Overwhelmed with newborn and toddler

[North2SouthMama]

I have two DD, one is nearly 21months the other just 6 weeks. Needing advice and just support as I'm finding things difficult.

I'm due to see my HV next week, so I will discuss with her. Difficult to go into detail comfortably she next visits as DH currently works from home and will be in ear shot.

I'm finding it exhausting and emotionally draining having two. It's sad as I've wished for this and I'm greatful I've been able to have two and both are well. I kick myself as my background is with children, with the most difficult and challenging behaviours and learning difficulties. I've also a background in counselling and yet find it difficult to see my situation clearly or how to resolve when I'm in it.

Because of my background I feel additional annoyance and guilt...that I should know better, that I have the techniques to de-stress, to be more patient, but I don't.

Earlier in the week, after nights of sleep deprivation and days of both crying, no me time other than a half hour bath, I felt unstable. Evening time, youngest DD was awake and restless yet again and I found myself angrily telling her to be quiet. I felt unable to cope and had intrusive thoughts that made me feel awful.

So I woke DH up. We chose, like with our first, to temporarily sleep in separate rooms so he can sleep for work. This time round he had the monitor for our toddler. He took his time and had a loo break first, not understanding the severity of the situation. Then proceeded to try and help to reassure me I wouldn't harm our baby. To which I burst crying and angrily explaining I felt unstable and began to have a panic attack. He listened and then took our youngest with him so I could get a few hours uninterrupted sleep.

Today I broke down in tears after nearly losing my temper. Just a day filled with both wanting me, both crying. Toddler causing more stress and havock, whether throwing food and items when not having her own way. This was toys down the stairs and food from the table.

I use what techniques I know, show understanding, explain. Short instruction in a low tone voice, ensure they're not distracted by noise or TV and give them time to think....did not work today

Today I hadn't even had a poo (to be crude) in peace! With youngest watching because she didn't wanna be away from me. got to laugh having an audience. I hadn't eaten in peace with eldest running, youngest BF and me trying to eat one handed... guilt when lettuce fell from my mouth to her head!

The final when stuck BF, eldest chose to grab essence oil on the table. Ignoring instructions not to climb the chair, to put it down. After 5 times repeating it in different ways I shouted and carried eldest upstairs, placed in cot (thank God she can't climb out, at the moment!) and told my now crying DD I told her not to touch, it's dangerous and to sit and think...like my nearly 2yr can do that!

It was more me placing her somewhere safe and me time to cool. Leaving a few mins and having a cry, I returned to her signing and saying sorrym I explained properly. But this time, I had nothing left in me. Normally I'd hug. I couldn't do that. I asked if she was sleepy, put her blanky over her and left to collapse in a teary heap.

I'm aware my DD 'plays up' to get attention or when tired. She was tired. But prior she'd had so much of my time, snuggles in the sofa, hide and seek. I'd even prepped and attempted salt dough with her, which went tits up with her flinging dough in a paddy.

Meanwhile hubby, having booked today off, had made the girls breakfast. Then gone with a friend to buy a car, as recently we were in an accident. Thankfully all ok, including the poor family we were involved with. He then had a takeout, eating with no screaming kids, no one suking his tit and with both hands at his pace 😅 he deserves it. He's working all week, he needs social time and something nice to do.

He returns home to a watery wife and listens to me telling him about my day. The guilt I feel again not being excited as I should be on our good news of soon having transport again.

He suggests I go for a walk to lift my mood. So I quickly do some errands while DDs are both asleep and then go out, leaving DH on the sofa playing his console while youngest slept and eldest napped upstairs.

I fell better. Fresh air, exercise. Then I return to find DH still on his game. It being passed the time DD needs waking. The lounge is a mess and no dinner.

I feel heartbroken, fed up. DH has seen me break down with no sleep, aware youngest is almost always strapped to me, aware I've had no time to myself. Yet I can't understand how he can then have time to himself and then want more. Of course we both want more, but for him I feel he puts his needs first and can't say when.

I try talk to him, but he can get very defensive. Recently when I've spoke to him he's listened, said he'd take on board and help out more, then this happens.

DH is an amazing Dad, he always has time for them, puts them first. He always put eldest to bed and baths her, unless i say I will. I try have 1:1 time with her as she needs it and I know there's jealousy with the new born. But I don't feel supported evenly.

I know this is the hardest part and it will pass.
DH and I have been together over 10 years, growing into adults together. But I don't want to crumble before we get through this. At the moment it feels as though it's just me going through this, the sleeplessness etc.

A very long write, cathartic . If you've made it to hear thank you. I hope you can help.

**also family live far away

I try talk to him, but he can get very defensive. Recently when I've spoke to him he's listened, said he'd take on board and help out more, then this happens.

Honestly OP, I think it's hard for you to see when you're in the thick of things and struggling but was "this" really all that bad.

Your DH said he'd help out more and it sounds like he's trying to, taking the baby so you could sleep for a few hours without interruption, having the monitor for the toddler, suggesting you go for a walk alone to clear your head. I mean, there was a bit of mess and he didn't start dinner, but is that such a big deal? Both children were sleeping and he was having a bit of downtime too, which I'm sure you both need right now with a 6 week old.

You, on the other hand, sound like you're not in a good place and IMO you should probably look to book an appointment with your GP sooner rather than later. Have you considered that you might have PND? It's nothing to be ashamed of if you do but the sooner you can get help by speaking to somebody about it the better.

It is going to be difficult with two kids who are so little and they both need you physically and emotionally. In the kindest possible way, can I say I do not understand why people have kids with such small gaps, it should be obvious they will struggle with them. Your older one is so little and needs you and there is only one of you!! It's understandable you will find it challenging and they must too.

@doyouknow completely not helpful even saying it in the kindest possible way. There's a myriad of reasons why people would have a smaller age gap and 2 years is relatively average.

Op it's bloody hard I'm 5 months in and it's just starting to settle down. You are not prepared for the relentlessness and the behaviour change in your toddler no matter how much you think you are. I think your husband is trying and I agree with others when they say perhaps chatting to gp would be useful. It DOES get better but it is a slog, you can't rest like you did with the first baby. Is your 21 month old in nursery? Is this something you'd consider? Can you get some ready meals in to make life easier?

It sounds like you’re really in the trenches with two little ones, and lack of sleep can really make you feel unstable - there’s a reason why it’s used as a form of torture! Keep up the walks for a bit of headspace. Like you, my DH is an amazing dad but often it does not even occur to him to do certain things like tidying up or putting on dinner. I’ve found that by giving specific instructions it has lightened my mental load and avoided any extra angst with my DH. I would also suggest like a PP said to maybe get yourself checked out for PND with a GP.
It’s a really hard time raising such small humans, but they have what reads like a very loving, thoughtful and conscientious mother

Having a newborn and toddler is really, really demanding and hard work. The sleep deprivation is actual torture.
It's good you’ll be able to talk to your hv about this.
I think you need to be very specific with your dh. Tell him to cook dinners some days, he can take the baby so you can have a nap or some peace, he takes dc1 out to burn off some energy.
You should be able to go to the toilet or have a shower in peace.
I did things like reading with the toddler every time I bf the baby, or snuggled up to watch some tv programme and just talking to toddler about it.
Do you have a twin buggy that toddler will sit in? That was a life saver for me. I would walk to the park while baby slept and gave the toddler a snack and it was peaceful.
Then played with dc1 for a bit.

You will find your own routine but it’ll take some time.

@Doyouknow what a fucking awful thing to say to someone struggling.

OP we have a thread in parenting for toddlers and newborns. Mine are 25 months and 3 weeks and I'm struggling too.

You aren't alone

You're martyring yourself and putting your husband's needs above your own.

"he deserves it. He's working all week, he needs social time and something nice to do."
And you don't? You're looking after two young children all week, which is arguably harder than working from home.

I'm in a similar position; I have a 3 year old and a 6 week old. Luckily my oldest is in nursery 3 days a week but the days with them both (after nights with the baby) are hard work! My husband works from home and makes lunch for us all. If baby isn't sleeping or happy in her bouncer, he'll hold her so I can eat my meal with both hands.

You need to expect and ask more of your husband. If you're breastfeeding he can't do the night feeds but he could settle baby in the evenings while you go straight to bed after the last feed, he could get up with toddler and baby in the morning and you could stay in bed a bit longer, he could do more household tasks to relieve the burden on you.

You know about mental health so you know what you have to do, which is prioritising your own needs. And you need to do your best to stop the negative self talk, too, the "should" word, the feelings of guilt and blaming yourself for not coping better. Perhaps some CBT or talking therapy would help you to change that and be kinder to yourself.

Sorry I meant to say 8 week old, 6 must have been a typo.

@OhToBeASeahorse language seahorse! Whatever you have to say to me can be send in a sensible language.
Hope you find all the right help OP. My sincerest good wishes to you.

I'll use whatever language I see fit, thanks.

Completely agree with the advice from NameChange30. Honestly I cant think of a job that would be more demanding than this.

You need to tell your husband that you need privacy when the HV visits next week. He can arrange it with work and take your toddler out for an hour or so. You need to be able to tell the HV everything you're going through.

There’s no easy solution OP. It’s hard for you because the age gap is quite small so it will be hard work for now until your youngest gets a bit bigger.

Do you have any family or friends near by?

Do a quick dinner if it’s beans on toast so you can sleep earlier that is totally fine whatever it takes OP.

@Aquamarine1029

You need to tell your husband that you need privacy when the HV visits next week. He can arrange it with work and take your toddler out for an hour or so. You need to be able to tell the HV everything you're going through.

Agree with this too.

Maybe dh needs to hear you say how hard you are finding it and how little he is doing to help.

Oh OP, you poor thing. I found the step up from one to two incredibly difficult. You’re absolutely in the trenches right now.

I don’t have any practical advice behind what’s already been suggested, but the big thing I found helpful was to drop my standards. So when you talk about handling your DD after the essential oil incident, I think you coped really well. She was safe and you knew what your limits were. Everyone shouts occasionally. But the first time that sort of thing happened to me, I beat myself up about it, as you are doing. Now, if I’m having a bad day, I try to live by the mantra ‘everyone fed and no one dead’.

Good luck to you, and do chat to your HV or GP.

OP, I don't have much to had other than the fact that having a professional background in working with children pales in comparison to actually having children. It is not the same at all, so don't beat yourself up about that.

The newborn stage is arguably the hardest so don't feel bad for leaning on your husband for more support. You carried and birthed the children so father's do not need the mothers to go easy on them.

You will get through this and it will get much easier. Maybe in a couple of years time, you will be on Mumsnet offering advice and solidarity to a mum who is in a similar position 💐.

@FTMF30

OP, I don't have much to had other than the fact that having a professional background in working with children pales in comparison to actually having children. It is not the same at all, so don't beat yourself up about that.

The newborn stage is arguably the hardest so don't feel bad for leaning on your husband for more support. You carried and birthed the children so father's do not need the mothers to go easy on them.

You will get through this and it will get much easier. Maybe in a couple of years time, you will be on Mumsnet offering advice and solidarity to a mum who is in a similar position 💐.

I completely agree with this OP, please don't feel that you should be able to cope better than someone else and put yourself under extra pressure for that reason. Talk to your health visitor and GP, and while this may not be a popular opinion on MN, I would advise seriously thinking about weaning your baby into formula, you will get more sleep and DH will be able to feed and care for the baby too. Sounds like you are getting into a bad place, so think about what might be possible. Childcare for the older one? Help in the house? Could DH take some time off work? Do you have any family who could come and stay for a few weeks? None of these things might be straightforward but if they are possible, they are worth considering in order to protect your mental health and ensure you can be the mummy you want to be. for you, I hope things look better for you very soon.

Reading this thread with trepidation. I'm due DC 2 in January. DD will be 2.5. I'm getting really anxious about it. We have no family nearby, and DH doesn't WFH. Also, the thought of another lockdown, no baby groups etc terrifies me, as they kept me afloat during my first mat leave.

Hey all, thank you for taking your time to read and your comments to help.

@doyouknow , The age gap we chose purposely as both DH and I have 2/3 school years between ourself and our sibling. Both having fond (and also annoying 😅) memories with them being close in age. We were aware it may be a challenge but could not have known this, same as having a first baby is a shock with the sleep dep, you can be told but nothing can really prepare you. Not once have I had a 'what have we done' moment or regret. Just it's a huge adjustment and finding our way.

@rottiemum88 down time is absolutely fine and needed. The issue is how much and is it balanced between DH and I. The answer has unfortunately been no.

I had learnt even more so from DD n0 1. so I had batch cooked and frozen even more meals so we've been living off them which has been a time saver.

So many kind and helpful comments. Interesting considering if PND. Confusion is that I can joke, I do enjoy some things, I get out of bed no issues and get on with things, so then I question if it is. But I have been weepy, I have had guilt, low tolerance, anxiety, panick attacks, worrying thoughts, difficulty sleeping, tiredness. On the whole DH pulls his weight. Will discuss with HV when I see her next.

I managed to speak over the phone to a family member who had wise words to add to those on here. She said I need to tell DH what needs doing, that he doesn't see it. Now I've been focusing on changing his perspective so he's aware what needs doing...i.e dirty clothes in basket need to be washed, food on floor needs hoovering, or DD will wake from nap hangry, having both girls and cooking will be tricky so best prepare prior.

I had not thought I should ask or highlight what needs doing as I thought firstly surely he can see and secondly if I think this way he can. But he can't. We just think differently and in our house I'm the organiser. It's how it's been. Also asking for help stung me as it's team work not him doing me a favour.

I discussed with DH and explained I'm struggling and feeling wobbly. That he's great with the kids and I now recognise he's trying his best. He described us well, that I think of the future and him the present. That is we were both present it would be havock, but both future could be regimental. So balance of both works great. Communication is the key thing. We realised although we've spoken we hadn't properly talked.

With the stress of the recent accident, my medical issues, the trauma the birth of DD, family living away, the current covid restrictions, DD going through 'terrible twos' it's all been a bit too much.
There's no let up. Having family is a huge thing, as just having an hour a week to do jobs, eat in peace, bit of me time, time together would make a world of difference. Although we miss them we do love it where we live now.

Thank you again mums who are in or have been on a similar situaion. It's reassuring knowing I'm not alone and it will improve x

Can you put the toddler in childcare a few days a week? You can catch up on some rest when the baby naps then.

I'm 4 weeks in with newborn and 23 month old and it's emotionally so hard to not be able to parent your toddler as you've grown used to or parent the newborn like you did with your first and there was just one. It's upsetting to feel the strain it puts on the relationship with the eldest.
I don't have any wise words as I'm still trying to work it out too but just wanted to say from reading you seem to have incredibly high expectations for yourself.
You have (understandably) found some aspects of having two very difficult and seem to view this as a big let down or a failure. The alternative to this is having two and never ever finding it hard, adjusting with no difficulty whatsoever, never having to ask for help...everything being perfect and easy. That was never going to happen and doesn't happen for anyone! Finding it difficult isn't a problem in itself, that's incredibly normal! So amongst all the guilt of trying to be the best Mum to two don't give yourself guilt for finding it hard as well. Allow yourself to find it hard and allow yourself to ask for what you need in terms of help.
I hope you have a good chat with the HV and DH. Go a bit easier on yourself, wishing us both luck!

OP I had a toddler when my daughter was born. It was a long time ago but I remember it well. I also had another child when my daughter was a toddler so I had three little ones in four years.

All I would say to you is to involve your toddler when you bath the baby or when you dress or change him/her. Involve the child and make him feel like he is helping you with the baby and you may find the bad behaviour dissipates.

When my little girl was born my son hit other children at playgroups and would not play nicely. He was jealous of the attention his sister was getting so I had to remove us from situations like that. He helped me to bath her at night and I remember him getting into her baby bath after we had bathed her. It became a fun time.

Hope that helps you a little x

I just have my newborn today but she is refusing sleep. She woke up at 8.15 and has had 20 minutes since.
My first one was like this. Cant believe it's happening again