Is mother tongue input only at home really enough? Homework/reading help?

[Giuliettatoday]

Hi there,

new problems, new thoughts...

Both dh and I speak German (our mother tongue) only at home with our children and live in the UK. Our children attend a state school.

So far we've always sticked to the home/community language rule, as advised by speech therapists and as is mostly advised elsewhere.

Now there are two problems: Our middle son (6) has selective mutism and refused to speak English at school for a long time. It's improved a lot, he speaks freely with his friends, however, with the teachers it's still one-word-answers. While this is a big success, I still believe that being bilingual is a big part of the problem.

According to the teacher, he will read a book to her, but not talk about it with her, apart from giving one-word-answers.

If we read a book at home, even an Oxford Reading Tree one from school, he reads it in English but we talk about it in German. Ds initiates the conversation about it in German and has a lot to say about it, even without me asking any questions. I feel that somehow he doesn't get enough practice to actually speak English and broaden his active use of English vocabulary.

On the other hand I know from families in similar situations (however without the selective mutism problem) that English normally becomes the (much!) stronger language anyway.

At this point I'm panicking though that my son might fall behind in literacy. According to the teacher, he has the potential, also to write, but as it is he's behind. He seems to have difficulties forming ideas in English and then putting them down. But often it's lack of ideas, or inability to express himself in English. Sometimes it feels that he has to switch on his brain for English while German just comes out naturally.

Also, ds3 has started nursery, and the nursery nurse advised me to sometimes talk English with him. I disagreed as it contradicts all advice I've ever received.

However, I'm not sure about the homework thing. Would you, in my case, talk in English about a book (from school that is)? Give prompts for writing in English to ease the "switching" between languages? On the other hand, dss German is not perfect either.

Yes.
We were dragged brought back to Wales for 6 weeks every winter and also put in a Welsh medium school (where we were viewed as akin to something from Mars-three little brown gilrs who never wore shoes, suddenly thrust into your average 70s primary school).

On reflection, I'm sure my parents would sometimes have preferred to spend their time and money on more exotic places closer to PNG but they never did.

It was years before I experienced a Welsh summer and realised that it was really quite nice.

Guffaw at Kinder having serious convo with someone called 'Fatslag'.Terrible name!

moonDOG
I checked her name 3 times before posting that!

lmao

and are there any two places in the world more different than PNG and Wales? You poor thing, it must have been some culture shock. But well done to your parents for making the huge effort.

I know.It was completely mad.
We thought that allotments were village garden and that tv aerial were garden rakes on upside down.

No tv in PNG and no school on our island.We had lessons sent from Oz, did them and sent them back to be marked.

Completely bonkers and utterly fab childhood!

pmsl

you should see size of my rear end...

Yes,but are you a slag???
And is so,in what language?

I suppose on MagicMaman I would be "grossepetasse".

Did none of you youngsters ever read Viz?

DH refers to me as an old slapper, so draw your own conclusions

Oh yes,Viz was essential uni reading.

lol, I actually like the name fatslag. Reminds me of my years in the venture scouts.

That's enough about MMMMMMMMMMMMMMEEEEEEEEEEEE anyway. I'm off to wave my bum out of the window.

Getting back to the OP, I haven't read all the posts so may be contradicting/repeating the advice of others. Both my husband and I are English mother tongue but live in Belgium. Our boys are 18 and 16 and were born here. Many of our English-speaking friends did as we did and put our children into the French-speaking school system. English remained the home language at all times for us and all of our friends (where English was the mother tongue of both parents) as this is what were advised to do. The idea behind this is that the children don?t get confused, ie the home language is always English, the school language is always French. This is very much the same idea as advising a mother and father of different mother tongues to keep to their mother tongue rather than flitting between languages as this avoids confusing the child. I would say the only exceptions to this in our house were the odd school-related words and sometimes numbers because the school dictated mental sums making it necessary to be competent in calculating in French. In all other cases, including discussion about homework, English was used.

However the outcome for each child has not been the same. Where the mums worked and the children therefore spent longer hours in the school environment and also attended holiday schools the French usually overtook English as the mother tongue. Where the mums stayed at home and therefore had greater exposure to English, the English remained dominant. This was seen by the language in which the siblings communicated.

The outcome within a family has not always been the same either. I taught my sons to read in English at the end of second year primary once their French reading had been established (I was told it was inadvisable for them to learn to read in both languages simultaneously). From then on our eldest child when reading for pleasure would only read in English but our youngest son preferred to read in French. For a variety of reasons we decided that the boys should finish their education in English. Our eldest son completely immersed himself in everything about the British school whilst our youngest son prefers to socialise with his Belgian friends.

Certainly because our children had a large input of English, they were slower to become fluent in French than they would have been had we spoken more French at home. This makes certain activities at school more difficult for them than for their classmates in the short-term but they do get past this, honestly! Once you get through the tough times the reward of bilingual children is great. They may (or may not) always suffer from a lack of vocabulary in certain areas in both languages but I believe the benefits far outweigh the disadvantages. Please do not give up on speaking German to your children - you are giving them a great gift.

I hadn't checked for answers for a couple of days and suddenly there are so many interesting ones, which is nice.

Longtimeinbrussels: I will certainly not give up speaking German with my children, it would feel far too unnatural, and my English is ok, but not great. I have to say to make up questions in English about an English book I'd even had to switch on my brain .

I remember I once tried asking ds2 questions (in English) that were printed at the back of the book, and he was not very keen on answering them. If we talk about an (English) book in German, he doesn't even need many questions or prompts, it somehow flows very naturally.

My children attend classes where they meet other English speaking adults and children, we also have some German friends in a similar situation so they occasionally hear other adults and children speak German, too. Also at school there are other bilingual children with a variety of languages, so they definitely know they're not the only ones.

fatslag: Your point is interesting because my middle child not only has selective mutism, but also refused to eat vegetables for a long time. Ds1 does both (speak both languages and eat veg) without problems.

Thanks for all your interesting messages, I think I'll have to re-read some!

Hi everyone - first post on this forum so treat me gently. We are English parents in France and I am determined to maintain my DDs' English. DD1 learnt to read in English, then in French (now reluctantly reads in either language), DD2 learnt to read in French and then in English (now devours books in either language) and DD3 is doing both simultaneously (yes I too have heard the sequential view). Previously we lived in Geneva where just about everyone seemed to have 2 different nationality parents, an au pair with a third language and went to school in a fourth - the sequential rule didn't seem to be a consideration. So far DD3 is coping brilliantly, both English and French teachers say she is about to take off and she is very motivated to start in both languages. It may all come tumbling down - I'll let you know.....
Just for the record, we are completely English at home (table, tv, radio, homework) as I believe it is essential to keep up their English to help them in the future. Schooling, friends and activities are in French.

FranceMum - hello and welcome . Whereabouts are you? What sort of school are your children at - French or other?

Hi Anna8888

We are further south in 86 - our kids are at the local French school. We don't have a choice here, but to be honest the school is fab. I have just set up an association to teach Anglophone kids English based on one we used to attend in Geneva so this is a topic very close to my heart!

Thanks for the fast welcome!

I'm sure that if you are diligent about maintaining an Anglophone home, and that you ensure your children keep reading lots and watching TV/DVD/films in English, that their English will be fine. Do you go back to England much?

Welcome Frenchmum,

interesting to hear your experiences of simultaneous vs sequential teaching to read. I have just started teaching DD English as she will start German school next year.

There is a good chance that we will move to Geneva next year, so it might be that she will be learning French instead. I am a bit worried about how she will manage starting school when she does not speak the language. We are starting French lessons in January but she will be far from fluent by the summer, I guess.

Did your children go to a state school in Geneva?

Guilietta- my gut reaction would be to speak English when helping your son with reading and homework, because that is where he is weak. It sounds like your English is more than good enough (pretty perfect, in fact) to be a real help to him. My only experience of selective mutism was when we moved to France and my younger DD (then aged 5) refused to speak at school for 6 months. She didn't like the idea of getting it wrong so assimilated quietly in her head until she was confident enough to speak. Maybe your son is the same, afraid of making mistakes, of sounding "foreign"? If so then more practise, and time, should give him the confidence to get over it.

Hi FranceMum, and welcome! We live in Brittany but have a different set-up at home (DH is French and we speak French to each other, the DCs speak to him in French and to me in English - when they remember).
How old are your DDs? Good luck with your association - if only we were closer I'd love my children to go to something like that!

In my experience it's much easier to maintain children's bilingualism in a home where the "minority" language is the only language spoken. I have to insist my DDs speak to me in English since French became their dominant language because we all speak/understand both languages.

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pitchouette, dd learnt to read German at school last year. She was fluent by December I'd say (German being fairly straight forward and phonetic) and I started teaching her to read in English (which is more difficult I think) from about January (so after 4 months of German). It was no problem at all because she really picked up reading German fast and was doing very well at that already.

Think it's not such a HUGE issue for bilingual dc really. Once they get the hang of the idea in one language, the transition to reading a second isn't all that fraught. She does sometimes stumble if she comes across an Anglicism in a German book, but she's getting the hang of that too.

The only time I would delay teaching a dc to read a second language is if s/he is struggling or an unenthusiastic reader in the first language. Then I don't see any great harm in waiting a bit.

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