Toddler distressed when newborn cries

[Millie2008]

Hi there,
Just after some (desperate) advice...
I have a just turned 2yo ds and a 3wk old ds. In general ds1 is adjusting ok- not overly interested in the baby but has started to stroke his hair and smile at him sometimes. The issue is that ds1 will have an absolute meltdown when the baby cries, even slightly. Which obviously happens a fair amount until I sort out whatever he needs (usually a feed). It’s kind of manageable at the moment as dp is off work, but I’m dreading him going back as I don’t know how I’ll manage it practically when it’s just me. When I say “meltdown”, I essentially mean cry/scream inconsolably and often throw himself to the floor and start hitting his head. Atm dp will manage ds1 whilst I feed, but if I was on my own I wouldn’t know how to manage bf baby at the same time as keeping ds1 safe from hurting himself.
I’ve tried explaining to ds1 that the baby cries when he’s hungry and that he can’t talk - and generally keep the tone lighthearted and tell him he’ll be happy once he’s fed etc. But in the moment that it happens nothing seems to help (other than dp removing him from the situation and distracting him).
I’d love to hear from those of you that have dealt/are dealing with similar situations.
Thanks in advance x

Headphones?

Hmm, interesting - thanks for the suggestion @Selfsettling3. Genuinely hadn’t thought of that. This might sound dumb, but how would you go about introducing them? Wouldn’t want him wearing them all the time obvs and I can’t predict when the baby will cry - and DS1 goes into meltdown mode at the first sign of a cry 🙈 I guess I could try and help him associate the 2 or something so he panics less about it...

Hmmmm tricky one. I think if it were me I would first try and establish why DS1 cries. Do you think it's the sound he doesn't like or the fact it ultimately means your attention will go onto baby and not him?

Good question @Rosebud1302 - I don’t actually think it’s to do with the attention thing - as if DP is holding the baby when he cries, ds1 will sometimes try and drag me to the baby as if to say “sort this out please, make it stop”- but the problem is once I do make it stop (by feeding usually) the meltdown is in full swing and he can’t be consoled (other than dp taking him into another room). So my conclusion is that it’s the loud noise itself he doesn’t like, plus perhaps the unpredictability of it. This would also fit with the fact he doesn’t like other loud noises (like hand driers, or other children screaming at groups and things) - which I can go some way to try and avoid

Yes that does make sense. I'm afraid I am no expert in the capabilities of children that age haha as mine is much younger. But would he be able to understand a link between "if you hear this noise, he gets a special toy". A toy that he only gets when baby cries to make it a more positive association? Obviously a toy that would involve no input from you that hopefully he can take away and play with. I am just thinking what I would do with a dog who is scared of noises (I'm a dog trainer) and I think it would be "when scary noise happens, distract/make something really nice appear"

I should add that he would need to get it before the tantrum and meltdown starts otherwise it could become a reward for tantrumming which he may learn pretty quickly. So you would need to be initially quick giving it to him until he understands the link. This may be a terrible idea btw haha!

I had this. Ds2 was a terrible crier, and Ds1 kept begging me to 'make him stop'.

I'm not sure there is much you can do actually. Maybe the older child just becomes more tolerant? Try spending more time with dc1, whilst dc2 is sleeping etc?

Can you play babies with him when the little one is asleep? Say you'll be the baby and he is the mummy. Lie down and pretend to cry but point to a milk bottle to prompt him to 'feed' you and then burp and smile and make a fuss of him for making the baby happy. Keep doing variants of this - can be feeding, pretending to change a nappy, putting it bed. Keep fun and light hearted, 'waa was waa baby is crying because I'm hungry, can you feed me some milk?' 'Waa waa baby is crying because I'm tired, put a blanket on me.'

Children learn best through play - show him that babies cry and it can be fixed - worked really well with mine

I had dc2 when dc1 was 24 months, and she was very verbal - she reacted similarly but because she could talk it was much easier. It was empathy. She became very attended to other babies "needing mummy" too, and if any baby cried wanted me to check on them.

From what you posted at midnight it sounds as if it's empathy with your ds too.

Wearing dc2 in a wrap sling so I always had him near and he virtually never cried sorted it out really (in the first few days home after my cesarean I wasn't always quick enough). It's counter intuitive to people who assume it's jealousy or egotistical (and of course toddlers are developmentally egotistical) but for my dc1 the baby was ours/ hers and she had a very strong identification with him and wanted everything to be okay for him.

Thank you so much for all these suggestions - def going to try them (off to discuss with DP now whilst ds1 naps!). @thelongdarkteatimeofthesoul - I imagine it made it so much easier being able to actually discuss it with your DD1 - mine is still pretty non-verbal (but pretty good understanding I think) - can’t wait until he can talk to get more of an insight into what he’s thinking!

And yes, agree that sling is the way forward. Just beginning to feel fit enough after a bit of a complicated birth

I wonder would a travel cot type of playpen help keep your toddler safe from injury if you could pop him in there while you deal with the baby. Maybe leave a special toy in there for him.

On the keeping him safe - I totally childproofed the living room and if at home only fed in there. I think at the moment OP's DS is feeling distress with the baby and separating him from his mother with barriers while she feeds will quickly change this into wanting the baby to go away (empathy is good, turning it into rejection and jealousy not so positive).

I wouldn't train him to associate the baby crying with a positive reward for the toddler as someone else suggests for similar reasons!

The toddler pulls his mum to the baby when the baby cries, so his understanding of the baby's need is good and as long as there's a parent present they shouldn't need separation.

The playpen or a travel cot to put the baby in (travel cot not Moses or carry cot so toddler can't "help" by trying to get the baby out when the parent is on the toilet/ answering the door) is useful when the parent can't be within arm's length for two minutes though!

Sorry, I’ve probably not been clear on the keeping DS1 safe thing - it’s the throwing himself on the floor and hitting his head on the floor that worries me and makes me feel like it’ll be hard to feed the baby when it’s just me - as at the moment DP can stop DS1 from hurting himself by hitting his head.

@thelongdarkteatimeofthesoul - out of interest, did your DD1 react similarly to other babies/children showing distress before your DC2 came along? And also, did she show any dislike of other loud noises?

Can your home visitor do a two year health check on DS next time she sees baby- she might have some strategies?

Also my age gaps are 2/12 years and 2 years. Only my first DD cried a lot as a baby the other two didn’t,, but my toddlers weren’t particulary bothered by newborn crying, but then because the babies didn’t cry much maybe that’s why? How much is your baby crying?

DD2 doesn’t like loud noises though, even now at 11, and I’d have to use the ear defenders for concerts, fireworks, she was very difficult in crowds too. She touches everything too, not as much now though, so I think she is more in tune with her senses than her siblings.

How about a baby of his own - ie a doll. When the (real) baby needs a feed or whatever say "I think your baby needs feeding too. Shall we feed them together?"

Millie2008 dd1 wasn't especially interested in babies generally before dc2 was born, but was very interested in dc2 during the last trimester of pregnancy and we read lots of becoming a big sibling books. We had a private scan after the NHS 20 week one just because DH had a private insurance "freebie" that covered it from work and had had to miss the NHS scan, and took DD along as having just had the NHS scan we were as sure as we could be there wouldn't be bad news - the sonnogropher told DD that mummy had a little boy in her tummy and she was really upset and saying "no tisnt! No tisnt!" (No it isn't) and we thought she wanted a sister for a few seconds until she managed to say "is a baby! Is a baby no boy!" For her a boy or a girl would have been a toddler like her, and she was put out by that idea but not by a baby This also explained why she wasn't remotely jealous until he started walking, when she did push him over a few times, which obviously was not acceptable but she got over his transformation from baby to boy quite quickly.

Her being verbal was really useful. She wasn't especially bothered by loud noises (I recognise the behaviour you describe as dc2 was like that when he was a toddler) and was already used to sharing me as I looked after other toddlers until not long before dc2 was born. Absolutely it was an esiest of all possible scenarios in a way, though we did also move house and a considerable distance just before dc2 was born and that wasn't easy.

My dc2 hated loud noises and used to cover his ears as a toddler, but he was a bit older when dc3 came along so not really comparable. He was a very serious little person but also good with dc3. I was lucky that once I started carrying them in wrap slings none of mine cried much at all, and obviously being able to breastfeed in the sling later, once you've recovered from the birth and are out and about, makes this even more the case, though obviously all babies are different etc etc etc.

Ironically ds2 isn’t a big crier (yet!), ds1 however was quite a high needs/highly sensitive baby. But ds2 will make a small cry sound to indicate he’s hungry - and that will be enough to cause ds2 distress

I had the same issue, although my DS1 was 4 when DS2 was born but he has always been noise sensitive and a worrier when others are upset. Hubbie had some noise cancelling headphones and they worked a treat, although in an ideal world I think it’s better to come up with a strategy to help them cope with the noise rather than block it out - but get it that’s not always an option with a newborn!