Toilet Training Regression - anyone heard of this?

[Bouj]

I am at my wits end with ds1. Background: he trained well at about 2.3 ish. Was brilliant for about 4 months, then I fell pregnant. This initially wasn't a problem, but when I started to get too big to get down and play, it seemed to have an effect. We let this slide, tried positive reinforcement, 'treats' and sticker charts. Ignoring accidents, etc. Incidentally, he is fine with poos, its just wees. So now he is 3.5 and is no better. Yesterday each wee was done mostly in his pants, followed by him running to the loo to do the last little bit. I feel we have tried everything and then came across this .

Anyone familiar with it? Anyone had this much trouble training? I get so fed up with wet, smelly clothes I could cry. The part in the artcile about a power struggle rings true, ds1 is strong willed (entirely unsure where he gets this from )

Sorry for long winded-ness, but any advice/experience would be hugely appreciated.

I couldn't open the link but I think regression is very common when there are changes in the home or the child suroundings (new school, moving house, new baby arriving, etc.)

DS is 3.5 now and the problem we are having now is that he has got to the point were he can hold for a long time but many times he just leaves it almost too late.

Regression is quite common ofter an unheaval.

I think you have to go to back telling him every so often to use the toilet. He is getting a lot of attention from you when it happens, so I would just clear it up without a fuss so he knows that you are not going to react in a major way.

Couldn't open your link either.

Bah, am rubbish at links. Here is article.
www.contemporarypediatrics.com/contpeds/article/articleDetail.jsp?id=108026

As suggested in article I told him today that it was his body, and therefore his responsibility. Will not hassle him anymore and see how we go. Thanks for the advice, agree that he is getting a lot of attention about it - guess this is a case of bad attention is better than none?? God, that makes me feel really sorry for poor ds1!

""Ask the parents to stop all reminders to use the potty. Reminders and practice runs are what keep the power struggle going. Children older than 3 years never need reminders to help them become toilet trained. Make the child think that using the toilet is her idea"" Reading some of that it's easy to forget the age we are talking about is 3/4!

I am sorry but I don't agree with that at all. This way if the child get lost in playing (like me dd) they often are too busy to react to the senstaion of needing to use the toilet. At 3, I think that doing this and not trying to instill in your child the need to use the toilet will cause you to have far more cleaning up than you need to have!

True. I did think that - but I also think I am caught in a power struggle with ds1 (he and I are so alike, causes much amusement to my mother) that I think we need to break that before starting again, almost. Make any sense? I just feel that we are getting nowhere with what we are doing, so am willing to try other avenues.

Hi haven't read the article, but wanted to let you know I have just been through this with DD and thought we were never going to get back on track. Lots of people have told me it is really common especially when there is a change happening in their lives eg. new baby.

I ended up going back to basics and taking dd to the toilet every so often (1.5 - 2 hourly) and when she did do something we both clapped and cheered and ran about like looneys celebrating and I even asked her if she wanted to tell anyone about how clever she was (the more over the top the better). I also tried to ignore any accidents and just get on with cleaning up without any fuss. Eventually it has all clicked back into place and she now goes on her own again. It did seem to take forever and at time felt like it wasn't working but am so glad I stuck with it.

Hope this helps.

thanks humpydumpy - need to hear positive stories. He gets really... aresy, for want of a better word when asked, and will kick up a hell of a stink if we just try and take him. Even much carry on and rewards seem to make him uncomfortable (I swear he is a teenager in a 3 year old body sometimes). And all talk of rewards seem not to get anywhere. He is unbelievably stubborn (again, no idea where this came from, ahem). Unfortunately a morning of leaving him to it, has resulted in 5 changes of clothes.............

I do sympathise Bouj. Do you think saying something like, 'as we really haven't got the hang of using the toilet I think it's time to use nappies again'. And then start him back in nappies. I am thinking that having to go back to nappies might make him realise that he needs to use the toilet?

DD had bad bad table manners when we first moved to Oz and I went back to feeding her, she hated it, said it made her feel like a baby. It only took about 3-4 meals after that for her manners to improve!

Would you consider going back to pull ups for a while? It might take the pressure out of the situation for a while - and I'm all for the line of least resistance!

I haven't got to the stage with my DS, that you have reached with yours, so am talking with little direct experience.
We are more at the initial pottying stage, so I was thinking about how some of what we are doing might apply to your DS (again).
I was wondering if you could go back to the start and talk about it to him, perhaps buy some potty books or videos, just to generate a bit of interest again.
I used to read to DS when he was on his potty, I know it wouldn't be practical in the longer term, but it is a bit of nice attention and positive reinforcement.
Will he tell you why he is forgetting or not going? Maybe it is because of the baby, but if he thinks you know then it might help.
Could it be something other than the new baby, do you think, such as a medical condition, or some kind of fear?
Also have you told him how you feel, and how tired you are from cleaning, and how much it would help you if he would try to remember? That kind of thing? And I agree with the praise thing and making him feel good about having 'gone', letting him know how that has helped you, kind of thing and how you are happy with him.
Do you think he still wants to be the baby and doesn't want to grow up? I've read that can happen to older toddlers even without another sibling.
I'm really just throwing a few ideas about to see if any of them might be worth a try.

I am having horrible thoughts about how it might be to put a nappy on him, given that you have to carry him to the loo. Much kicking of legs sounds possible.
I hope you get it sorted out soon, you must be getting tired running about after those two babies.

Our ds 2.8 has regressed recently, he was fine for a couple of months (started training late June) and then went completely backwards, wetting himself all the time (four or five times a day) and never asking to go to the toilet. I think this was probably mine and dh's fault as we started to get irritated when he was having the odd accident. Reminding him to go doesn't work, he will say no and then just wet himself two minutes later. I've gone back to taking him every 2 1/2 to 3 hours and giving stickers. He was beginning to do poos in the potty but now that is all back in the pants We've had to basically go back a stage and start all over again, depressing but I guess it is just a case of taking it slowly. (I assume you've checked for urine infections) I tried going back to nappies but he threw a massive wobbler when I put one on him so that's not an option for us. HV also told us to give him some responsibility for his accidents by making him change himself (keep spare clothes in the loo so he knows where they are) Didn't work for us but your ds is older so might have an effect. Good luck, I know just how you are feeling.....

My DS is 2.11 and we have been training since June as well. He has been up and down. One weeks he's cracked it the next its all fallen apart. It always falls apart when he goes back to pre-school.

I have gotten so fed up with changing clothes etc but have been trying to stay calm when he has an accident and simply clean it up without comment. Then he had a huge accident on purpose!!!! and I couldn't hold my tongue. I threatened him that he would have to go back to nappies if he kept having accidents.

He was trying to go to the toilet this afternoon for a wee and it went all over the floor outside the toilet. He just didn't get there in time but had in fairness tried. He turned to me and said ' I am really sorry mummy. Please no nappies'! I am pleased that my message has sunk in but he still let the next wee soak its way into his trousers before going to the toilet!

Maybe I will have to carry out my threat tomorrow.

Call me a laid back old hippy if you want, but it seems to me that if a child can't do the loo thing, then they aren't ready and to save stress, anxiety and angst all round it's best not to try. Lots of children are ready at 2, lots aren't ready til 3 or even 4. What's the hurry? Changing nappies is a pain and expensive, but so is changing and washing clothes and shampooing carpets. My ds wasn't ready til he was nearly 4 - but went straight from nappies to pants with - if I remember correctly - three accidents. If you don't want to go back to nappies then use pull ups or trainer pants, but there are things worth fighting battles over and things not worth fighting battles over and this, IMHO is one of the latter.

thanks all, appreciate the advice. I have mentioned (threatened, if you will) going back to nappies, and he is truly horrified. Pullups might be an idea though I think he would not bother trying, to be honest. Since 'chatting' with him on monday about this, I have not suggested or mentioned going to the toilet. He is going, but after most of it going in his pants. I then tell him he has to take the wet ones to the wash, wash his hands and get dry ones on. This is happening, (albeit with grumbles) but I am hoping that it will get too boring/time consuming, and he will start getting there on time. He does seem to appreciate being left to his own devices. I do however have an appt with my fab and extremely thorough GP in two weeks, to rule out any physical probs, should we be no closer by then. I must admit with ds2 barely sleeping at night it makes my tolerance almost non-existent. In that way not mentioning it to him, and him being in charge of clean ups is taking the stress off me. Bah, its never easy, is it?