4-year-old, wee accidents, and starting school - what's normal?

[popehilarious]

Sorry for essay but would really appreciate help as I have no idea what's 'normal' any more!
DS1 is 4, we started potty training at 2.10 and it was slow going but seemed to get there with the odd wee accident (he's fine with poo) although these were always quite frequent (e.g. 3-4 a week).

We prompt him to go to the loo throughout the day and he always resists or puts it off. He's in the habit now of going to the loo before we go out and before watching tv (still usually after several times of asking though). However he rarely needs a wee all day until mid-afternoon - I think he holds it - and then he is at risk of having an accident after not needing to go all day. He therefore gets a bit blasee.

We've recently had phases of being fairly fine, going to the loo when asked without too much arguing but have again lapsed into 1-2 accidents a day. At pre-school, at home, while watching tv. I'm at my wits' end to be honest and beginning to get worried about starting school in September.

He's bright and articulate and generally a 'good' boy but doesn't seem to absorb the fact that he needs to go to the loo when prompted/reminded (let alone of his own accord) otherwise he will keep having accidents. I'm trying to increase his fluid intake so he gets used to actually weeing all day as I feel he gets complacent with not needing to go all morning. He's also very set into what he wants to do/what he's playing with and really dislikes breaking from this to go to the loo; but he's had nearly 1.5 years to get used to this!

Any advice? any knowledge about how reception class at school would deal with accidents? In terms of our approach we've been round all the houses and then some - from carrot, stick, being understanding and hugging every time he has an accident (he can get a bit upset or avoidant) to getting quite narked (usually when he's denied repeatedly he needs to go and then wetting himself 1 minute later). We've discussed it until we're all sick of it and he does seem to really believe he'll do differently last time but doesn't understand he needs to change his behaviour. (We've also had periods of being 'laidback' about it too ).

At night he still wears nappy pants and seems to wet them as soon as he puts them on tbh despite several trips to the loo before bed. I've given up worrying about nighttimes.

forgot to say sometimes the 'normal' accidents are often just small dribbles in his pants so he does realise then goes to the loo - I don't really mind about this but it perhaps indicates that he doesn't realise he needs to go until he's actually going and feels wet.
The recent accidents have been massive.

thanks, is it mainly about poo though? (Feeling quite glad that's not an issue at least!)

In terms of dealing with accidents in reception, I think it's probably a bit school dependant. My 5 year old is in reception, and in the first term there were definitely kids that came out with the teacher saying to parents they'd had an accident. I always send spare pants and tights in my daughter's bag just incase. I know there are spare trousers etc in the school and it's not a big deal.

In terms of accidents generally, I've got girls so they're maybe different. Eldest went through a phase of seeing in her pants a while after being toilet trained, and my youngest has probably had one accident 🤷🏼‍♀️

Reception is still a while away, and it's just maybe something you've got to work on. Go back to basics and physically park him on the loo at regular intervals? At 4 he can understand reward so find something (a toy etc) that will really motivate him?

My November born grandson had the occasional accident during the last year in nursery but once he started school he was fine. In a child's life it's a long time between now and September. Try not to worry.

I feel a bit like we've been going round in circles and just need a bit of direction. Reading some of the ERIC stuff online there's a danger of them emptying their bladder too often so it doesn't 'stretch' and get used to being full. But also a danger of holding it too well!

ERIC does have a helpline but it's limited times and nearly 10p a minute and I have a baby as well so never get a chance to wait on the phone.

thanks Jen that's useful! I'll give it a read. God just thinking about getting him to do every stage of that - it would take all day with relentless arguing and cajoling. We already have presented the argument of 'it's taken loads of time due to having an accident rather than 2 minutes of sitting on the loo' I don't think he has much concept of time yet!

just thought I'd update. Things have improved greatly, although we didn't really do much except make a point of increasing his water intake (still doesn't drink much I don't think but I say he can have juice after a drink of water and ask him to finish his drink before watching tv etc). He's much better at taking himself off to the loo when he actually needs to and argues a lot less about 'having a try' before we go out. The odd tiny accident but not too often. Perhaps his bladder's been 'trained' to hold a bit more..?!