Losing it

[TheMangoTree]

I feel like I can't do this any more. Nether my three year old or 9 month old would eat their tea and I've just thrown both plates across the kitchen floor. I know I'm tired, utterly sleep deprived in fact, but my head is in a spin and I don't know how to stay calm. My three year old has been screaming at me A LOT this week and so I'm bad tempered and fed up and my husband is just judgey when I get cross. I now know the baby will be up in the night hungry as he hasn't eaten, and I just feel like I can't face it any more. I need perspective. IS this dark place I'm in at all normal, or do I need to get help?

Hugs and from me Mango.

How long have you felt like this? If it's been a while, definitely go and see your GP. I did a few months ago when DS was about 9 months and they were quick with some CBT help (although this was for anxiety so a bit different). At the very least you need time to recharge/relax.

Do either of your children attend nursery/preschool? Do you have any family nearby to help?

Hi. I remember feeling the same when my dd was that age. I still feel it even now and she's 2.5; just this afternoon she refused to eat her tea after having had only a very light lunch and I ended up chucking it in the bin whilst ranting about feeding the bin more than I do her blah blah blah. She too wakes in the night hungry if she's not had enough during the day so I know that sense of dread that you get, knowing full well that you're going to have a crap night's sleep when you're already knackered and feel like you could sleep the sleep of the dead. In the end I gave her some porridge and extra bread for supper in the hope that it'll fill her up - is that something you could do?
My ds is 3, nearly 4, and is a super stropper when the mood takes him. Several times this week I've shouted at him - the other morning he refused point blank to put his coat and shoes on for nursery so I picked him up and carried him out to the gate saying that if he chooses not to get ready then he does as he is. He cried, I felt terrible, but he put his shoes and coat on.
I remember one day a few weeks ago when both dc were playing up and had been screaming and crying and arguing all day. I lost it and shouted, swore and threw a toy across the room. I'm not in any way saying that that's an OK thing to do (of course it isn't; they were scared, I felt dreadful and I apologised to them straight away) but I am saying that we have all done something that we're not proud of and have lost our tempers with our children.
The important thing to do in those situations is to try and recognise how we're feeling, recognise the escalation and take a step back to calm down. I agree with the pp in that, if you feel like you're struggling, get help: there are parenting classes available through SureStart and perhaps your local authority; and your health visitor or GP could refer you to CBT or interpersonal therapy (I had that after dd was born because I struggled with depression and found it hard to bond with her. It was really useful and helped me to lose the guilt and accept that life, and my relationships, had changed but that it wasn't actually her fault).
If your husband gets judgey, ask him what he would do differently? I'm guessing (correct me if I'm wrong) that you're the main carer and that he works. Does he spend a lot of time with the dc, on his own, after having had a crappy night's sleep? Does he do his share of the night wakings and early mornings? If not then he's in no place to judge; instead he needs to step and support you more, both emotionally and practically.
Hope that tonight goes better than expected OP . At the weekend, would it be possible for you to get out by yourself or for your husband to take the dc out and let you get some rest? I find that a few hours to myself every week really helps me cope better with the relentlessness of life with 2 small children.

Thank both for you kind non-judgemental words. I've wondered about parenting classes before. Maybe I'll go for it. Don't want to admit I need to be taught how to be a mummy, but don't want scarred children because I did the wrong thing by them. Also yesterday I carried DS1 into the hallway to sit on the step and slammed the kitchen door to separate myself from him. I hate myself for getting in such a tizz and immediately promised myself I'd not do it again, but when I'm tired and emotional I'm not reasonable.

I also wonder about going to to the GP. My first question to them would be how do you know the difference between an actual problem and just sleep deprivation? Yes I feel very, very down, but not all the time, and if I had a week of good nights, (and well behaved children who gobbled up their tea and said thank you) I might be skipping through the streets. DS1 was an absolute angel this morning, chatted away to the lady in the post office and she said, 'gosh what a lovely young man he is'. I beamed and it felt lovely. Just goes to show what impressions you can give. That lady probably could never have imagined the scene of rage and carnage in our kitchen just last night.

As for judgey husband, to answer your questions, yes he is helpful. He does help with night wakings (I BF and if baby sees me in the night he goes mental if I'm not lifting up my top, whereas he lets husband soothe him). And yes he does help with early mornings. So does that mean he is in a place to judge after all? I am the main carer, on mat leave, so DH has more patience because he isn't subjected to 12 hour shifts of the relentless childcare. He's also just a lot more patient by nature. So no, I can't fault practical support but as for emotional support, he's pretty hopeless. Typically sees everything black and white and jumps into solution mode: 'here's your problem, here's your solution, get on with it'. Doesn't get that sometimes humans (mums) just need reassurance, comfort, telling that everything is ok etc.

So thanks again for your advice and insight into your own experiences. I'll think on my options.

I've got to go to John Lewis this weekend, so I might ask to go on my own and go very, very, very slowly.

Mango I could have written so much of your posts including wondering how much of my low mood and anger is just sleep deprivation. I am having CBT to help me manage both of these this because as I see it sleep deprivation is going to be part of my life for years so I wanted to find ways to cope despite it.

Even if your DH helps he doesn't have the monotony and relentless mental strain of doing it every day so no, he shouldn't be judged. It sounds like he tries to help but doesn't know how to support you emotionally at the moment so maybe you could try to explain how you feel when he jus offers solutions and ask him to simply listen and reassure?

I found it helpful to read a few parenting books to give me tools to use, there are also plenty of kind people on parenting threads here who would read and help I'm sure.

Be kind to yourself. It's bloody hard with two young kids

I think getting some time to yourself is just so important - a lot of mothers get bogged down feeling a bit guilty about it, but if it benefits the mother then it benefits the whole family. When mine were little I worked out I valued time alone more than I valued extra sleep - or at least that the time alone acted as well as extra sleep in terms of keeping me sane. So yes, a very slow meandering stroll around John Lewis with some coffee and a nice sit down is what you need.

And at home, when you start to feel The Rage, do the "imagining there's a documentary film crew in the room" trick. That non-existent camera watching me did wonders for keeping me calm and reasonable :o.

I don't want to stop you seeing your GP if you need to, so do listen to other advice, but what you've described sounds perfectly normal to me... if you don't mind me saying.

We all totally lose it occasionally and your youngest is still a littlie - so you're in a HARD, sleep-deprived place. I think I'm a good mum, really, but I have certainly shouted uncontrollably sometimes during my four year mothering career - and behaved like a tantrumming toddler! We are all just human, and these little people can drive us crazy sometimes. I would think you just need to weather these difficult months, getting as much rest, time out, as you can - and soon the clouds will break - and the sun will shine through a bit more. And it will all get much easier - excuse the cliche. But you will still, occasionally - or even some weeks often - be driven a bit mad. Partly it's modern parenting, where the children take centre stage and we feel we need to be stimulating, perfect parents morning, noon and night.

I think you sound like me and every other mum friend I have - and I don't think they need to see their GP. THey're just honest. Of course if it carries on, see someone. Good luck!! I think it sounds like you're doing a great job - with small, perfectly understandable, human blips!! I've heard much of worse losing the plot episodes...and don't judge those mums either! Good luck xxx

Just wanted to chip in. Your lines:

Typically sees everything black and white and jumps into solution mode: 'here's your problem, here's your solution, get on with it'. Doesn't get that sometimes humans (mums) just need reassurance, comfort, telling that everything is ok etc.

Really chimed with me! I am having one of those days - I have a 4 month old and 3 and a half year old. I am currently on maternity leave so have the relentless, unforgiving and thankless task (or my husband would argue, joyful, fun-filled privilege) of being the main carer and just trying to get through the day with a baby and small child who have very different needs and routines. Why does the three year old always need a poo and his bum wiping the moment I sit down to feed screaming hungry baby?? I am sleep deprived and grumpy and trying my best. All I want is sympathy and to be told I'm doing a good job but DH just talks to me like I'm an idiot and sees everything in black and white. He explains things to me as though I've never thought of them before and just thinks I'm being unreasonable when I try to explain why it isn't that simple. Men!!

So glad it's not just me. But at the same time I feel for you. We're not alone - this parenting thing is bloody hard!

God I am actually crying reading this, I'm such a mess at the moment! 2.5 dd and 11 month old ds, I'm at the end of my tether, they are both always shouting at me or crying! Ds cries whenever I leave the room and dd joins in for fun! Luckily ds sleeps well, but dd stays up late and wakes early, at about 5am every morning, I have zero me time! Hubby works full time and then is out 3 nights a week working as a dj . I feel like I'm losing the plot and feel so guilty for it! It's nice to know im not alone!

Thank you for starting this thread mango. There's been some lovely advice - sorry that I don't have any more to offer, but I just wanted you to know you are definitely not alone. My DS and DD are the same age as yours. Yesterday after a disastrous playdate with DS and 2 hours awake in the night with DD, I lay in bed having a near panic attack just thinking "I cannot do this any more" and fantasising about getting in the car and driving as far away as I could. It feels better this morning but believe me I understand how dark it can feel. I also have a DH who just says I worry too much, which means I feel totally alone with it. It's bloody hard work. for you.

cuckoo that sounds bad. Is there anyway your dh can knock the djing on its head for a while? Or can you put one or both dc into nursery for a few hours a week, just to give you a break?
When my son went through a phase of not wanting to go to sleep, around the time he turned 3, we used to just leave him in his room with his nightlight on and he could read his magazines until he felt tired enough to sleep. After a few weeks of that he started going to bed and settling down straight away again. When he wakes in the morning, even now, he does the same thing - he's allowed to read or play quietly but is not allowed to come out of his room (unless he needs the loo) until 'the clock tells us it's time to get up'. Would this work in your case? My ds is nearly 4 though so a fair bit older than your dd.
I hate it when people say this to me because it doesn't help now, but I'll say it anyway: this is just a phase that, in the grand scheme of things, won't last very long. Soon enough, both your dc will be potty trained, will sleep through, will be happy and confident enough for you to be able to leave them happily. Getting there is a struggle but you will reach that point. Keep that in mind.

How powerful it is to hear from other women and to learn that you are not alone and (probably) not crazy.

Another anecdote from Thursday (wow, that was a bad day): in a moment of fabulous parenting hypocrisy I screamed at ds 'I thought i told you to STOP shouting'. At which my husband yelled 'how dare you!' and literally carried me by my elbows into another room. I was so humiliated at him using physical strength to overpower me in front of the boys I'm afraid I did get in the car and drive away. Only for a short time. It wasn't even 730am. Bad start to a terrible day.

Right now though, I am in john Lewis, alone, and though I don't know what to do with my hands and all I've bought is things for the boys, it does feel like time off was exactly what I needed. Though now in reading your comments and also trying not to cry!

Thanks everyone so much for taking the time to share and offer their wisdom, and my thoughts are with others going through tough times.

I only have one DS who is 21 months but I have been in your shoes and have finally come out of the otherside. I went to see my GP and was diagnosed with S.A.D (seasonal affective disorder) and have now been receiving light therapy. My family have all helped out aswell especially my DH giving me time away from DS which I didn't believe I need but helped massively and now the spring is coming I feel like ive come out the otherside.

I'm so pleased you went to JL and had some time away to recharge abit. Do think about going to the GP if you need to.

OP I have nothing useful to post other than you are not alone and I think this is perfectly normal, I think we worry it's not because people don't tend to be honest about this in RL. Mine are nearly 4 & 1 and some days I feel like I get nothing right, everyone's crying and screaming, no one is eating or sleeping. I gave up a hard-earned career job and on days like these I panic and think 'oh my god what have I done this is my life now and I hate it and they hate it and it's all going wrong!...' I guess because so many of us feel the same it must mean it's normal & it must pass!

I'm glad you had the time to potter Mango, and feel more normal.

I often feel guilty telling my son to use words and not scream /hit because I know I scream at him and can be too rough when I'm angry (have never hit him but been very close). I hope this won't seem rude but I don't think your DH's response was especially helpful. By shouting and manhandling you he's just reinforcing the lesson that anger = loud physical reaction and that the strongest or most powerful person wins. Maybe I'm misreadin it, and don't get me wrong my partner and I both have times where we feel cross with the other for shouting at our son. But we try to be more subtle. For example if I shout when my DH can see it's just because I'm tired he might take DS away/distract him and maybe tell me to get a snack or drink and it reminds me I need to calm down. If I've been rough he might mention it later, but not in front of DS.

Again sorry if I've misread it, and well done for taking time for yourself.

Mine are the same age as yours op, and you are definitely not alone! I too really struggle with my temper when tired and my husband is much more patient and black and white about things. I recommend the website aha parenting; its a bit American but the advice is sound and fits with my philosophy.

Our early waking 3.6 year old has a gro clock which is intermittently successful. But dh does nearly all the early mornings so I'm very lucky I know.

For me, it's important to listen to my needs and make sure I do the little things - like go to sleep early when I get the chance, and eat well. If I'm in a bad mood the kids definitely feed off it and we quickly spiral downwards. Keeping them fed with food little and very often helps too. Sometimes it seems they're constantly eating!

Glad your John Lewis trip helped. Sign up to their loyalty card and you get free coffee and cake :)

How did your weekend go OP?

I really sympathise with all of you going through this. Mine are older now but I remember this stage well. The only way I coped was to have some part time help at home. Is that an option just temporarily? A local responsible teenager for eg?