I think my daughter is tone deaf and it is very painful!

[BleedingEars]

Have chnaged name for this as I hate being negatives about my dc's.

My dd1 12 cannot hold a tune and sings with a low moaning wail which I find very difficult to listen to. Dd 2 9 can sing very well, loudly and confidently.

The problem is Singstar!

They both love it and will spend hours on it. DD1 is I believe totally unaware of the sound she makes when she sings (even though she always gets a singstar rating of tonedeaf) Dd2 always gets the top score and superstar rating.

Now to the problem, dd2 started making fun of dd1's voice at first which I stopped her from doing as it really really upset dd1.

Dd1 wants to invite her friends over to play on singstar at the weekend, they are a new group of friends as she has just started secondary school and am pretty certain comments will be made and I don't want her made fun of.

What would you do? She is not a confident child and goes to pieces quite easily, generally has pretty low self esteem due to other problems in the past which I can't discuss.

Do I point out how she sounds? I don't want to upset her. If I manage to postpone this weekend there will be events where she is at her friends houses singing as they all love karaoke.

I'm not exagerating at how awful her singing voice is either, the question is how do I manage this with the minimum of hurt feelings?

Why not let her choose an musical instrument to learn, that way she will learn the notes and how to read music which will help her improve loads. I played the trombone and the keyboards when I was very young and I really think it helped me find my voice and I have been singing for 11 years and have had singing lessons which improved my range even further. I definately believe playing an instrument and learning to read music was vital to where I am now? Just an idea good luck x

We tried that and she really didn't get on with it. She has tried keyboard and violin both for a year. Progress was very slow and she got really frustrated.

Found out about the school Choir last night and suggested she join, but she is refusing as she doesn't want to sing in public.

Ah bless her! Singing lessons may get her just as frustrated then? How about letting her record her voice and playing it back to her and letting her decide if she like what she hears?
Singing in public is hard if you have no confidence in your voice but sometimes its a good experience to be thrown into the deep end and maybe a teacher or a friend who hears her voice during choir practise could help with her tuning?
She may find that singing is not for her and she could concentrate on something else she is really good at?
My sister has always been into drama and dance but has ended up singing with me in my band, her voice was not pitch perfect but she really improved loads from the experience and after a few lessons there was a great improvement.
Where do you live btw?

Booge, your experience sounds like mine. I've been cucked out of school choirs for messing when I thought I was doing fine. I hated Music lessons at school cos they'd go round the class individually getting us to sing something. Three separate music teachers all gave up on me. I've realised my voice is awful, I even went to a music teacher who said anyone can be taught to sing and she lost her rag at me because she didn't think I was trying. That was the worst moment of my life as far as singing is concerned. but at least I know, and although I love singing, I know never to do it in public.

So, my advice, be honest with your daughter (Singstar has already told her0.
Lots of general "coping with name-calling" advice.
Don't waste money on "I can teach ANYBODY TO SING" teachers cos they CAN'T!

CHUCKED not CUCKED!!!!!!

Probably not going to be popular here ,but I think you should make light of it.It's a nice trait to beable to laugh at yourself and realise that sometimes we're crap at things and that doesn't mean we are crap.I think by getting singing lessons you're putting way too much emphasis on the singing as part of her.Why focus on something that is probably jsut a short phase.My dd was into singstar at this age ,didn't last long.

Her friends will probably respect her more and think she's great fun if she laughs at herself instead of taking it to heart.If any of them are good singers get her to ask them to teach her.They'll love helping her .

She obviously has other talents that you can foster to boost her self esteem.

I suffered from being virtually tone deaf and was told by me dad on quite a few occasions - while it didn't "destroy" me neither did it assist my singing.

Despite that I managed to get through my classical piano exams where I had to sing so many notes up from the one that was played etc. (I suspect that I got a big 0 for that part although interestingly neither my teacher nor the examiner ever commented ).

I agree with your daughter - a school choir is not a good idea if she's not up with the rest of them.

What really did help me was going out with a boyfriend who was a very keen singer and really into music - lots and lots and lots of singing along to easy-listening/singing music in an encouraging, non-pressure situation got to me a point where I could at least sing along to the easier songs - unfortunately the end of that relationship gradually saw my new found singability disappear so - lots of music and singing at home is my recommendation (provided of course you can sing in tune) - I feel very sorry for my poor children as I warble out lullabies which I can hear are painfully out of tune but can't seem to fix!

Thanks again. Lots to think about. I suspect she has worked it out for herself to be honest. Like the idea of getting her to make light of it and concentrating on her many other talents.

We always have sung lots as a family and had music around us, I used to sing in a band and can hold a tune, though not the worlds best!

I think it will be a phase, she has now found something else to do this weekend so suspect she didn't want to sing solo with the others, she does prefer singing when we are.

Hi BE. I do sympathise. Dp, when we met 10 years ago, sounded awful when I first heard him sing. My family's pretty musical, and he wanted to be part of that, and through singing lots around the house, having a handful of lessons, and really listening to music (and his own voice), has improved a lot. He's a mediocre singer now. Still struggles to join a song in the correct key, but is sooo improved.

One thought I have, though I realise you're a long way away but it's still potentially do-able ... I've done a lot of singing the past, but after ds was born nearly three years ago, did nothing, and lost my confidence. A nearby (adult) education centre held a weekend workshop last year, called "Can't Sing, Will Sing", run by a fantastically encouraging woman called Helen Brind. The workshop was aimed at people who had either lost confidence in their singing, or believed they couldn't sing at all. On the Friday, there was a lot of ropey singing. Come the Sunday, almost everyone in the group had been brave enough to sing a solo, and no one could actually have been called tone deaf. It was wonderful!

The course was re-run in January, and I think is scheduled again for September - again, with Helen at the helm. It's a long way and would cost, but if the inevitable happens - either your dd realises she isn't as great a singer as she thought, or you tell her so - this course could be a helpful next step? Check out Urchfont Manor in Wiltshire, or, if it's too far/costly/they don't take children, look for similar near you or ask a local singing teacher to organise something like this for kids? HTH.