Thoughts on sleep training. Don't know what to do...

[ASomers]

I have an 8mo who currently Co sleeps, feeds to sleep and contact naps. I have been on the attachment parenting side of things so far and I do generally agree with the principles that babies can't be spoiled and should be responded to. I believe that feeding babies to sleep is biologically normal. I only started Co sleeping at 6 months when we moved dd to her own room and the hourly waking were too much. This has suited us but I feel bad for my husband who sleeps in the spare room. I also feel a lot of pressure hearing about other babies sleeping through the night and I wonder how long this will go on for.

I am not anti sleep training as I believe that many need to do it and it all depends on your circumstances. If you could guarantee my dd would only cry got 30 mins over a few days, I would be persuaded that on balance the payoff may be worth it. However, no one can guarantee this. My fear is that I will damage her forever and break her trust... Info online is very conflicted. I wish the evidence was more concrete...

Sorry for the ramble...I'm feeling like a failure because I can't put her down for naps and she's not sleeping through but at the same time, I can't get over the guilt I might feel.

I guess I'm asking for people's sleep training experiences...

Many thanks xx

Ds was 9 months and bf several times during the night.. Sleep deprivation was enormous.. First night I sent dh in with a bottle. Ds drank an ounce and went to sleep without fuss. and slept the rest of the night.. Second night dh offered water... Drank none and resettled without crying.. Slept all night. Third night slept 7-7 and has since then. Now over 6...

My sister sleep trained her son at 6 months.

And 10 months.

And now again at 14 months.

We coslept till about 18 months when DD decided the single bed in her room was better, at least for the first part of the night, and would sneak in in the night for the second half, mostly without waking anyone!

I used a deep consultant to sleep train my first son when he was 9 months old because we had so so many problems relating to his sleep - mainly the lack of it.

The woman was amazing and within a week I had a different baby. It was the best £100 I ever spent!!

I sleep trained my boy at 7.5 months, and it was the best thing I ever did. I did the one where you leave them for 30 seconds, then a minute, then 1.30 (it’s supposed to be 2 mins but I felt that was too much of an increase). I never got past 3 mins before he’d settled himself back to sleep. I did it for 2 nights, and by the third he was sleeping through, and has done ever since except when he’s ill.

It needed nerves of steel, and for both us parents to be totally on board, and a weekend when we didn’t have a lot on. But for us, it was completely worth it.

I think it's bad for everyone involved. The cortisol and adrenalin in a crying baby is high. I think it damages them to be honest. But I do understand your need for sleep!

Have you tried Elizabeth Pantley's no cry sleep solution. My daughter was about 9 months before she slept more than 2 hours at a time and that book saved my life!

"Sleep training"

I would actively work towards not feeding to sleep and not being cuddled and take it as slowly as it needs to invoke crying (complaints some noise is different but zero distress).

It could be that naps are taken in bed together but with you next to rather than actually cuddling etc.

@ThornAmongstRoses

I used a deep consultant to sleep train my first son when he was 9 months old because we had so so many problems relating to his sleep - mainly the lack of it.

The woman was amazing and within a week I had a different baby. It was the best £100 I ever spent!!

I did the same at 9months.

I was v unwell with pnd and basically had no choice. It was painful but worked enough after 3 d. I sat with her throughout but she cried about 40/50mins initially before it got better. But it did.

She remained a bugger for going to sleep for years though. Slightly better now aged 9 😀

I used sleep training to self settle never in the night if they woke.
Sleep training for me also was interval returning not cry it out! Never left my LO to cry for more than10mins at a time.
If you want to improve sleep in the night why not try a formula bottle at bed time.

I strongly don't believe in cry it out methods which also seem to be the total opposite of your parenting style. There have been studies that show that babies don't stop feeling stressed when parents ignore their crying they simply learn not to cry as no-one will come. They still feel stressed and have high levels of cortisol in their system. Philippa Perry writes well about this in her book.

There are plenty of other gentle sleep training methods that don't involve cry it out. I used a gentle method to teach my daughter to learn to put herself to sleep and to start to drop her night feeds. I have to say I never forced her to drop any night feeds though only the last one when she was waking as a habit at about 2am. My husband would go to her and comfort her to sleep by rocking her or whatever it took instead of me feeding her. It took her a couple of hours to get to sleep but only for about two or three nights. I've used other gentle methods such as patting or stroking them to sleep too which we still use for naps mostly. I still feed my daughter to sleep most nights (only for bed not for naps) and she is 14 months.

I know you might feel a lot of pressure to stop things or to meet certain timelines other parents claim their babies are meeting but other babies really aren't relevant. The only thing that matters is what works for you. Try following Care it Out Sleep Consultant, the Parent and Baby Coach and just chill mama on Instagram for an idea of what kind of method might work for you if you want to change it. But generally the advice is if it works then there's no need to change it but if it stops working for you and your family then find a method that works for you.

Look up gentle methods like the gradual retreat. We went from 12 wake-ups to two the first night, at 8 months, then one the next night, then sleeping through.

It's a tough one, some babies need sleep training and others don't. Some parents crack under the lack of sleep and others cope fine. Go with what's best for you, your marriage and your baby. Personally I did sleep train at 6mo but that's not going to be right for everyone. My kid is definitely a bit weird but I don't think I've done her long term damage.

Do you feel that what you are doing currently works for you? You mention pressure because of others but this shouldn't be a reason to rush into things. I also don't like letting young children cry it out, however my sister tried to force me into it when my oldest was young and had me stood in the kitchen listening to her scream over the baby monitor for nearly 40 minutes until she was sick, never again My brother hit the nail on the head when we were chatting, he said that at some stage you will hit a point where it's right for you and you're all ready to do it, sleep training takes grit and determination, or your child will make that leap and begin taking the lead on those things themselves. There is no evidence that formula at night helps babies sleep longer, bottle fed babies wake just as much as breastfed babies. Good luck with whatever you decide to do, I hope you find something that works for you

I could never bring myself to sleep train, and even trying the pick up put down method I didnt stick with as he cried as soon as I went to lay him in his bed so I fed to sleep until he was about 15 months and would feed back to sleep in the night which was every 2 or 3 hours.
Once my husband started rocking him to sleep instead in the middle of the night it seemed to work and he went down to one wake up a night and then started sleeping through which was like a dream after bad sleep for so long!
We've just stopped feeding / rocking to sleep the last month (he's now 18 months) and he self settles really well, we just fed and rocked for a slightly shorter time so he was still awake when we put him in his cot and said it was time to sleep and he just started going to sleep on his own.

Go read the No Cry sleep solution. I followed it and did gentle sleep training.

At 8 months I stopped feeding to sleep. I would feed, then tuck him in (still co sleeping) and pat. Over time reduced the patting (2-3 weeks).
Then more or less simultaneously I kept a food and milk diary and when I was convinced he was eating enough I stopped offering the boob at night. Not before 4 am.
Weirdly I thought this would be a fight and it took some time- I patted and offered water and he was furious for a day or two but actually he accepted it. He would still stir but go back to sleep.
Then I moved him into his own cot at the foot of my bed. So I would feed, moved into the cot and I would say the same words ‘big boys sleep in their own cot’ all the time. First few nights I held him inside the cot and patted him.
Gradually (over 2 weeks or so he accepted the cot).
Then I started reducing how much I patted him when he fell asleep. Gradually reduced that and began to move away.
Eventually I could feed, pat a couple of times and walk away and he would fall asleep. I did this all over a 4 month period with some setbacks when he had a cold. Absolutely minimal crying.
And then at 14 months I stopped breastfeeding. He barely noticed. We moved to a bottle before bath. And then a month later I dropped the 4/5 am feed. Again he barely noticed.
And then at 20 months ish he went into his own room. Till then he was in a cot in ours.

All very gradual and in the grand scheme relatively painless.

My general advice is that three day miracles don’t always work. If you are in it for the long haul to teach good sleep hygiene and good sleep habits that’s a better bet.
Sooner or later they’ll become toddlers and keep asking to go to the toilet instead of sleeping and getting to a stage where cry it out doesn’t work.
A lot of my friends who had babies who slept amazingly well post sleep training then had 5-6/7 year olds who would be up and down the stairs endlessly at bedtime. So I would play the long game and create good sleep habits and a good bedtime routine.

It needed nerves of steel

Sorry, but I don’t see how it needs nerves of steel to leave a baby for 30 seconds, then a minute? If you’re doing “proper” crying it out (i.e. leave them to cry for an hour or longer) then I can see why that would take nerves of steel, but 30 seconds is nothing.

Hi OP, please don't feel like a failure. My son is almost 12 months and I feed him to sleep at night and he is cuddled for all of his naps. He currently wakes between 2 to 4 times a night and my husband is sleeping in the spare room too. I have no free time because of it but in a way I will miss the cuddles when I go back to work.

I guess a time comes when the situation sorts itself out because it has to. My son will be going to a childminder soon so I feel that we ought to sleep train him soon as the stress of him crying and not being able to settle I think will be worse for him at the childminders than if he does it at home with me.

My thoughts on the widely reported evidence that sleep training causes high levels of cortisol in the child is probably more mixed than reported and needs to be weighed up against the risks to people's mental health through a lack of sleep. I feel that a lot of this information is 'ideal' but doesn't always fit in the real world and causes parents a lot of angst and possibly contributes to a lot of pressure to do the 'right' thing but which is not right for the family overall.

In the past we've tried gentle sleep methods but patting to sleep, pick up and put down just seems to make my son cry for longer. I've had some joy with the huckleberry app and paid for the sleep analysis but the advice is essentially controlled crying for 5 minutes at a time or a gentle sleep training technique however they may have some useful tips on getting your baby to settle without co-sleeping.

If I knew for certain that my son would sleep on his own (before the age of 2) without needing to be sleep trained I'd leave it but unfortunately no one has a crystal ball and I asked our health visitors nursery nurse and she thinks some form of sleep training is inevitable for most families.

my LO is 15m and we cosleep and contact nap when we arent out and about. if it works for you thats great. don't worry about other babies and what works for them, we're all different

I think the main question is are you happy with what you’re doing and feeling outside pressure or are you finding it difficult and want to change what you’re doing?
My DD started waking a few times a night when she was 8 months as she was used to being rocked to sleep, before that she was fairly average sleeper and I did gentle sleep training using a shush pat method. It took about 10 days, minimal crying and she slept through.
My DS was always an awful sleeper but at 6 months he was waking hourly and I was on my knees with exhaustion, gentle sleep training didn’t work and I tried the Ferber method starting with naps. It reduced his wakings to 3 times a night and I then had to do it again when he was nearly 12 months. Hes now 14 months and still doesn’t sleep through consistently but it’s much better. I don’t feel that good about the sleep training but i couldn’t go on like I was.

@lllllllllll

It needed nerves of steel

Sorry, but I don’t see how it needs nerves of steel to leave a baby for 30 seconds, then a minute? If you’re doing “proper” crying it out (i.e. leave them to cry for an hour or longer) then I can see why that would take nerves of steel, but 30 seconds is nothing.

Oh do bore off. It’s an expression. No-one likes to hear their baby cry. Sorry I didn’t do “proper” crying it out. Did I not leave my baby to cry long enough for you?? How long should I have done it for, according to you?

Gosh, that seems like a bit of an overreaction to lllllll's message. I agreed with her sentiment, as I imagine she was pointing out it's really not so bad that it takes nerves of steel which might be very worrying to some parents. I guess it shows what an emotive subject it is.

I think it's interesting that people claim to have used gentle methods but doing things like offering water to their babies made them furious. So obviously the babies were distressed by it. I tried all the patting and retreating etc and it just dragged out the pain and made my baby crosser for longer. Letting her cry she settled herself after a few minutes and after 2 nights it was cracked. She's been an excellent sleeper since and is now 3. The 3 year olds I know who weren't sleep trained at all are no better or worse, I really don't think whatever you do has that long term a consequence.