9 year old not using cuterly

[Fibrosucks00]

I'm concerned, my very nearly 9 year old won't use his knife and fork. Makes a mess every where. Won't sit down properly at the table. Shovels down food like I won't feed him again.
Constantly hoovering after him as our toddler has severe food allergies and goes and picks the food off the floor and eats it.

Pees all round the toliet floor and seat, doesn't clean it up.

Has a bit of an attitude when he doesn't want to go to bed. He's becoming a teenager already.

Otherwise he is a lovely boy.

What should I do? I'm getting seriously frustrated!

He cant be eating stuff like lasagne with hands though surely?

When you say his Dad doesnt gave these problems, do you mean cutlery is used if Dad us in charge of mealtime?
If so, you absolutely know it is laziness, you tell him the rules are changing with immediate effect, and pee is to go in the toilet, and cutlery is yo ve used or XYZ happens. And stick with the punishment everytime.

If it's something he cant do, (and the more you say it isnt this) you need a GP referral for dyspraxia type issues.

Have you asked him why he won't use cutlery?

Could it be painful for him?

My DD needed special cutlery as her hands were Hypermobile, so normal cutlery would hurt

You need to get tough with him.

No cutlery. Remind once.
"DS, pick up your knife and fork. Eating with a knife and fork is polite"
If he fails to do so, take the plate away.
"I am removing your plate until you can promise that you will use your knife and fork."
Give back if he apologises.
If he does it again, take it away again.

Repeat ad nauseum.
My mum had the same issue with my brother.

You have to establish the rules, plain and simple and FOLLOW UP. Every. Time. Don't argue or negotiate. Sanctions if necessary.
Toilet is cleaned thoroughly every time he pees all over it. Stand over him and instruct him. Every time.

If he doesn't do it with dad, it's laziness plain and simple.

My eldest is Autistic, ADHD, Dyspraxic (now 17). He can do lots of things but finds some of them very challenging. We have boundaries and have things that we accept to let slip. Some of the things that work for us could be a compromise to try and a step forwards from where you are, then you can consider how far beyond that to push.

He sits down to wee most of the time.

He found/ finds using a knife and fork very challenging but can do it - not always cut. We eat a lot of bowl food that bite sized pieces and can be eatten with just a fork, also less chewing as DS has issues with chewing and swollowing. One utensil is far easier to coordinate than two - its a potential compromise.

We now use big pasta bowls that have a wide rim this helps prevent lots of food spilling off the plate. We use plastic drinking bottles for drinks. We use plastic bowls/ plates when not at the table.

DS gets very unsettled by unexpected things so we live by routine. So before a routine was established, if bedtime/ lights out was to be 9pm. I would prompt after a 6pm meal - there are now two hours of activity then at 8pm it will be teeth/ wash/ Pj's time. If you do that quickly you can have 30 minutes quiet time in your room before lights out at 9pm. At 7.30 I'd say 30 minutes to finish off what you're doing.

I like to have worked out what an appropriate and proportional sanction is for refusing to get with a task in advance of the strop. That way I can stay calm.

Internet access is one of the big ones that hits hard for DS and is quite easy to administer for me. 10 minutes less is sufficient for each act of strop. That way I can say 10 minutes off, allow a couple of minutes to calm down and repeat the request, then take another 10 minutes if necessary.

He’s pushing the boundaries, you’re letting him.

Can you remove things if he continually makes a mess of the bathroom? Have a chart or similar. Timer so he goes every 2 hours or so, avoid too much fizzy juice or diluting as that def makes mine go more. As pp said stand over and spot check.

As for the cutlery if he uses his fingers, remove the food. However I’d lay down your expectations before he sits down, so he knows what you expect and what will happen if he doesn’t comply. Just in a nice way and sit down to your meal together. It may take a while but you need to be very consistent and follow through. I’d also feed both kids the same and have nothing your toddler can react to in your house. If you’re concerned about him/his development speak to school and the gp

What type of food do you cook that he can eat with his hands? Whatever it is, stop cooking it and serve things like soup or stew that are impossible to eat with hands.

Blimey the pathologising of life's rich tapestry is so prevalent on MN. He just sounds a bit lazy when he's at home. Reward good behaviour - either immediately or by giving him a token towards something if he is mature enough to delay gratification. My son used to get to wear his Star Wars pants for bed if he flushed the loo and put the seat down. If he eats nicely he gets to watch TV/go to the park/play a card game with you as a reward. Positive reinforcement.

If he eats nicely he gets to watch TV/go to the park/play a card game with you as a reward. Positive reinforcement.

Sorry, but I disagree here. He should be using cutlery and using the toilet correctly because it is good manners and it is respectful of other people, not because of a reward. Peeing all over the seat for someone else to clean up is disgusting and by 9 he should know better. Having to give him a reward or presenting it as a choice is setting up a negotiation which can be exhausting for all involved.

Could you try and give him food that he can't eat with his hands??

Like someone has said above, maybe lasagne, shepherd's pie, soup, curry, chilli....all these things he'd need to use something other than his hands.

I personally would start serving these things most of the time so that he's pushed into using the cutlery. You can always explain that it's not polite or clean to use his hands for his food and since he refuses to use his cutlery for other food, this is all he can have until he learns.

When it first started, was there anything particular going on that might have upset him?

I'm wondering if there's something wrong, and he's acting it out with this odd behaviour.

Good replies here and I agree. Be strict, however if there's anything else in his behaviour which you think is odd, or if he seems especially slow to respond to punishment then I would take him to the gp.

His father needs to be reinforcing standards every bit as forcefully as you do.

At 9 they begin to see they have different ideas if there own
Not using cutlery-
Toilet and attitude are common with others of the same age.
I would offer a reward system to get on track.
Give him a worming tablet.

Did you see the thread on here the other day about a mum who made her DS's 9 year old friend clean up his own pee? Search for it, it was a good one.

Hand him a bottle of cleaner and a cloth, teach him how to clean up his own piss and make sure he understands that that is what he must do in future.

Like someone has said above, maybe lasagne, shepherd's pie, soup, curry, chilli....all these things he'd need to use something other than his hands.
He sounds like the sort who would just slurp it off the plate or bowl in his mother's, while using cutlery in his father's because he wouldn't get away with such disrespect there.

[quote Fibrosucks00]@Geamhradh sorry I couldn't see what I was writing then.

He can use the toliet he's just being messy. He can use cuterly fine just chooses not too.
His dad doesn't have these problems[/quote]
My first thought is why are you enabling him to choose not to use his cutlery? Are there no consequences?

As others have said, lay down your expectations and if he doesn't meet them then there are consequences, and you follow through with that.

@Ijustreallywantacat

If he eats nicely he gets to watch TV/go to the park/play a card game with you as a reward. Positive reinforcement.

Sorry, but I disagree here. He should be using cutlery and using the toilet correctly because it is good manners and it is respectful of other people, not because of a reward. Peeing all over the seat for someone else to clean up is disgusting and by 9 he should know better. Having to give him a reward or presenting it as a choice is setting up a negotiation which can be exhausting for all involved.

Completely agree.

There is a difference between positive reinforcement and bribery. This would be bribery and it's not a great strategy with kids.

He should be doing these things because they are just a part of life and this is what is expected of him, not because he gets a treat if he does them.

If he used cutlery with his dad, then he’s obviously capable. Just take his plate away when he doesn’t with you?

Like someone has said above, maybe lasagne, shepherd's pie, soup, curry, chilli....all these things he'd need to use something other than his hands.

Curry is traditionally eaten with the hands.

OP

You have had some good advice, I agree with the remove the plate if he doesn't use cutlery correctly, it's a life skill everyone (with the usual caveats) should have.