Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Parenting

For free parenting resources please check out the Early Years Alliance's Family Corner.

Is this behaviour normal?

18 replies

Stressedmum4 · 16/11/2020 07:53

I have 3 dd's (11, nearly 3 and 5 weeks old) and 1 dsd (nearly 10), I've been with dp for 8 years and living together for 6.

I'm really struggling with my 11 year olds behaviour, she is rude and argumentative about everything, which I'm sure at her age is normal to some extent but she does it constantly, we can't talk about anything when dd is about or she will try to insist on knowing exactly what we are talking about and will question us in what we are doing or where we have been that day while she is at school. If we say we have been to the shops she starts looking about for bags or whatever and insist we tell her every little detail, if we refuse to tell her all the details she will tell us she has a right to know what we have been doing. If we say we haven't been anywhere but she notices I have make up on or hair different she will tell us we are lying and question us some more. It is exhausting.

She also gets involved if we are telling the other kids if for anything eg with dsd she will have to involve herself by saying things like well I wasn't doing anything I was just reading my book, playing on my tablet or whatever when again we weren't actually talking to her and never suggested she was doing anything or with the 3 year tells us we shouldn't be telling her off shes not even 3 yet and only playing, even if that's playing on the stairs or in the kitchen near the oven at dinner time and we are trying to keep her safe. The toddler is going through "the terrible 2s" atm so any kind of no results crying and she will then shout the toddler over for a cuddle and say stuff like aw its ok you were only playing and it's not fair you've been told off. Its ridiculous she seems to think she is the parent and has an equal say in how we parent the others.

As for behaviour she never sits still, she is constantly dancing or jumping about the living room including on the furniture, she lies upside down on the couch (as in feet up the back of it on the wall and head off the bit you sit on).
Despite being told repeatedly not to she will pick the toddler up and throw her (playfully) onto the couch or spin her around. When shes told not to do this she then argues back that we do it (spin her around) so why can't she? The difference is dd has very little special awareness and has on numerous occasions bumped toddler off the door or wall or almost dropped her.

She still draws on her books, furniture, her walls she can't be trusted with makeup sets or nail polishes as she pours it on her carpet or uses lip gloss to stick stuff to her walls despite having blue tack to put up posters. She is not allowed slime stuff in the house, partly because I hate it but mostly because she then uses that to mix with water and shampoo/shower gel type stuff to "make potions" that end up all over the bathroom or her room that she shares with the younger one.
Every time she goes for a bath she floods the floor and not just a little bit it took 4 towels to dry the floor last week, so last night I specifically set out what not to do in the bath so instead she used slime that her dad gave her to bring home and also all of everyone's bath stuff to make a potion which has stained the floor bath and her room carpet. I'm sure the marks will come out the bath with a good scrub but it's not the point she knows not to do that. She then lied about what it was and tried to hide the slime, when she finally gave me the slime she then said she doesn't know why she isnt allowed to have slime in the house anyway??

She ruins everything we buy her and sometimes what we buy the others, dvds get scratched or sprayed with perfume, toys get sprayed with perfume or broken, games get opened and bits left everywhere so can't be played with jewellery gets lost or broken, I bought her a nice locket with her birthstone and a pic of me and her inside for her birthday and she had snapped the chain on it and has now lost the locket part. It wants really expensive but it was a lot of money for us and the kind of thing I would have treasured at that age.

There is so much more but I'm just rambling on now, I know some of that might seem silly but this is constant, every day is like that and I don't know what to do. She gets sent to her room when she doesn't do as shes told but just ends up wrecking something up there and banging about, she has broken all her drawers as she goes up and opens and slams them when shes been told off or breaks something just to prove shes mad at being given a row. We've took her tablet and tv stick off her, she gets grounded, though never really goes out much so not really much of a punishment anyway. I don't know what else we can do, I've tried talking to her, spending more time with her, shouting at her nothing works the behaviour and attitude is just constant. I don't even think it's to do with having either of the younger 2 as she has always been like this although admittedly getting worse or maybe just because she is the age she is it's more annoying as she surely should have grown out if most of this by now, it's like she has never grown out of the toddler stage, it's that bad that sometimes even the toddler is telling her no when she does things.

Anyway does anyone have any suggestions on how I can make her see this behaviour and attitude isnt acceptable anymore? Its causing arguments between me and dp now, I feel that he feels I should be doing more to stop it but I don't know what else I can do, we are just so exhausted with it all plus the wee ones, he jumps on her for every little thing she does now which annoys me as sometimes I just think he should let some things slide but then from his point of view we let too much slide and maybe if we tackle the little things the big things will stop too but that causes arguments cause then she feels like she can't do anything without being told off, though it doesnt stop her from doing it anyway.

Sometimes I think we should just split up because honestly if it was his dd behaving like this I wouldn't have stuck around this long, it's different as obviously I love my dd unconditionally I carried her and have been there every day of her life and I nearly lost her when she was born so I obviously have that attachment to her but he doesnt he can walk away at anytime and I can honestly see that day coming as the stress is really getting to us so part of me wants to walk away while it's my decision and I'm prepared for it but then that wouldn't stop dds behaviour I would just be dealing with it on my own with no one to moan to at the end of the day and why should the wee ones have to be split between 2 homes just because their sister can't behave.

OP posts:
Stressedmum4 · 16/11/2020 07:56

Sorry that was really long but just to add we do also make a conscious effort to praise the good behaviour and reward it in some way but it makes no difference.

OP posts:
BertieBotts · 16/11/2020 08:06

Has she ever been assessed for anything like autism/adhd?

I would usually say puberty, but the way you say she has always been full on, and the fact that ordinary discipline and connection aren't really making any difference are ringing alarm bells for me for something different.

BertieBotts · 16/11/2020 08:13

What happened when she was born that you nearly lost her?

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about these subjects:

Stressedmum4 · 16/11/2020 08:21

Thanks for your reply, I do have my concerns re this and also dyslexia as both her dad and my brother are dyslexic, though not sure how genetic that actually is, and I have repeatedly spoke to the school and the gp on advice from the school but they really weren't too concerned, despite every parents evening/report card saying she is an energetic child or needs to work on concentration or being told she likes to help but said in the way you can tell they mean very over involved. They did finally agree to an assessment 2 years ago but nothing came from it other than again being told she is energetic and that they don't think she is dyslexic or anything else so will probably grow out of it.

OP posts:
GreyishDays · 16/11/2020 08:25

Have you been to the GP?

GreyishDays · 16/11/2020 08:26

Sorry, missed that you have.

Have you looked at signs of ADHD? If she meets many of them you can then go back to the GP with a more definite suggestion.

Stressedmum4 · 16/11/2020 08:27

She was born 7 weeks early and not breathing so was rushed straight to NICU, I was then told she wasnt expected to make it through the night however she did and was home less than 2 weeks later so I feel very lucky to even have her.

OP posts:
delilabell · 16/11/2020 08:29

The hanging upside down is her trying to self regulate. How is she with clothes. Is their certain types she doesn't like wearing? Does she like having her hair brushed? Showers? Look up the star instute as they have a checklist for sensory processing disorder. The playing with slime and potions drawing on books little spatial awareness etc does sound like it.
What testing did they do at school? It might be that she is holding everything in at school and is letting it out at home.
She sounds with the searching the shopping bags etc like she is hypervigilant.
I missed the but that pp said about nearly losing her when she was a baby. Do you mean in utero?
My son has spd, hyoervogilence and adhd (he's actually adopted and has fasd) and a lot of what you describe sounds v similar. Here to chat iif you'd like.

Stressedmum4 · 16/11/2020 08:31

@GreyishDays

Sorry, missed that you have.

Have you looked at signs of ADHD? If she meets many of them you can then go back to the GP with a more definite suggestion.

Yeah that is what iv always thought might be the issue and what I specifically asked the school to assess for however despite being told repeatedly that she is energetic the assessment came back as possibly meeting some of the markers for ADD but she did not meet the hyperactive part?? But either way she didn't tick enough of their boxes to actually be diagnosed with anything.
OP posts:
Stressedmum4 · 16/11/2020 08:38

@delilabell

The hanging upside down is her trying to self regulate. How is she with clothes. Is their certain types she doesn't like wearing? Does she like having her hair brushed? Showers? Look up the star instute as they have a checklist for sensory processing disorder. The playing with slime and potions drawing on books little spatial awareness etc does sound like it. What testing did they do at school? It might be that she is holding everything in at school and is letting it out at home. She sounds with the searching the shopping bags etc like she is hypervigilant. I missed the but that pp said about nearly losing her when she was a baby. Do you mean in utero? My son has spd, hyoervogilence and adhd (he's actually adopted and has fasd) and a lot of what you describe sounds v similar. Here to chat iif you'd like.
Thank you, yes the clothes thing was an issue for years when she was younger, wouldn't wear jeans and only certain types of socks for example, she does seem to have grown out of that but actually thinking about it she now gets to pick a lot of her own clothes rather than just me buying what I like so maybe that's why it isnt such an issue now. She hates having her hair brushed and never has a shower though I remember trying it once when she was little and she screamed the house down. I do definitely think there is an issue but no one seems to agree. I'm not too sure exactly what the school done, she had a few sessions with an educational psychologist I think she was called and and occupational therapist came out to watch her in class, the ot said no issues at all and the educational psychologist is the one who said she possibly met some add markers but nothing that would trigger a diagnosis.
OP posts:
BertieBotts · 16/11/2020 08:53

Oh bless her that must have been stressful. ADHD can be caused by hypoxia (low oxygen) at birth, I suspect that may be where mine comes from. But long with dyslexia the more research we do the more things point to genetic links being the strongest.

Girls with ADHD can often be missed but the school report of energetic/needs to concentrate better is very typical.

BertieBotts · 16/11/2020 09:00

That's odd because there are two subtypes of ADHD, one inattentive, one hyperactive. Usually if you meet markers for one but not the other then you end up with a subtype diagnosis rather than the combined or classical type.

One other thing to bear in mind with the diagnostic criteria, particularly the hyperactive segment, is that they skew heavily towards boys as that is who they were written about.

But in any case, there can be a delay in things like impulse control without it necessarily being adhd. There is a great book called Smart But Scattered which might be of use to you.

raffle · 16/11/2020 09:08

All of those behaviours are present in DS2 who has ADHD and sensory processing disorder. I can count on one hand the amount of times I’ve seen him actually sit on the sofa properly, the way it was designed to be sat on! Grin

raffle · 16/11/2020 09:10

I would get the GP to refer to your local paediatric team for assessment. Both my boys have diagnoses but neither were via school.

Stressedmum4 · 16/11/2020 09:32

@BertieBotts

That's odd because there are two subtypes of ADHD, one inattentive, one hyperactive. Usually if you meet markers for one but not the other then you end up with a subtype diagnosis rather than the combined or classical type.

One other thing to bear in mind with the diagnostic criteria, particularly the hyperactive segment, is that they skew heavily towards boys as that is who they were written about.

But in any case, there can be a delay in things like impulse control without it necessarily being adhd. There is a great book called Smart But Scattered which might be of use to you.

I think that's what they were trying to say about not meeting any of the hyperactive markers but some for the the other but although she did meet some markers for the inattentive part she basically did not tick enough of those boxes either to allow any diagnosis to be made.

I do agree with whoever said that she may be able to hhude it to an extent at school but let's it out at home because she also doesnt really show this type of behaviour when shes at her dads but that's only once a week and he basically let's her do whatever she wants so doesnt really need to control her behaviour there anyway.

I will have a look for that book and read through it, thank you.

OP posts:
Stressedmum4 · 16/11/2020 09:39

@raffle

All of those behaviours are present in DS2 who has ADHD and sensory processing disorder. I can count on one hand the amount of times I’ve seen him actually sit on the sofa properly, the way it was designed to be sat on! Grin
Grin I'm the same hardly ever see her sitting properly or walking properly, always has to be doing cartwheels or some sort of zig zag or dance when she walks. Iv only just started allowing her to walk to school alone, 5 minutes away, as iv always been so worried she will zig zag onto the road but when I had the baby I was struggling to get the 2 wee ones dressed and out on time in the morning without making her late so she asked to just go herself and iv let her now but I am constantly on edge till she gets home at 3.
OP posts:
Stressedmum4 · 16/11/2020 09:40

I think I will try the gp again or maybe the health visitor for the wee ones? Do you think she could point me in the right direction if I discussed it with her even though she has never been the health visitor for oldest dd?

OP posts:
BertieBotts · 16/11/2020 19:52

Health visitors are not usually involved with children over 5 so she might not know, but it wouldn't hurt to ask.

New posts on this thread. Refresh page