Is 18 months too young for discipline

[Mouscadoo]

Might be a stupid question but is 18 months too young to start introducing discipline. For instance "if you keep throwing this on the floor I will have to put you down". Is this futile with an 18 month old?

As an aside, toys might be us breakable but other children (especially babies) are not.
A lot of kids prefer not to be hit by flying toys.

I would absolutely have told off my 18 month old for throwing toys.
No wonder there are so many wild children at groups that do what they like and ruin it for everyone else.

54321nought I think the overwhelming majority of adoptive parents would be horrified at your statements. It’s not discipline they are seeking to impose it is attachment. They are seeking to build bonds of love and trust and as you do that children respond. OP for me this is just exploration and play - they outgrow it. Sometimes you can’t play or the item can’t be returned but it’s no biggie. If you want want your child to do it less just don’t react. They crave your attention - a strong positive or negative response can see behaviour repeated.

Obviously if it’s a big toy at the play group it has to be redirected to a ball against a wall. Redirection and engagement covers most moments.

[quote AssassinatedBeauty]@54321nought do you have any evidence to back up that claim, that isn't your own opinion or personal experience? Everything I've ever read about child development disagrees with you.[/quote]
no, it isn't my own opinion! It is known fact - although "discipline" might not be the word used, certainly a sense of right and wrong HAS to be there by 18 months, or it NEVER will be.

I don't know what child development books you are reading, but I suspect "pop" psychology, rather than up to date developments in neuroscience

I've cared for traumatised children and children with attachment disorders for decades, and am professionally trained

@QualityMarguerite

54321nought I think the overwhelming majority of adoptive parents would be horrified at your statements. It’s not discipline they are seeking to impose it is attachment. They are seeking to build bonds of love and trust and as you do that children respond. OP for me this is just exploration and play - they outgrow it. Sometimes you can’t play or the item can’t be returned but it’s no biggie. If you want want your child to do it less just don’t react. They crave your attention - a strong positive or negative response can see behaviour repeated.

but attachment is related to an innate sense of right and wrong - you can't have one without the other

Attachment can start long before a moral sense of right and wrong is developmentally possible.

Children who are adopted at older ages may have multiple traumas that have impacted on different parts of their brain development. Some of these after awful starts still thrive later and develop a good sense of right snd wrong. I mean this is overkill for the OP but how well her child behaves in the long term is not predicted by whether she punishes or redirects you throwing at 18months.

Ball throwing not your throwing - that would be a problem!

@54321nought what is an ‘innate sense of right and wrong’ at that age? I mean, how is that displayed?

"I don't know what child development books you are reading, but I suspect "pop" psychology, rather than up to date developments in neuroscience "

Ah. No doubt. With the benefit of your professional training, @54321nought, could you specify one reference - book, research, other suitable academic content- that states exactly what you've said here about a sense of right and wrong? Thanks.

What do you mean by ‘put her down’?

I really find the use of the word discipline in regards to an infant disconcerting and disturbing

You can teach a child, talk to them at their level In words they understand, ie we don’t do this, discipline can mean to punish in this context and no you can’t be punishing your eighteen month old. What a question.

@54321nought

I mean no, as in not futile! and you really can't leave it any later to start discipline

Yes you can. Discipline means punish in this context and no one should be punishing an 18 month old infant.

Ah. No doubt. With the benefit of your professional training, @54321nought, could you specify one reference - book, research, other suitable academic content- that states exactly what you've said here about a sense of right and wrong? Thanks.

This.

@54321nought

your statements make zero sense.
are you in a cult?

Too young to give a completely unrelated consequence to the behaviour such as if you throw the toy, I will send you to your room (IMO this is never the best way of dealing with 'undesirable' behaviour at any age.

Not too young for a natural consequence - if you hit me with that toy, I will take it away until you are ready to play with it/if you want to throw that toy, it will break so I am going to take it away and give you a ball to throw instead

Ignore the ridiculous comparisons with adopted children which are referring to those who have been through trauma, it is not comparable in any way to a happy and loved 18 month old

@newmum234

Honestly, it has never even occurred to me to discipline my 16 month old for throwing a toy. Why can’t they throw toys, is it really that big a deal? Surely they’re just exploring at that age!

Reasons off the top of my head: there's a baby nearby, there are items in the room that might get broken, you're in someone else's house, the child is generally overexcited and needs to calm down. Children need boundaries and there is nothing upsetting about a firm no sometimes.

Not related to the quoted post but the issue I see around me is parents who wanted to talk through every behaviour or always allow children to 'explore' a situation, whether appropriate or not. The children are now 3 though (though still referred to as 'toddlers') and their parents still don't think they are old enough to be told no. It's obviously developmental for children to push boundaries but that doesn't mean parents don't need to teach them right from wrong. The most popular teachers in primary schools are often some of the strictest ones, which I think shows children aren't upset by clear boundaries.

Redirect, distract, short explanation yes. But a natural consequence e.g. you threw it behind something, it's gone now. It makes no sense to say 'play nicely or no biscuit at snack time' as suggested by a PP- why??? That's not a logical sequence, even to me as an adult and again comes back to food as reward/treat/ issues. An 18mo cannot link those two separate things.

We generally found that making a version of the activity acceptable (e.g. a door fiddleboard rather than every flipping door and cupbaord in the house) or throw a ball outside worked- if it is in some way, 'allowed', it becomes less interesting. Plus, at this age, and until much older, there will not be any impulse control- they may know they shouldn't but doesn't mean they won't. And if a consequence of doing x is a reaction from mummy, that may make it all the more interesting

Ask any adoptive parent if it is possible to start disciplining a totally undisciplined child once they are already 18 months old

If they don't already have a sense of right and wrong by then, it will NEVER become innate..

If a child has TRAUMA before 1 and their behaviour is affected it is likely to affect them going forward.

Right and wrong are absolutely 100% not formed before 18 months. ExSW, friend of many adoptive parents, actual psychology qualifications and parent of a child who was an absolute nightmare at 18 months (ADHD) and an empathetic delight now at 10.

You're talking shit. 18 month olds don't even have theory of mind FFS.