Different opinions about parenting

[TokyoNights]

Hi.
This is going to be relationship/parenting problem I’m/we’re having.
This is our first baby- very much loved and planned. Before that we had discussions what we want to do, how to raise him, etc. And our ideas matched pretty much on everything. The reality tho..
I feel like I’m stuck. Stuck in a bad and dark place. I got over my baby blues and after really really hard first 3 months now I can say it’s getting better with my DS. My relationship with partner on the other hand is getting worse by a day.
Since he was born we basically argue every day. There is not one day when we’ve been at peace.
And ( in my opinion) the problem mainly is the idea of parenting.
I’ll explain.
In his opinion A: I hold him too much in my hands. Is it even possible to hold a 3 month old baby too much??!!
At the moment our day looks like this -
He wakes up
Nappy change
Food time
Play/tummy time/ going out...Depends.
More nappy change, extra food if he needs and then it’s already almost time for his nap ( his awake window is around 1,5h).
So that leads to his opinion B: his sleeping. Apparently I’m making him sleep too much during the day!
The best part - some of his friends or colleagues or whatever suggested what to do. I have to keep him awake during the day as long as possible, make him really tired and then he will fall asleep easily himself, I don’t have to rock him, and even on the nighttime he will sleep looong hours.
I mean how long is “as long as possible?”. He’s a 3 month old, most what he can physically manage is 1,5 h, 2 at the stretch, but then he’s already getting fussy.
According to him he will tell me from his bouncer when he’s tired, you don’t have to hold him, take him, let him sit there alone. YEAH, AND HE’S TELLING ME AFTER 1 HOUR THAT HE’S GETTING TIRED!! How long you want me to keep him awake??! ( We’ve done that mistake waaaay too many times, when he’s been up longer than he can take and we all know how the overtired baby behaves).
No matter how I tried to explain him that things doesn’t work that way with a 3 month old, he doesn’t seem to understand.
And I’m tired, tired to explain.. It’s like I’m saying one thing what at this moment is better for the baby and he says another thing because he’s friend/colleague whatever said it’s best.
Sometimes it’s like talking to the wall and then comes the next fight and next one and next one...
Generally he is a great father and loves his son so much. He’s feeding him, changing him, bathing him and helps me so much with everything.
But in his mind baby should be fed and then left to play on his own for hours until he tells me “ Ok I’m tired now”, and then calmly shuts his eyes like an adult and sleep.

I really hope that this makes any kind of a sense.
I would appreciate any kind of advice.
Thank you.

If he's feeding him I'm guessing you're not EBFing? In that case can he mind the baby and do things his way for a morning while you pop to the shops/ get your hair coloured etc? Even plan to go out for an hour and get held up, then let him see how his way of doing things for a few hours goes down

Of course a baby of three months needs a lot of holding. However...I do think a lot of Mothers do too much fussing over naps and that some relaxation over it will be better for you all when the baby gets older.

I've had two. I learned that babies learn FAST that you'll hold them and rock them to sleep if they yell. Fine when they're tiny but not so much fun when they're over 12 months and kicking you/staring in your eyes and messing about.

Even less fun when they're 2 and you're still sitting with them/holding them to get them to sleep.

By 4 months he should only need 2 or 3 naps per day. You should know when they're due but again this varies as they grow and change all the time.

Putting him down awake is a good idea. So he gets used to it.

@kitkatsky

If he's feeding him I'm guessing you're not EBFing? In that case can he mind the baby and do things his way for a morning while you pop to the shops/ get your hair coloured etc? Even plan to go out for an hour and get held up, then let him see how his way of doing things for a few hours goes down

Yeah I would do this too. Leave him to it and see how it works for him!

Yeah he is FF. And you are so right, I’m long overdue for the hair refreshment, might as well do it!
Even today - he had he’s bottle and was already yawning and looking at me with droopy eyes.
And here comes the Mr. KnowItAll with suggestion - shall we give him the bath?

• Now? He’s tired babe, he needs sleep.

-Yes,now! Why you are so against washing him? -???? And then I woke up,handed him the baby and said - Fine,give him the bath and then I wanna see how you gonna handle a crying shouting baby because he will be too tired already. And he agreed. Well good luck.

Now he’s bathing him.

In his head it’s still the same idea - keep the baby up long hours on the daytime and THEN he will sleep long hours.

My MIL was obsessed with keeping them awake in the day so they slept at night, in my experience that massively backfires and crap sleep in the day leads to an overtired baby up through the night.

All the science says that sleep begets sleep for babies and when they're overtired they produce a hormone that makes it even harder for them to drop off.

Hold your baby, they aren't little for long and you will never regret a second of those soft snuggly cuddles, i can absolutely promise you.

People try and scare you off doing things your way, they did with me, but i held my daughter whenever she needed it and she's now an independent sassy toddler who goes to sleep fine on her own. None of this 'you'll be rocking them forever' rubbish!

@ReggaetonLente

My MIL was obsessed with keeping them awake in the day so they slept at night, in my experience that massively backfires and crap sleep in the day leads to an overtired baby up through the night.

All the science says that sleep begets sleep for babies and when they're overtired they produce a hormone that makes it even harder for them to drop off.

Hold your baby, they aren't little for long and you will never regret a second of those soft snuggly cuddles, i can absolutely promise you.

People try and scare you off doing things your way, they did with me, but i held my daughter whenever she needed it and she's now an independent sassy toddler who goes to sleep fine on her own. None of this 'you'll be rocking them forever' rubbish!

Thank you! I absolutely agree with you! Dealing with overtired baby is nightmare. I’m not obsessed with his sleep and naps but try you keep him up within his awake window and not longer because then it’s bound for the disaster. But my partner has completely different idea how to do things and how babies work and I’m so so massively tired explaining him this because he just simply don’t listen to this “ BS you are reading how to raise a kid” !

You are BOTH learning.

I'd say, give him a break. Also he needs to give you a break. It's important to realise that neither of you really know what you're doing - you are only 3 months into an exceptionally steep learning curve. I would say the first 12 months of life with your first baby will be the greatest pace of learning and change you will experience in your entire life.

When you have two or three children, you will be able to look back on the naivety of your thinking now. You don't have all the answers, neither does your husband. You both sound hands on, so you are both learning (it's not just you doing everything, it would seem). You will both find your feet and realise your mistakes, but you have to go through the process of learning first hand to get there. He is learning too.

All that said, arguing is not the answer and is helping noone. Maybe talk about the fact that there is a middle ground. You cannot assume everything you think is right and everything he thinks is wrong - no body is the perfect parent.

So instead of butting heads when you have different ideas, instead try to focus on not arguing about it. Telling him he is wrong is just as unhelpful as him telling you that you are wrong. You both (BOTH) have to stop doing that. Be kind to each other and support each other in learning. Properly embrace that you are both learning and neither of you will have all the answers.

I understand the fact that we need to communicate better and understand each other better as we are going along and learning but I and stay silent when he wants to keep the 4 month old baby up all day and not let him sleep because in his mind then he will sleep better at night.
And when I say something that this is not right he’s coming back at me with “ yeah yeah you are always right, just keep reading your stupid things”.

And then we have the next argue again. I seriously don’t know what to do.
I just feel sorry for the baby when I can clearly see the signs and time for his nap when he just keeps him energetic and up. And when I try to tell him - hey, the little one is tired, his answer always is - so again you gonna make him sleep and walk around with him on your arms? Just let him get tired and then he will sleep long hours

And then he comes to me and asks why the baby is behaving, what to do. I calmly explained to him that it’s his nap time as he’s up already 2h.
Ok. Can you make him sleep?
And I told him no - let’s do your plan today, let’s keep him up all day if that’s what you want.
So he turned around and I heard something about the most stupid mom ever and someone who has no idea how to raise a kid.

Maybe I behave childish myself but I simply have no more energy to talk to him, to even look at him.

I agree with you that:
● Baby generally needs less awake time, not more

I agree with your DH that:
● Reading too much about what babies "should do" can be unhelpful.
● Babies do not need to be held for sleep.

Why can't your baby be given a dummy and go to sleep in the bouncer?

Battling with each other is making everything worse. It's very clear from your posts that both you and your DH have your child's needs front and centre. You just need to talk more.

What. You can not hold a 3mo baby too much. Hold him as much as you want, cuddle him and fuss! It's your baby, and they grow up way too fast. A baby that is loved and cuddled is way calmer.

Agree though not to hold him when asleep, you are making a rod to your own back. Try tach him to fall asleep with you, but not on you.

1,5h is max I'd keep him awake, if he then falls asleep, he WAS TIRED. If he is not tired, he won't fall asleep. If he is overtired you are in for a bad day and horrible night and I would make hell sure the father then is the one up every single time the baby wakes up. Every. Single. Time.

This stupid notion of keeping them awake should have died in the 80s.

On a side note, you will hit more problems later on, so I would try and sort this out now. Make him read books, buy them for him, read them together. Hopefully you will manage to agree a way, and be happier for it.

@TokyoNights what is his actual problem?

Lack of experience, bad advice or preconceived ideas of what babies should do can all be worked through and talked about.

However, if his issue actually is that you spend too much time with the baby and he feels neglected or wants the baby to be independent/sleep so you can cook,clean,have sex,give him attention etc. then your relationship is fairly fucked and very hard to get back on track.