First Jabs - blue light to hospital

[fairyannie]

I'm so worried. At my wits end.

My grandson has been rushed to hospital just now.

He had his 8 week 'jabs' today. Two hours later he started crying/very unsettled.

This evening whilst feeding he stopped breathing and his lips and face turned blue. My daughter blew on his face three times before he took a breath. She said it was ages between blowing on his face because she was absolutely frozen and petrified and at first didn't know what to do.

She rang his outreach nurse who said ring 111. They sent an ambulance. They are being blue lighted to hospital because of temp and resps (paramedic's words).

Has anyone else encountered such a reaction to these jabs?

He was 7 weeks premature. He's literally 1 wk old - adjusted age.

My heart is beating out of my chest

@Knitwit99

What a year your family has had. Must be so hard to have to stay at arms length when you just want to help and you can see the help is needed.

It's really been horrendous.

I've had the worst nightmares and I've even recommenced sleepwalking which I haven't done since my own children were very young.

I can't concentrate on a thing. Can't even read a book to take my mind away. Can't concentrate on a film - forget what's happened. Can't knit - which normally passes loads of time and results in something productive. Keep making infuriating mistakes which makes me rage.

I was thinking that this is just part of getting old (54) but now believe it's just the unbearable amount of stress.

Must be similar for everyone this year, I suppose.

Just goes to show how mental health has been affected by this pandemic.

Perhaps everyone can recount a 'sob story'.

Will try and pull myself together.

Who'd be a mother? Eh?

@greyinganddecaying

* Oh the little tinker he's a breath holder.

As if he's doing it on purpose? I feel like they've 'made fun/light of it' when it was the scariest thing ever to happen.*

Don't read too much into this - I've heard many neonatal/paediatric nurses use this language. In my experience it means that there's nothing serious underlying this (e.g he's "playing tricks"). There's no doubt that it's horribly stressful & they know this, but it's their way of reassuring you.

Quite

@October2020

Im going to pm you

Thank you.

How do you access a pm?

Can your DD do an infant first aid course?

@DonLewis

Can your DD do an infant first aid course?

Are they done remotely?

It would be 'in theory' and not practically at the moment I'm guessing.

It's all very scary when you're told to blow into your baby's mouth and you're not sure how to do it properly.

It wasn't demonstrated to her by the doctors - just a verbal instruction.

I wouldn't like to 'have a go' in case I did some damage.

OP, you lie baby on the floor and close your mouth over the baby's mouth and nose, and blow gently until you see their chest lift, then turn your head to the side. You should be able to look online for sample videos of this but you use much less force for a littley than for an adult (I'm a trained first aider who's also done child first aid and had an 18 month old go into hospital in similar circumstances. In our extended family girls seem to have the febrile convulsions).

You have raised strong, resilient women, you should all three of you be proud of each other.

All parents are supposed to do a resuscitation course (well watch a video) when they leave the neonatal unit. But there are videos produced by St John's ambulance which are helpful.

https://www.sja.org.uk/get-advice/first-aid-advice/paediatric-first-aid/how-to-do-cpr-on-a-baby/

It's a horrible thought that you'd have to do this (& so stressful when you do) but really important that you know what to do.

I did a paediatric first aid just before this lockdown @fairyannie , we were able to do the practical side it was just limited

P.s hope your grandson is ok, and you for that matter. What a scary time for all

@greyinganddecaying

All parents are supposed to do a resuscitation course (well watch a video) when they leave the neonatal unit. But there are videos produced by St John's ambulance which are helpful.

https://www.sja.org.uk/get-advice/first-aid-advice/paediatric-first-aid/how-to-do-cpr-on-a-baby/

It's a horrible thought that you'd have to do this (& so stressful when you do) but really important that you know what to do.

That's interesting. Neither of my daughters did this despite 5 and 3 week stays in NICU. It wasn't mentioned.

My younger daughter had oxygen training at the hospital the day she brought her daughter home.

She felt that her partner should've had the same training at the same time but he wasn't allowed in the hospital. He didn't see his daughter at all until she came home after 5 weeks in NICU. She had to relate her training to him and wasn't confident that she'd repeated the training correctly. It was a lonely and scary time for them.

I will direct them both, and myself, to learn the resuscitation techniques. In an ideal world this would be a mandatory part of the curriculum with future refresher courses.

Anecdotally, a friend of mine was baby sitting her grandson who was four at the time and he fell backwards and swallowed his tongue. She panicked for a second and the dealt with the situation successfully because she was a first aider at the school she worked at.

I wouldn't have known what to do.

Everyone should learn this. It's vitally important.

@SoCrimeaRiver

OP, you lie baby on the floor and close your mouth over the baby's mouth and nose, and blow gently until you see their chest lift, then turn your head to the side. You should be able to look online for sample videos of this but you use much less force for a littley than for an adult (I'm a trained first aider who's also done child first aid and had an 18 month old go into hospital in similar circumstances. In our extended family girls seem to have the febrile convulsions).

You have raised strong, resilient women, you should all three of you be proud of each other.

Not sure about strong and resilient.

We all panicked.

We probably all need therapy.

What a year.

Learn CPR everyone.

Learn CPR everyone. Very good advice OP. DS was a breath holder and ended up in A&E, not after having jabs though.

Your DD will need to make sure that everyone who looks after him knows that he does this and how to do CPR, that's what we had to do.

How's his feeding now? Is she still engorged and how's his fontanella? Is it still sunken?

@JiltedJohnsJulie

Learn CPR everyone. Very good advice OP. DS was a breath holder and ended up in A&E, not after having jabs though.

Your DD will need to make sure that everyone who looks after him knows that he does this and how to do CPR, that's what we had to do.

How's his feeding now? Is she still engorged and how's his fontanella? Is it still sunken?

She says it does still look sunken - same as last night.

He's sleeping more/going longer between feeds. His temp is 37.4 which is warm for him as his temp is usually 36.5. She's always mentioned he 'tends to run cooler'.

She's expressed twice today to try to maintain her milk and relieve the pressure.

She has spoken to the outreach nurse who has said to give another dose of calpol. She said 1.5ml doses yesterday but has said give him 2ml this evening. My daughter is thinking to save the dose for bedtime as she's exhausted having been up all last night and only managing a short nap today. She has two other children 4yrs and 12months.

He's been very quiet today. Not himself at all which she's assuming is due to the jabs temperature rise.

He's been feeding 4-5 hourly all day where as it's usually 2-3 hourly during the day and a little longer during the night.

But she's spoken to the nurse already? Nurse didn't seem too concerned. Should we assume he'll pick up soon?
No breath holding today. Thankfully.

8 pounds is 3.6kg so shouldn't have the 2.5mls calpol. It should be calculated according to weight if less than 4kg.
Practice nurse.

I think it might help getting him to feed a bit more, have they told her how to look out for dehydration?

When he does feed, she could try some Breast Compressions.

Have a read of this article too, particularly the bit on baby refusing to nurse when sick, which sounds like what is happening with the reduced feeds.

It might be worth her talking to one of the BFing Helplines too to see f they have any suggestions for nursing a sick baby.

Going through ok of this with two other such little ones must be awful. Are you able to see them at all?

@cptartapp

8 pounds is 3.6kg so shouldn't have the 2.5mls calpol. It should be calculated according to weight if less than 4kg. Practice nurse.

This is interesting because my younger daughter was told to give three doses of calpol, 2.5ml, to her daughter when she had her first vaccinations at 8 weeks old (2 weeks adjusted age). She had major surgery within 12 hrs of birth and was just 5lb at eight weeks old.

Her daughter is also currently on a 20mg of omeprazole which I think is a lot to take. It seems like an adult dose to me. I take 30mg of Lanzoprazole daily.

@JiltedJohnsJulie

I think it might help getting him to feed a bit more, have they told her how to look out for dehydration?

When he does feed, she could try some Breast Compressions.

Have a read of this article too, particularly the bit on baby refusing to nurse when sick, which sounds like what is happening with the reduced feeds.

It might be worth her talking to one of the BFing Helplines too to see f they have any suggestions for nursing a sick baby.

Going through ok of this with two other such little ones must be awful. Are you able to see them at all?

Many thanks for this.

I will pass this along.

DS was a breath holder (he was full term). What got him to breath again was pinching his earlobes and sprinkling cold water on his face. We put a mini fridge into the bedroom specifically. When breastfeeding it also helped to have a side lying position as he seemed to encourage him to breathe.

She was advised incorrectly. Probably overlooked the prematurity, as most babies are fine with 2.5ml by 8 weeks but not if less than 4kg.

@GrumpyHoonMain

DS was a breath holder (he was full term). What got him to breath again was pinching his earlobes and sprinkling cold water on his face. We put a mini fridge into the bedroom specifically. When breastfeeding it also helped to have a side lying position as he seemed to encourage him to breathe.

A side lying position?

Is this the rugby ball hold or mum actually lying down?

He's not held his breath today (hope I've not spoken too soon).

@cptartapp

She was advised incorrectly. Probably overlooked the prematurity, as most babies are fine with 2.5ml by 8 weeks but not if less than 4kg.

This was the day mum and baby had their check ups with the GP. Both mum and baby together at the same time discussing the trauma of the birth with GP. Very obvious that the baby was still very tiny as the GP weighed her along with some other checks. Mum asked about the dose of calpol to give as jabs were the next appointment. They then went to see the nurse who actually administered the first dose of calpol herself before the jabs.

My daughter didn't think to question the dosage as she assumed it would be correct coming from the GP.

I just wanted to add in one of my children had " breath holding spells" from very young, hard to remember exactly how old he was when it started but I think about 2/ 3 months. He would turn blue, sometimes it even looked like he was fitting. This happened regularly until he was about 3 years old. We had him seen numerous times by everyone from neurology to cardiology etc. They told me he would grow out of it before he was 5. He did. It was terrifying. I know this may be different but just wanted to reply, there was very little info when I tried to find it back then. But actually it can be a common thing with small babies.

Actually just read your updates , looks like you have a breath holder too! Its terrifying. I didn't believe them at all initially when they suggested this was what he was doing but in time I realised he was usually doing it when upset, after crying etc. The only thing to do is blow hard in their face. They told me not to worry if they pass out because they will take another breath automatically. Needless to say I didn't sleep much those 1st few years! Hes 10 now it feels like a lifetime ago but I'll never forget the absolute fear of being on my own when it would happen. Theres a few videos on YouTube if you Google " breath holding spells"

What a worrying time for you all
British Red Cross have two really useful phone apps for adult and paediatric first aid, simple to use and understand, they can be downloaded free from the App Store on iPhone and Android.

Sorry this happened op. Hope he perks up soon.

Just about omprezole. My now 8 year old has been in 20mg since age 5, when he was two there was a mix up at the chemist and they accidentally gave him 20mg instead of his normal 10 and it made him quite ill.

But that might just be him. If baby is ok, this dose may be ok for them.