Best time to start nursery in community language?

[vesela]

Hello,

DH and I are native English speakers who live in the Czech Republic (Prague) and are here (as far as we know) for the long term. We have a 5-month-old DD.

Ideally, I'd like to delay her going to nursery as long as possible (I've been working P/T freelance - I'm a translator - for the last couple of months, and DH also freelances, so it's been working out so far, although that may well change as she gets mobile! We'll see how it goes.)

At the same time, though, I don't want her to be at a disadvantage in learning Czech for when she starts preschool at 3 (especially since anecdotal evidence suggests preschools, currently oversubscribed, are discriminating when it comes to non-Czech-speakers, and they're not getting places - which is bad, I know).

We have native English-speaking in-laws close by, and a number of English-speaking friends, but fewer close Czech ones at the moment (although DH and I both speak Czech and I want to start some mother-baby activities in Czech).

Anyway, I'd be grateful to hear your experiences - when do you think is the best time in terms of a child's first-language development to start childcare in the community language?

Not related to nursery per se, but you needn't worry about your baby's first language suffering by exposing her to Czech right now, if you speak only English at home exposure will be 50/50 (unlike in my case where DP's language is the community language and he doesn't speak English). My DD has been exposed to both languages from birth and although she is at present dominant in the community language as she spends all day at nursery, she has absolutely no problems with English and will quite happily speak it around English rellies. Babies are amazing in what they soak up and the human brain at that stage can cope with anything.

Childcare is a different matter altogether, 5 mo is quite early to leave a child at nursery, but if you can get your DD exposed to as much Czech as possible now the better it is. Perhaps a mother's help type scenario.

Sorry for the incoherent ramblings, am on the phone so got half an ear cocked.

Thanks - to clarify, when I said I wanted to leave it as long as possible, I meant until 18 months or 2, and was wondering whether that was not ideal in terms of second language acquisition.

I'm not too worried about her English suffering, but I don't want her to have more trouble picking up Czech than she need have. She isn't getting very much Czech exposure - only in shops and at the doctor's, etc., and that's a tiny part of what she hears every day. I agree I need to find various ways of exposing her more to it.

and I need more exposure too, as a translator! (I had more when I lived here the first time round and I worked in a Czech office, had more Czech friends etc. Now, back here again with DH and the in-laws, I find myself in more of an English bubble.)

Hi Vesela,

I have a daughter who is just about to turn two years old and am/have been in the same situation as you. My husband and I are English and we live in Germany. At home we speak English exclusively, and our daughter at first only really heard German outside the home. We too were concerned to ensure that she did not go to Kindergarten/pre-school at age three unable to speak the local language and feel an outsider from the start.

Our initial approach was to ensure as much exposure to German as possible. Until she turned 20 months we did lots of mother & child courses and playgroups in German, and we also had lots of German-speaking friends over to "play". At 20 months she started going to a German-speaking nursery three days a week for six hours at a time.

We have found the above has worked well in terms of her language development so far. Her English dominates, but she is clearly starting to understand things said to her in German and often comes out with German words herself. The staff at the nursery are happy with her and say that, after an initial period when she would just look at them blankly, she is now doing just as well as the others.

I personally feel that starting nursery at 20 months was about right for her. Had she gone earlier, I think she would have been emotionally a bit too immature to deal not only with being away from mummy but also being faced with a carer who speaks a different language. Much later and I wonder if she might not then have been too competent in English and that it might not have shaken her confidence a bit to suddenly find herself unable to communicate again.

Good luck with your decision!

Ideally she needs to go as soon as possible.This is the least stressful way to do it.

I speak as a trilingual speech and language therapist and specialise in bilingual issues.

(You speak fluent Czech. Wow. Is the syntax demonic as have heards?)

Those are interesting considerations, boozle. Thanks a lot - that's very helpful.

Moondog - do you think starting later is significantly more stressful? From the language point of view, as soon as possible probably would be ideal, it's just that I'd like to be at home with her for as long as possible...

(Maybe I'm overanalysing this, but one thing that I've picked up from following some of the discussions here is that 'they'll pick it up whatever' isn't always the case, and that these things take a bit of working out).

Re. Czech - for an adult it takes a fair bit of rote learning, but not too demonic! I did some Russian since, and found that more difficult because I have a bad memory for where stress lies in a word (don't ask me why, I have it in English too!) and Czech, unlike Russian, is pretty consistent on that score.

Hi Vesela.
Interesting to read your comments about Czech.
I have lived in Russia and Turkey and have struggled with that syntax and morpholgy. Scary stuff!

You are obviously an incredible sensitive and thoughtful mother.Even if you delay the immersion a little,it won't matter too much in the long term as she will obviously have so much incidental exposure (even if you don't think that she does.)

When I talk about it being more stressful 'later' I am thinking of a year old baby versus and 8 year old child rather than a year old baby versus a two year old toddler iyswim.

I really wouldn't worry too much about the language. I know a mother always worries about EVERYTHING but honestly looking back, she will pick up Czech. Three will not be too late. But other things can have a huge influence on her social development.

I would make it dependent on how you think she can cope with the overall nursery situation and I would have a good look to see what nurseries are like, what the ethos/approach is there and if that is what you personally like.

When you think she is ready for/needs more intensive contact to other children, people outside the home and that she will benefit from being there in ways other than language-related issues, I would place her in a nursery. Otherwise I would leave her at home as long as possible frankly, as long as is convenient for you.

I wish with hindsight, I had not placed dd in a German kindergarten at 2. I think actually if I had another dc here, I would not do it until that dc were 5 (1 year before school starts).

vesela, dh and I are both Italians living in England and always speak Italian at home. Our dc started going to nursery twice a week from the age of 15 months. I'd say that Italian is still their dominant language (the are now 5 and 3), but their English is developing beautifully. What you can do, before she starts nursery is reading to her in Czech and perhaps showing her some videos? or find a babysitter who comes and play with her twice a week for a couple of hours?

I know lots of families in your configuration here in France - monolingual English (or another language) speakers who intend putting their children in the local French pre-school at 3.

Generally accepted wisdom is that the children need one year of two or three days at a French-speaking nursery before pre-school in order to pick up French.

Just read about Boozle's experience below, which echoes what people generally seem to go along with here in France in every way.

I'm in Italy and my DD started at nursery around 18 months. She is now 3 and understands italian very well, but still doesn't speak it that much, though this might be down to her general shyness.

I feel 18 months was a good age for her. She started at the state preschool today and it is chaotic and understaffed so her previous experience was useful in that it's unlikely she'll get a chance for much 1 on 1 time there (don't know if that would be the case in Prague)

That said I have known kids of various ages move here and become fluent in a matter of months, so on the whole would agree with SSandy and base your decision on other factors as well.

Thanks a lot for all the helpful comments. I hope preschool goes well for your DD, sputnik!

Hi there!

I think you are right to wait a little - I would say send her to a nursery when you feel she is redy to go to a nursery (regardless of the language issue).

My DD is being brought up tri-lingually (I am Czech, my husband Danish, we live in the UK and speak to each other in English).

DD is 2.5 and fluent in Czech (her strongest language) with Danish very close second. We never actively taught her English and she is only now about to start nursery. However: you would be surprised how much the little ones pick up - DD understands absolutely everything in English (to our great annoyance as we have run out of languages that we can use without her understanding )
While her spoken English isn't great (although she knows all the vital toddler sentences such as 'it is mine', 'I had it first' and it's my turn' ) , I have no worries that she will pick it up instantly - in fact I think it is important that her other two languages are ingrained properly before English takes over completely (not an issue for you I guess since both of you speak English as your first language).

Best of luck with the pre-school place - and hats off for your command of Czech (I never understood why anyone would want to learn it as a second language given that the grammar is so difficult

I would get a babysitter over for a couple of hours a day who just speaks to her in czech. Nurseries definitely don't suit all babies.

Moondog, can I ask a question? My children have 2 languages at home and a 3rd at school. At the moment they are little and prefer English (Mummy wins ), but are they bound to speak the school language to each other when they get older? Just looking for anecdotal evidence really.