Also don’t be too grateful his family haven’t forced you to convert, to do so would be completely haram. It’s permissible for Muslim men to marry Christian and Jewish women and for them to keep their faith and celebrate their holidays, in fact the Muslim husband has to take the wife to church if she so wishes. You cannot be forced or coerced into accepting Islam ‘there is no compulsion in religion’.

Btw my husband is of the same cultural background, it’s tough, they are very insular and not open minded at all and generally quite prejudice against other races. (DH’s family not the entire Pakistani community of course)

What about if you just shaved his head, like a grade 2 or something? As a compromise? Although I bet this is just for appearance sake here and the family don’t actually do the charity aspect.

With your husband though, I think it was naive to think he’ll change after baby, to he honest with you, he’ll most likely get worse, especially if he hes very conscious of what ‘others’ might think. You might want to reflect on that and how you see things moving forward xx

@ChoiceMummy thanks and i will message you x

@Kanfuzed123
He says as a muslim he has to be circumcised and be like them. And he can not be anything other then muslim. So if i will not let the surgery happen then he will not accept him as he will not be a muslim. I will try to speak to him about what you said but i know its going to be like talking to a wall. And i feel if i let the shaving happen then he will still want the circumcision too, as he more arsed about that x

[quote Interracialbabysmom]@Kanfuzed123
He says as a muslim he has to be circumcised and be like them. And he can not be anything other then muslim. So if i will not let the surgery happen then he will not accept him as he will not be a muslim. I will try to speak to him about what you said but i know its going to be like talking to a wall. And i feel if i let the shaving happen then he will still want the circumcision too, as he more arsed about that x[/quote]
Thing is though, he is wrong, you are still a Muslim even if you aren’t circumcised.

Plus no religious acts are incumbent on a child until 7 and then it’s prayer and fasting isn’t incumbent until puberty, so it literally doesn’t affect anything.

A convert to Islam is still a Muslim even if they aren’t circumcised.

Your husband is ridiculous. Please be wary of this attitude, where does it stop? First circumcision then what Forced marriage because his parents want their grandson to marry so and so’s grand daughter… get stuffed.

I think you might win more flies with honey here, heavily research the school of thought that says you can get it done at puberty and say you’re not saying no, just not right now. Due to potential side effects and infection from being in nappies etc. To me it’s very very odd how much focus is put on a child’s genitals.

But if he doesn’t back down or at least see reason here, please sit and have a think about how far this can go. He can hit you because you disobeyed him, yeah because Islamically he can (divisive and obviously backward school of thought here), you owe him sex whenever he fancies? He can marry other women without telling you, he can force your son into marrying someone he doesn’t want to etc, beat your son because he doesn’t fast or pray?Time to sit and have a think about your husbands character.

@Kanfuzed123 thanks for all the advices lovely x i will be very cautious ans will think setiously about this

[quote Interracialbabysmom]@Kanfuzed123 thanks for all the advices lovely x i will be very cautious ans will think setiously about this[/quote]
Feel free to PM, ive been through it all and some. I’m Muslim too :)

@Kanfuzed123 thanks xx messaged you