Almost 4 and afraid of the potty

[Ahhcrap]

Heya! I just wondered if anyone has experienced similar and can give some advice?
My son is approaching 4 and still isn’t toilet trained, I have tried on several occasions since the age of around 2 but have had no luck. I’ve never been overly pushy because I want him to feel ready and I know that it would ultimately backfire.
I’ve tried huggies training pants to get him used to the wet feeling but he is unphased. I bought a load of cloth training pants online and he has generally flat out refused to use them… however today I got them out again and he actually picked the one he liked most and let me put them on. He wore them for a couple of hours and every now and then I would ask if he needed a wee and explained they wouldn’t hold wee like nappies. In the end it got close to bedtime so I had to take them off anyway but given his small bladder he must of been holding it?
When I suggested he try to sit on the potty he got visibly upset, I asked if he wanted me to put the seat on the big toilet like his friends use and got a resounding no. In the end he got really tearful and told me he is scared of sitting on the toilet. I’ve always explained things gently to him, he’s seen me use the loo and knows his friends are in big pants - he even got excited today when I put the training pants on saying they are like his cousins, which is progress I guess but he still won’t attempt the toilet.
I’m just at a bit of a loss as to how I approach this, I don’t want to get him worked up because it will play into that fear and make it worse but I know he is well behind his peers in this respect. Sorry for the essay, but any advice is appreciated!

What about the Fisher price little toilet that sings when you wee in it. He can put his own little toulet roll on as well and pretend to flush. Then it's not a potty and not a toulet but inbetween.

Thanks for the reply! The one I’ve got is like a mini toilet with a flush (though it doesn’t sing, maybe that’s the vital mistake!)

Get a step and get his father to teach him how to pee standing up. He might need a step. A table tennis ball with a target helps.

Don’t make a bit negotiated fuss about it just do it. Into pants full time or leave him with bottom half off. Insist on use of loo before doing anything he wants and reward success.

Is his dad about? Can they do stand up wees together?

I wouldn't use training pants etc. Just put him in normal pants. My dc needed to recognise the horrid feeling of wet or soiled pants to encourage them to train.

Complete cold turkey.
No nappies/ pull-ups/training pants.
Cotton underpants (big boy pants) or naked from the waist down.
No chat about it, TELL him…..pants or nothing. Then take him to the toilet every twenty minutes. Yes, you might be doing a lot of mopping up and washing, but it’s got to be done.
I had to do it this way with my almost 4 year old. Took 2 days & she was trained during the day, another month and dry during the night too.
She’d just been lazy & stubborn.
Good luck.

Oh we used a padded toilet seat thing that sat on the big toilet.

Same here OP. My youngest is going to be 4yo next month and still isn't toilet trained. I tried last weekend, but he just isn't understanding... going to give a two week break then try again 😩

Ds likes to pee in a plastic jug or free wee in the garden. Now he’s trained he won’t free wee and has to wee in a bottle when we are out in our fields!
Will he wee in the bath or a bucket or whatever takes his fancy? Would he water the garden with his wee. We had to be quite creative at the beginning of potty training.
It was fairly easy to redirect him to the loo or potty once he had stopped using nappies

Thanks all, to respond to a few comments - his dad is about but we are separated so he only really sees him every other weekend and when he goes he can be a bit useless (in a feed him junk, give him the tablet and forget to bathe him kind of way 😬) so I doubt he would do much.
As for cold turkey, I’ve attempted that before but he’s always had some sensory issues and can’t stand his legs bare - even in the midst of heatwaves he’s had to have at least knee length shorts on or he has a melt down. And again I’m kind of worried to add to that existing fear.
I do have one of the seat things for the big toilet and a stool so currently potty is in the living room and the other stuff is in the bathroom upstairs.
He knows what pee/poo is and when he’s doing it - he even goes to find somewhere private to poo and will hold it if he’s at preschool or out somewhere, so it’s not at all a lack of understanding!

Could you try a potty that's a bit less toilet like. He's scared of the toilet, but his potty is a smaller version of one. Good basic old fashion potty to get him trained, then work on the toilet phobia.

Also he does wee in the bath sometimes (and we’ve had one or two poos but weirdly they have all been quite recent and before that he never had!). He loves watering the garden in the traditional sense though so you could be onto something there 😂

@amylou8 that did cross my mind and I showed him some pictures earlier of different types and asked which he liked most and he picked the one we have!

We had weeks of poo in the bath (I even bought a special sieve) before we transitioned to the loo!

I think fear of the toilet is relatively common (or at least not unusual), I've heard of children withholding poos in particular. My Dd did. We found the book/app poo goes to poo land quite helpful (if grim!). Having read your posts, this is what I think I would do. Practice sitting in the toilet without him actually going. Just sit on it with trousers on at first. Maybe read him some books while he is sitting. Aim is to get rid of the fear. Maybe show him you using the loo, talk him through it, show him the flush. Then move on to suggest that he sits on to see if he needs a wee before he gets in the bath, so use that as an excuse really, with no pressure that he actually goes. Then in a couple of weeks or when you think, I think i agree with pp, no nappy, no training pants, cotton pants or commando, elastic waist trousers only. If he's still reluctant (hopefully not) then take a bit of pressure off by letting him to wee in a jug, or in the garden, or stand up wee in the toilet. I've heard that you can put cheerios down the loo to aim at?! Good luck

I’d go slow: celebrate the progress today (lots of praise) - maybe tomorrow he’ll sit on something!

Bribe him to sit on the potty or loo with chocolate buttons.

@mayblossominapril I’m sorry as I know that must have been a nightmare for you… but the poo sieve gave me a serious giggle 😂
@Orangeinmybluelightcup that sounds like a really good plan actually, as I said he’s seen me using the loo a lot (in fact he pretty much always insists on coming with 😳) but you could be onto something with the fear reduction and I will definitely look into the book!

Could you try a urinal? Then over time move from that to stand up wees using the toilet, and then from that move to sitting on the toilet?

We got a little ‘toilet’, it also worked for my nephew. I would do away with the potty and the toilet seat. Mine sat straight onto the normal toilet seat after not too long, I don’t think a four year old needs this.
Mine could wee standing up at three (his dad taught him, it would not have crossed my mind to get him doing that so early) - he thinks it’s great fun. Has he given this a go? Then he doesn’t need to worry about sitting.
Also the ‘cloth pants’ do hold wee quite well. Cheap proper pants are better (for feeling wet, not for your carpet) if they wee themselves it will literally go down their legs and they have no doubt about what has happened.

You’ve probably tried something like this, but we only got started properly when I decided to ‘play’ toilet with some of his toy dinosaurs. First it was one dinos turn, then another’s and eventually the dinosaurs told DSs to sit on the toilet. They also have more authority than me when it comes to eating vegetables...

@Rosesareyellow 😂 ahh, those pesky dinos certainly rule the roost at your house! I actually haven’t tried that… I’ve tried charts, rewards and pretty much everything I have found on google but not that 🤦‍♀️ Will be giving it a go (and maybe it might work with veggies as well! 🤞)
As for the standing, I just don’t think he has any means for comparison - he’s seen me on the loo but I doubt he’s seen his dad weeing standing up. I think I did mention it to his dad some time ago but I know certainly when he lived here he was very private in that respect (granted as was I but privacy is a privilege I lost long ago!)

Do not force him. My son was the same. I tried to train him by putting pants on him and he just continually peed himself or held it in all day. I couldn't get him to sit on a potty or the toilet. I was anxious because all my friends younger children were trained.

I left the (normal) pants in his drawer and a couple of weeks after he turned 4, he woke up one day and said he wanted to wear them. We've never looked back as far as pees are concerned with none of this having to go bare bum or run around after him cleaning up pee and he will happily sit on the toilet and do one at home, other houses, nursery and in public with no issue. He still wears a pull up at night though.

Poos are another matter in that he still wants a pull up on and refuses to even try the toilet for one. I'm just leaving it and hoping it too will come when he's ready.

I could have written your post word for word! My son is the exact same. Nearly 4 and gets very fearful of the toilet/potty. Also hates having bare legs, wants to be warm always. We have started having more playtime in the bathroom so it’s not so scary for him and he gets used to the noises and temperature. I have had to park the training for now as he was getting too anxious. He was even talking about it in his sleep. We are now reading books and using the Pooland app and hopefully try again soon. It was nice to read about someone else with a similar story, thank you.