Nature / nurture - are boys and girls that different?

[snipskit]

Today, my DD (2) completely independently changed the toilet roll when it ran out. This is something my 3 DSs (9,7,5) have NEVER done and I'm not sure my DH (37) has either. What does this say about gender stereotyping??! Quite hilarious really - does anyone else have similar exampes of the differences between boys and girls from v young age?

I dislike the way a boy choosing purple as a favourite colour is seen as him expressing himself but a girl liking pink? Well, that's clearly just society's pressure. If the world were gender neutral then she would clearly like a different colour. Girls CAN just like pink and princesses and tea parties just because.

To the PP who mentioned the himp study:
Another study of rhesus monkeys also found that when given a choice between "girl toys" (a doll and a cooking pot), "boy toys" (a car and a ball IIRC) and "gender neutral toys" (a book and a soft toy) then the girl monkeys showed much more preference for the girl toys and thw boy monkeys played more with the boy toys.

I think there are genuine and significant differences between boys and girls due to hormones if nothing else and the fact that women carry the children inside of them for 9mths - that has to mean something! What exactly those differences are, though it's hard to tell.

The issue with a girl choosing pink is that in our UK society she is very very unlikely to be doing so out of a genuinely free choice.

It's important to not devalue choices that are usually ascribed to girls. Pink is fine, it's just a colour like all others. It's not a bad thing to like pink. Equally being caring, kind and polite (or whichever other characteristics are typically ascribed to girls) are great attributes for a child - of either gender.

What is a bad thing is any child being made to feel uncomfortable. embarrassed or even ashamed about their choices if they don't match the current gender stereotypes.

Yes, NannyNim, Cordelia Fine mentions that study. The 'gendered choice' of a frying pan is something she points out as very, very weird. As one of the researchers says, they've never yet seen a chimp that could cook.

Monkey, sorry. Same point though.

NannyNim, that study on monkeys playing with toys is completely and utterly discredited in the Gender Delusion by Cordelia Fine.

Sorry Lancelottie, cross post! I was distracted by a child!

If your DSs only see the house slave changing the loo roll and never see their DF change it then they are not likely to do it either.

YOur DD must identify more with the house slave so copies her.

Crispy, I really enjoyed that book -- though I don't think DH enjoyed having constantly snorting with laughter and inflicting bits of it on him.

'having me constantly snorting', etc, etc, I mean.

Of course it's nature thing. Look at the cavemen times - women stayed in caves to care for the offspring and the sick, and men went out to bring food. Of course it's only natural for women to be more caring, and men to be more adventurous.
In fact, in historical and modern hunter-gatherer societies women provide the vast majority of the food. Even among the Inuit, who are almost exclusively meat eaters, women traditionally fish, trap and hunt. It can be reasonably assumed that prehistorical hunter-gatherer cultures did the same.

Incidentally, anybody who says that girls/women are inherently organized and tidy needs to spend 5 minutes the afternoon with my daughter. It would disabuse you of the notion entirely.

I think men and women are probably naturally, typically, a bit different in some ways, but I doubt it is the cliched ways always noted, the ones that just happen to fit in with and reinforce our - both historically and currently - patriarchal society.

I really hate the gender stereotyping from birth. I'm 11 weeks pregnant with my second and have decided that when it's born I don't want to know straight away if it's a boy or a girl. I just want a few moments with my baby before it is defined by its gender for the rest of its life.

In my experience boys like anything with wheels, whether that's a toy car, ride on, train or pink dolly buggy. DS1 adored his pink buggy and pushed it around everywhere - with his collection of cars in it.

Much like other posters have said, boys are like puppies - plenty walks, a game with a ball, a pat on the head and regular meals seem to make my DCs happy. But theylove doing the hoovering and playing with my bag of old beads and costume jewellery.

Why do you not then assume that boys generally like hoovering and playing with jewellery? Why do you not assume that all children like regular meals and exercise to make them happy? (I've yet to meet a child that isn't 'like a puppy' in this respect).

I think they get messages from outside the home. My twin boys loved Frozen when we had a month on holiday. By the time they got back to school and all the girls were singing the songs, the decided it was not a boy film and therefore couldnt like it.