Finding it so bloody hard...

[Bananice]

I have DS (2.3) and DD (almost 5mo). DS is a beautiful ball of energy, DD is laid back and a fairly "easy" baby.... But I'm finding bedtime to be an absolute shitstorm, usually culminating with DS, DD and me all in tears. I know it will get easier (when?!?) but at the moment I dread every evening...

DD is only catnapping at the mo, so has 4 naps with the last one finishing around 5:30. She is then due for bed some time between 6:30 and 7. But if I take her down to her room for 10 mins to calm her, I have to put the tv on to entertain DS, which hypes him up and results in him having a meltdown when it is time to put him to bed at 7. If I take him down with me, he chatters and sings and dances in DD's room, giving her no chance of calming and learning to self settle.

I then spend until about 8 yoyoing between their rooms trying to get them to go to sleep. It is shit and it is wearing me down. I also have PND, which doesn't help. DH any get home before 7:30 but DS won't have a bar of him at bedtime anyway and DD is EBF so it doesn't get much better.

Any tips/solace/ virtual gins you can send my way??

Oh jeez. That's awful. I hate bedtime. Could you get toddler asleep first and train baby to go later? I have no idea. I pass the buck to husband most nights as I am too fried.

Bananice, it will get better. Promise. I was on mumsnet when dc3 was a baby and I almost couldn't read posts about older children as it made me feel a mixture of jealously and the feeling I, personally, would never ever get to that stage.

I would try to cut out dd's last nap. I would also knacker ds out physically. If it is too nasty outside games of musical bumps, statues and chairs can be fun. Or something like What's the time Mr Wolf. Obviously you will not feel like doing this, but if you bite the bullet, it is worth it.

Sending you strength and a sense of humour.

Thanks Oddity and Rick. DD generally is a bit of a sleepy baby in that she can't stay awake long before wanting another nap. If I could get her to self settle at night (she does so beautifully at naps, but not bedtime) it would be easy but I haven't got the ability to help her learn to do this. Last night she couldn't self settle as she was overtired, tonight she couldn't as she didn't seem tired enough: smiling and chatting instead of feeding. This was with exactly the same naps/amount of sleep both days...

Rick, I am insanely jealous of those with older children right now!!

I have a similar gap between mine and found bedtime a nightmare too. I think I used to keep DS2 downstairs until DS1 was in bed and then attempt to get DS2 to sleep just afterwards. DS2 wasn't an easy baby though and I gave up even trying with a bedtime for him until he was about 7/8 months.

It's all a bit of a blur to be honest- it is much better now and has been since DS2 was about a year old. They're 2.8 and 15 months now and bedtime is a doddle (most of the time)!

Could you get your littlest to sleep in a sling so that you could put your oldest to bed with her on you and then transfer her into bed after...??

I so remember your pain. I had two DD 17 months apart and struggled. Its ridiculously hard isn't it, yet weirdly now the youngest is 2 and half i can't remember a great deal about it or how i coped, so it must of got better like, it will for you. I do know that i focused all my energy on keeping the routine consistent for the older one. I still find now that if i keep the big one on track the little one follows suit. It worked for me and actually my youngest is better for it, she's much more easy going.

Thinking back, i used to start the bedtime routine really early, like 5.15pm early, straight after dinner. I let my oldest play in the bath whilst me and the youngest watched. At some point i'd dip the youngest in, get dressed before i got the big one out, ready for milk and cbeebies bedtime story. Then i would put my oldest into bed, give them a book or soft toy and leave them to settle.

I really struggled to be in two places at once and often felt torn, then someone suggested introducing a second soother (both had dummies), a muslin cloth that smelt of me. It also meant when we ditched the dummies or they lost it in the night, they still had a comforter.

If i could tell myself anything from now i'd say lower my expectations and do whatever it is you can to get through it. I used to think i had been mad to have two so close together as it was back breaking but now just a little further down the line, i think it was inspired as they are best friends and playmates.

Christ I hate bedtime. I am in same boat as you. I used to put the baby to bed later and that was a bit easier but now with the nap situation I just can't make it work. The baby needs bed at 6.30. I do think it's a matter of training, getting the toddler used to playing on own. Mine is now used to being on his own in his room. However if I don't spend an hour putting the baby to bed she's up again an hour or so later but that's just how it has to be! I can't fecking wait until they are older.