Help! Need advice from veteran parents of two or more!

[GeorginaA]

I have a 3 year old and a 4 month old. Ds2 has recently started being a bit more mobile - he can slowly creep around in a circle by an elaborate combination of flinging his legs over and arching his back, so it's got me thinking a bit more about baby proofing.

Up until now, I've been fairly blase (probably too much) about leaving ds2 for short periods of time to sort washing out, etc, but now he can actually move from where I put him last, I know I can't do that anymore. Also, ds1 has started to (very considerately) pass ds2 toys to amuse him - problem is they're not always completely baby friendly.

I've put out the playpen, but it's completely dwarfed our front room and looks horrible. I'm also aware that ds1 used to HATE it as a baby, so I know this is only emergency use - for when I need the loo or have to answer the door. It's not really a solution for keeping small parts of toys away from ds2.

I need to sort through the boxes of toys downstairs and remove all the things with really small pieces, putting them in ds1's room - but his room is really quite small, and I feel like I'm sending him to exile a bit just so he can play with his favourites! I've thought really hard, but I just can't come up with an acceptable compromise.

Small toys out just at naptimes isn't really feasible as first nap is while ds1 is at nursery anyway, and lunchtime nap is usually taken up with ... well ... lunch and associated "can't do while baby is awake" chores.

It surely can't be as hard as I'm making it in my head, can it?! Thousands of parents have dealt with this scenario successfully, so I'm throwing this open to the wisdom of mumsnet as I'm sure I'm missing a really obvious solution.

So:

a) what makes a toy unsuitable for a baby - is there a particular size where if a detachable piece is smaller it's dangerous?
b) any ideas/advice about keeping ds2 away from unsuitable toys, ways of keeping ds1 from feeling like he's being banished?
c) I've kept them both fairly happy at the moment with giving 15 mins of playtime attention to ds1 while ds2 watches, then 15 mins of playtime attention to ds2 while ds1 watches/participates. This works quite well at the moment, but realise that the dynamic is going to change completely when ds2 can crawl (please god let it be a few more months yet!). How do you ensure your eldest child gets enough attention while the youngest doesn't really understand about disrupting the other's play/joining in properly?

Love,
Mumsnetter making Mountains out of Molehills for a living...

dd was 3.5 when ds was born so not too different in age to yours. I too wondered how to ensure dd's toys (had started playing with little polly pockets etc) wouldn't end up with ds's. I used different coloured boxes for each child ensuring that dd put hers away in her "pretty" boxes then all the chunky stuff went into the other boxes. DD never really got into lego but was happy to play with duplo (actually ds still has a huge amount of duplo whch he still plays with (he's nearly 8!). ELC sell a device which you can place toys (or bits of toys) into. basically if they fit in then they represent a choking hazard to young children. Also i think it is important for the older child to have 1:1 time and if necessary just use your ds2's nap time for this. Of course ds1 could also occupy ds2 for a "special" reward of say a trip to the playground

Hi Georgina. Phew! I'd forgotten all these problems that come with young babies and toddlers - time passes and you are so concentrated on the present dilemmas you tend to forget the past ones! I think it was easier when my first two were young (18mths between them) because we were allowed to use a baby-walker. Im not sure if they are still on the market, because they were classed as dangerous. However, we never had any problems with ours and it was fabulous because dd2 would roll around happily for ages with toys on the tray, whilst dd1 could play with her toys on the floor relatively undisturbed. And I used the high chair a lot too. The baby would have her toys up on the chair whilst dd1 was free to play with her toys. And there was the bouncing chair thing that we hung from the door that was fairly frequently used too. I think what Im trying to say is that we put the baby out of the reach of the older one's toys so that they could both be amused, but safely. As to when your ds2 becomes older though, it does become more difficult. You really need to have eyes in the back of your head! However, would ds1 understand if you explained why he shouldnt give babies his toys or is he still a bit young? And is there any way you could put the toys with small bits away completely for a while and stock up on larger toys? I know farm animals and bricks now come in large sizes. Maybe you could give the smaller toys to your parents or someone else so that when ds2 goes there he could play with them then? As to the size of toys, I would say that it is small enough to get into the babies mouth, it is dangerous. This applies to an enormous amount of toys, unfortunately! I know that this probably wont help a huge amount, but Im sure, like all of us, youll find some way round this that works for you all.

I'm trying to get DP to undo our Baby Dan playpen to make a fence across our living room...

Anything that is either too small to be near DD, or too breakable has to be played with up at the table or on a bed. DD will eat anything that isn't nailed to the floor, and DSs are terrible at tidying up! Its easier for me though as I have DS1 and DS2, so they go off and play on my bed or on their bunk beds quite happily. It also helps that I have a tiny flat, so our dining table is in the front room and making them play on it isn't 'banishing' them! It's taken a few chewed up pokemon cards for them to get it though. I also hoover constantly. We have a bagless hoover, and I figure anything I can't suck up, DD can't eat - I just shift out all the lego etc afterwards

I might have a solution.

Ds1 has taken a shine to the playpen, so much so that he moved in today with a load of stuffed toys and his dinosaurs. Even had his afternoon snack in there.

Maybe I should just lock ds1 in and let ds2 have the roam of the house...

are you sure ds2 will hate the playpen? My ds2 loved it. Agree it dwarfs the living room but it was the only way I had of keeping him safe for a few minutes.

IN the kitchen I had one of those static rocker things. They are ridiculously big as well but kept him safe when i was in there.

Will be using them again for number 3. We couldn't use stairgates as ds1 would headbutt them at the time (now he;s ok with them on doors but they're not allowed on the stairs) so I needed to keep ds2 fairly constrained.

We do the table thing too ie tiny Lego, playmobil etc on table, baby on the floor. OK aslogn as he's just crawling...now he can climb up on to the chairs and dance on the table! so we're stuffed really. But he is 17 months now so I actually think we are more or less OK.

I mean that the under-3 thing is arbitrary. A 5yo could choke on a marble, of course, but you just hope he wdn't put it in his mouth.

And some 2yo or even younger, when watched with half an eye, will be fairly sensible. DS2 loves playign with the marbel run and will do so carefully for ages. (would not leave him alone with it before anyoen thinks I am a sloppy mummy).

I think things like eg the Bob models (friction Muck etc) which are labelled not for under 3s are fine.

Really I've found that theer are only a few things we needed to keep DS2 away from - very tiny Lego and the littlest bits of Playmobil, and we do those as a treat when DS2 is asleep (tho I see why this wouldn't work for you Georgina) or eg when I have DS1 on his own (after school some days or if Daddy takes the others out).

We have a big tray for little bits of lego etc which kept them all from going on the floor. We used the table but also reserved the 'little bitty' toys for times when the little one was asleep. I know what you mean about catching up when the bay is asleep but I actually found it easier to give DS some 1-1 then and then do some jobs later with the baby in the bouncy chair/ playpen/ sling watching/ helping while ds watched a vid/ tv. It helped during the morning to stave off friction to say 'we can do that together when when dd goes to sleep....'

I also found my DS was surprisingly sensible about what dd could and couldn't have and actually relished being allowed to say she wasn't allowed to have something!

To be honest it's been a constant process of adapting over the last 2 years since dd arrived - the dynamic between them is constantly changing. But it is fun....