I don't know what to do anymore

[Keeks2616]

Sorry for the long post. I feel so bad. I know it was wrong but I've just pushed my 12yo into her bedroom and shouted at her.

We've been having problems with her for 2 years now. She has anxiety and I'm starting to think she uses it as an excuse whenever something doesn't suit her. We have done literally everything we can. We've done what she wants. What doctors have suggested. Taken advice from specialists and friends and family.

Shes a school refuser. Shes waiting to be assessed for ADHD. We understand that things are challenging for her and it doesn't help her mood and anxiety waiting for the assessment, however, her attitude has become almost unbearable at times. Most if the time if I'm honest. It's even starting to affect my relationship with my husband.

Today she got up late (again). Was vile to her sister (regular occurrence these days. Calls her the kid and tells her she can't stand her. I've tried explaining that she's 3! I'm told regularly she doesn't care "it's a fucking idiot") her attitude toward me was disgusting but I tried what has been suggested and asked her to watch her tone then turn attention toward something else.

She sorta changed it and offered to put the dishes away (her way of saying sorry as she can't bring herself to use that word) I thanked her. Got her sister ready for nursery and took her. When I came back I said she had school work to do. She could eat and start at 1. 1:15 comes and I tell her to go and do the school work. Not now she says. I tell her now. She tells me I'm a stupid cunt and I'm taking the fucking piss. Slams the door. Stamps upstairs and slams her door so hard a picture falls off the wall and broke. The handle broke off the door.

I lost it and ran after her. She tried to push past me calling me some other profanity and I pushed her back into her room telling her not to dare come back down until all of her work was finished. Then I took her phone off her.

I feel awful but I'm at my wits end and I'm tired of bending every which way to suit her when we get ZERO respect and we're not seeing any improvements. We can't get her to stop swearing and 90% of things we ask her to do is met with no.

What do I do??

Are you getting any support from school /CAMHS?

It sounds really tough and teenagers/pre teens certainly know how to push our buttons.

My DH clashes terribly with DS1 and sometimes so do I. It is like having an overgrown irrational toddler!

We have created an idea of parenting now where the child controls everything through the parents fear of rejection.

Watch and see how many posters approach posts like yours by telling you (the adult) how you are wrong, damaging your child and at risk of alienating her forever.

It is an overly sentimental view of the child parent relationship which isn't breeding healthy adults but infantilised grown-ups.

Have you /do you check her phone? Bullying? Lack of friends? Inappropriate messages /pics. All issues we have had with dd 14 over the past year..

@lorisparkle We are waiting for the assessment from CAMHS. We were told it may take up to 6 months due to covid.

That feels like a reeeally long time. I feel really awful for pushing her but I think if I go and tell her I know it was wrong and I'm sorry she'll use that against me for her own advantage.

I love her so much and don't know what to do for the best. I'm thinking tough love is going to be the last and only option. I agree with you @Emeeno1 I'm probably going to have a lot of judgemental people on here telling me I'm wrong. I really just need some advice as I feel stuck and don't know what to do anymore.

@Lockdownlovernotfromliverpool we do check her phone. I keep an eye on what's on there, her ipad xbox etc. One thing she does do is tell me if she's had a fall out with friends or anything. She hasn't mentioned anything like that.

I know she has confidence issues and does have anxiety because of the possible ADHD but that doesn't excuse name calling and swearing. Its as though the more we do for her the more she expects things to go her way 🤷🏽‍♀️

Back to basics then. Dd had no phone for at least a month. Chores done together kills 2 birds ime. 1-1 time and she can learn about the responsibilities of pitching in at home... Early nights works wonders for my dc.. Not as a punishment, just explained we all need sleep and sometimes a bit extra.

Firstly I'd urge you not to underestimate the effects of her anxiety. I've just started medication for mine after putting up with it for far too long. When I'm feeling really anxious I can lash out and I'm mean, as the worry I'm feeling leaves me with no energy to socialise and interact normally.

I'm not saying that's an excuse. But it could be a larger part of the problem than you think.

One of the main reasons I'm getting help is because of what my anxiety does to those I live with, rather than what it does to me.

What isn't acceptable however is the way she talks about her sister, and the names she calls you. I don't care how anxious I feel, I would never ever EVER do those things.

Sit her down and talk to her properly about her sister. Small children can exacerbate anxiety as they're very unpredictable, and talk to her about her school work and how she's finding home learning too. She might open up and enlighten you about what she's feeling.

But you then need to explain to her that no matter how tough things are for her, there are some behaviours that you simply won't accept, and there will be consequences for them.

OP, we have an 11 year old whose had an initial ADHD telephone consultation with hospital outpatients and a 2 year old, so I take my hat off to you. My DS is doing better with online schooling this time round, as he's now in secondary, but still uses his DSis as an excuse not to do work on the days she's at home.

We've found that diet impacts on his behaviour - he craves sweet foods but is currently eating dried apricots as a regular snack, and having three good meals a day so weetabix x 2 / porridge type breakfasts, rather than one croissant, jacket potato at lunch etc. and it seems to be helping with mood swings. Saying all this, I wouldn't be accepting the sort of language you've had today. We also remove phones as a consequence, but also give an opportunity to earn it back if appropriate (help the person you've been rude to to unload the dishwasher, sort washing etc.). You don't mention her father - do you have a partner / husband to offer you support in this? We also find that 1:1 time between DS and a parent can help, even if it's just taking his scooter to park whilst the other parent takes the toddler to the swings. Are your DD and the 3 year old siblings, if you don't mind me asking, or half siblings? My DS was an only child and only grandchild until his sister came along, and he does have phases when he struggles with her being around and we talk him through that. We also ensure one of us reads to DS each night, a chapter of a novel. That sort of 1:1 time again is important to DS.

Sorry I should have pointed out that I lash out verbally, never physically.

Has she had any conversations with a counselor or other person outside of the family about how she feels about her sister? Has she been expected to help out a lot, or take a back seat in terms of your time, since her sister was born? 12 and 3 is a difficult age gap as your dd will have been very used to being an only child by the time her sister was born. Her attitude and feelings sound like she feels pushed out or replaced by her younger sister and maybe she needs help processing that. Remember it wasn't her choice to live with a small child. As adults we get to decide if we want kids around but older kids/teens don't get that choice if their parents decide to have another baby when they're older. Being mean to her sister isn't acceptable and needs to be addressed, but she deserves compassion and active help in overcoming the issues instead of being expected to just deal with it. She needs to be listened to as well.

It is such a hard balance between being strict about unacceptable behaviour and having empathy for the anxiety/ adhd.

I try and do both with Ds1, so a bit of empathy first (It must be so frustrating when.,.,, it makes me annoyed when .,,,) then the strict bit (but it is unacceptable to do.....) then we do a bit of problem solving together (have you got any ideas about a better way to deal with...) . I will then make a kind of agreement with ds1 that he does whatever we agree and then I explain the consequences if he is rude / pushes / throws etc

It does not always work and I have to be calm enough to follow through but it is better than it was.

I personally would apologise if you pushed and use this in your discussion about dealing with problems and how we are all human.

With ds2 we are waiting for CAMHS too - it is never quick.

Stop pandering to her. You might find that her "anxiety" clears up if she can no longer use it as a tool to get her own way.

Thanks everyone. I really appreciate all the input. I'm trying the new diet thing with her as she binge eats sometimes and its really not healthy. The bedtime thing.. I might as well be trying to get blood out of a stone but it is something I'll keep trying over time.

She talks to our GP. That's who she chose to talk to as he's excellent and really easy to talk to. She has an appointment every 2 weeks with him. She doesn't want a Councillor or anything. I think the label makes it a bit scary for her.

It was tough for her when her sister was born but we have 1 night a week we spend together watching a movie or doing something of her choice. It was art this week (she's brilliant and is trying to teach me how to draw people as I'm rubbish apparently. Lol) She sometimes goes out with her dad but he works a LOT at the minute. He makes as much time for her and her sister as he can.

I don't believe we expect too much of her. We do expect a little bit more the older she gets. I now expect her to keep her bedroom tidy and make her own bed. We also get her to put the dishes away after tea every night.

I really do appreciate everything you've all suggested and will try everything I haven't already tried. 😊

It is with teens (ime having 9 so far -) a fine line between being a friend and being a parent at times. My dd 14 needs firmer boundaries than any of the rest!! They know I get tough.. Most of her mates are allowed alcohol and free rein on tech time. She knows I don't. Her older siblings confirm I stick to my rules. She argues but I stay firm.. Ime making non negotiable rules pays off. Earning extra tech time /extra cash is flexible but drinking isn't. Having fun is obviously important but knowing they can't take the p is vital also.

Just keep doing what you are doing op. One day she will come to you as a young woman and thank you for all you did and apologise for all she put you through.

If you break every now and then, so what? You are a human being doing an amazing and terribly difficult job. God damn parenting high five to you.

That sounds really tough OP. I was also the teen with severe anxiety and a school refuser. But i was anxious because of the people at school, as opposed to the learning expected of me. I don’t even know what I could suggest, her language is foul though. Hormones are crazy at that age but it doesn’t excuse her behaviour. Don’t hand her phone back (best thing my mum ever done). Limit her options. No treats. No money. No nothing until her attitude changes. Also i suggest speaking to the school and CHAMS and seeing if they can suggest anything for you or step in for support.

My thoughts will probably be very unpopular on mumsnet, but here goes...

First you sound like a great mum and she seems to have a happy home,
Second being a teenager has its up and downs but suddenly 'anxiety' is the excuse for horrible behavior so often.
We all survived being a teen and most didn't abuse our parents ( mine would have hit me across the room had l dared)

Why do you tolerate this awful abusive language? because l wouldn't, l would come down on her like a ton of bricks each and every time...
A lecture on why decent people don't speak to their families like that and it won't be tolerated.
Removal of phone and ipad for 2 days, no fun outings until a genuine apology is said.
Each subsequent abusive word increases the time said consequences last for.
I would stick to it come hell or high water.
No shouting or arguing back.
Same for being horribble to her poor sister, zero tolerance.
Even if ADHD is a factor she can learn not to be abusive to her family.

Any damage to the house to be repaired paid for through her pocket money, every time.

The school issue can be much more complicated, so l would give her a choice, school or 3 hours a day of Maths and English study and workbooks at home.
If she genuinely has fears around school or anxieties about the social aspects, she will jump at the chance to work calmly at home instead.

Her behaviour sounds like that of a very spoilt strong personality that needs boundaries and structure, have you considered that doing all you can with huge amounts of empathy, is allowing her to go wild with no boundaries?