Why are people so arsey about vegetarian kids?

[bohemianbint]

DS is 14 months and vegetarian, because I am - we don't have meat in the house and I don't touch it so there's no way I'd be feeding him meat even if I wanted to. (Which I don't.) The way I see it, it's not a problem, I know about what foods to give him to make sure he's not missing out and he's a very healthy lad who will eat anything.

So yesterday, my brother said me "forcing" vegetarianism on him is the same as me "forcing" religion on him and compared it to christening a child and making a fundamental decision for him.

The way I see it is he can do whatever when he's older (but I'll never be cooking it for him!) but if he chooses to be a vegetarian he can't "un-eat" the meat. If he wants to eat meat, then fine. Why should I "force" meat eating on him? I had it forced on me and it really screwed me up.

Anyone else had to deal with this sort of attitude and how do you deal with it? I found "shut up" worked reasonably well yesterday (I get so tired of justifying myself!) but not really that eloquent, is it...

[Tommy]

walnutshell - I suppose I as thinking in particular about a twunt of a boyfriend I had once - he was a fool

[alittleone2]

Message withdrawn

[Walnutshell]

Tommy - ah I see! Well, he probably had a lot of values himself hence his strong feelings! Twunt indeed!

[Walnutshell]

Whatever you say to him, say it calmly and gently - try to show tolerance by being tolerant even if you really want to smack him in the face with a hot lentil pasty.

[bohemianbint]

Hmmm...I might just leave it, to be honest. He'll be doing it on purpose to wind me up. Sometimes I think he actually really dislikes me.

[Cocobear]

As to the ghoulish point: Veggie parents, when you tell your young children about vegetarianism, how do you explain why you and they don't eat meat? I mean, it IS because it's cruel to animals and I don't want to eat dead flesh.

However, if I say that to DS (nearly 4) then he'll repeat it to his friends (bad) and they'll repeat it to their parents (worse). Because even though it might be fine to think that meat-eating is cruel and therefore you don't do it, it's rude and unnecessary to say that to someone who does eat meat.

Right now we just say something like, "oh, we don't eat fish because the fish wouldn't like to be eaten, would it?" Fine for now, but somehow I reckon on further questioning down the line!

[moljam]

when people tell me im forcing my views on my children by not giving them meat i ask if theyre forcing there views on there children by giving them meat.shuts them up.my children are happy and healthy.because of all the negative people im prepared with my list of where my children are getting what nutrients.a lot of my friends with dc who eat meat dont know where there dcs are getting what.

[Carmenere]

If the animals are raised and killed well it is not cruel to eat them but I suspect that is where we will differ
I avoid eating any intensively reared meats but I do believe that they are a valuable and delicious source of nutrients. I also think it is important for children to know that meat comes from animals as I think that if they think it comes from packets in tescos that they will not feel empathy with how they are raised and killed.

[Cocobear]

Morningglory - If your children eat meat, then you have made a choice to let them eat it. By making this choice, you are telling them that eating meat is a good thing (because you're a loving parent, and if it wasn't a good thing, you wouldn't let them do it).

I'm not at all condemning your choice. But don't tell me you didn't make one.

[Elkat]

We're raising our children meat free (although they do eat fish), so technically not quite veggies, but even so we've had lots of people make snidey comments such as we're forcing our choices onto them. Depending on how much they have peed me off, I might respond with ...

1. As others have said, I point out that their comment is completely fallacious - that the whole point of good parenting is to force your choices onto your child. Every good parent forces their child to be kind, considerate, go to a good school etc etc...
   
   
2. I also point out that as we don't eat meat in the house, how could we possibly give our DD a nutritious diet if she did eat meat? I wouldn't cook a joint of beef just for her, so if she had meat it would no doubt be the low quality meat that you get in turkey twislers / children's parties / food bars / fast or processed food. If they have particularly annoyed me, I might even point out that to force such food onto a small child who knows no better is awful, and IMO bad parenting (but like I say, that comment is reserved for the particularly obnoxius people)
   
   
3. DD is her own proof of how nutritious and healthy she is, when she tells everyone that her favourite food is Salad, she happily snacks on broccoli, carrot sticks and the like. She readily eats lentils and all food types - people can hardly say she has a bad diet. If anything I believe her being vegetarian has given her a love of veg and I'm forever saying to her "Don't just eat your fruit and veg" which I think, if and when she decides to eat meat later on in life, then she is set up with a love for fruit, veg and healthy foods.
   
   
4. Just because something is the norm, does not make it right - Fallacy of popularity. Just because people over here mostly eat meat, does not necessarily make it right - we need to look at the issue intellectually and objectively, and not through the blinkers of our social norms.
   
   That normally shuts most people up! (but might piss them off too - so if you like them, just stick to 'each to their own'! )

[newgirl]

we are not veggie but ... logically i think kids could be raised veggie then given the option to have meat later - if we are talking from a 'choice' point of view

[Cocobear]

Carmenere - yes, you're right. I should have said it's because I think it's cruel. Of course it is a matter of opinion.

[Hallgerda]

I think "shut up" is fine, and that attempting to justify yourself is a sign of weakness. You don't have to be eloquent .

I'm a vegetarian, my children have been vegetarian all their lives and my eldest is 13. It's never been an issue. I can't force the children to do anything when I'm not there - that is sufficiently obvious not to need pointing out to them (they seem to be perfectly capable of working that one out over other issues ). But as far as I'm aware they have remained vegetarian, and through choice.

[salsmum]

I find on the whole that people i've met who are veggies expect people to 'accommodate' the fact that they don't eat meat at parties/family gatherings etc and most of us are respectful of that fact BUT try asking a vegetarian to 'accomodate' you as a meat eater in the same situation and they will bulk and say handeling chicken/steak etc etc makes them feel sick and give you some long winded speech about how that animal was slaughteredI have been 'questioned' by 6 year olds about my motives for eating meat so as much as vegetarians get hassled for not eating meat it can work BOTH ways.

[VeniVidiVickiQV]

BB - I have skimmed so dont know if you have been asked this already, but, would you actively prevent your DS from eating meat. Say if he went to a friends house or a party and there was meat there - would you ensure he wouldnt eat it?

[Amethyst8]

Was a vegetarian for 10 years though I now do eat fish.

I find that people are very combatative about this life style choice. The reaction is always the same unless the person you are telling is also a vegetarian. I found that most people seemed really angry immediately on being told. I think it is because most people actually feel guilty about eating meat deep down and therefore go immediately on the attack when the subject comes up. For those of you reading this post and feeling irritated. Why is that?

Never really seen meat as necessary. My Mum had a fit when I turned vegetarian at 14. Know for a fact it won t bother me if my kids want to do it. When your kids are small they go with all your life style choices don t they? so giving your child a vegetarian diet is not a problem IMO but do think they should be allowed to try meat if they want to when they are old enough to make an informed decision. Is only wrong if you try to force them at an older age.

[salsmum]

When i was in hospital with my prem dd there was a couple who had a tiny baby in the incubater next door.
They told the nurses they were both vegans and thus wanted their baby to only have soya milk in bottle.
Fair enough that was their choice BUT the poor lil mite spent the next week throwing up after every feed because he obviously could'nt tolerate the soya milk.
Against the advice of the nurses they carried on .
I just felt that this was really painful to watch because at that age the baby did'nt have a choice. It's different if your child has an intolerance to other milk for medical condition but it's not the nicest tasting milk around.
It just seemed so wrong watching thois poor baby suffer every feed time.

[CorrieDale]

I take your point about the questioning salsmum, but I think your point about being accommodated as a meateater isn't really valid. We're having a veggie buffet when DD is baptised next week (yes, I AM forcing my children to be veggie and catholics and I'm not bothered who gets arsey about it!) because I want 2 year old DS to be able to eat anything he wants at his sister's party. As can the meat-eaters! My mum really likes meat and doesn't really consider a meal to be a meal unless she's had some, but I'm not going to be sending her away hungry or lacking any vital nutrients. Whereas at the virtually all-meat buffet I was at recently, I went away hunry. That's the difference.

[panickypatch]

to op. siblings will say things to us that others wont. it's possible that what your brother said was out of concern for his nephew. its also possible that he was just omouthing off about something thats been niggling him because he had a bad day at work adn his sister looked at him in the wrong way.

vegetarian kids are easy i find. its the kids whose parents have them on faddy, intolerant to everything diets that are the nightmares. (not the actually allergic ones, jus the faddy ones, huge differnce)

[LadyMuck]

I have no beef about vegetarian children, although I chuckle quietly at the thought of a vegetarian 14mo as my memory of that age was that they would happily put anything and everything into their mouth - slugs, mud, pebbles....

Where it starts getting more troublesome is when you're organising school age parties and your 4yo vegetarian guests don't realise that they're not supposed to eat ham sandwiches, and in between keeping order amongst 20+ kids, their mum is expecting you to keep a sharp look out to check what they're eating. I certainly wouldn't try to force a ham sandwich or chicken nugget on any child, but frankly between dairy intolerances, peanut allergies, religious practices and vegetarian children it is becoming a total pain. So no, I have absolutely no problem with you raising your child as vegetarian, but at the point he starts goign to school birthday parties he needs to know what he can and can't eat. The "it was the first time he has ever seen ham and didn't realise that it was meat" doesn't go down well if you've just been entertaining 20 kids for 2 hours. I do have a lot of sympathy however with parents who which their children to eat halal, as that is trickier (ie they can eat some chicken nuggets but not others), but then those parents also seem to check with me in advance and remind their children directly before the party.

[panickypatch]

salsmum, .
why wasnt the mother expressing breastmilk for her baby?
india is full of vegans. they have thrived for millenia. but they all breastfed their babies.

sorry, but to me that is child abuse. and the doctors should put a stop to it.

[panickypatch]

totally agree ladymuck. school age brithday parities are a nightmare until the kids themselves know what they can and cant eat.
ds2 used to get very confused about why he coudlnt eat sausages at parties, but could have them at home.

[salsmum]

panickypatch,
I don't know why she did'nt breastfeed this was my local hosp that my girl had been transferred to so they were in the scbu when i arrived.
I have no probs with other peoples lifestyle choices but as said this was really uncomfortable watching.
It was 18 years ago and although the nurses kept trying to get mum n dad to try another type of baby milk the parents were adament so rather than argue the nurses would walk away exasperated possibly hoping the parents would see sense????

[PoshCod]

ohg od veggies piss me right off

[spooklesandwhine]

I haven't read through the whole thread just the op and a few posts but I think people get arsey because you have made the decision for them and express there own opinion onto you because you have made a choice which differs from theirs - sometimes its a case of 'well I eat meat and my dc eat meat and it doesn't do us any harm' its a boring argument to go through seeing as people make choices for their dc all the time I don't see why this differs, as long as you are providing them with a healthy balanced diet

That said I am strict veggie and have been for nearly 20 years - I grew up in cyprus a big meat eating country - but became veggie when i came back to the UK as I was more aware of the farming standards then and chose not to eat it

BUT I have 4 DC and they all eat meat and I do cook it for them, I make sure I buy the best meat I can for them and make all dishes fresh so that i know what goes into them. My choice for my children was that they can have meat as part of their diet and choose when they are older, but they also eat alot of vegetarian meals too. My older DC don't question my choices too much at the moment but when they do I will tell them my reasons and they will be able to make an informed choice

I know many people who eat meat themselves but who have chosen to bring their children up as veggies too!

Good Luck and don't let the buggers get to you!