10 week old feeding/sleeping issue

[mermaid101]

My DS is ten weeks and ff. I'm having a few problems with him during the night. He goes to sleep for the night at about half six/seven. He can sleep until about twelve/one without waking. (I realise this is pretty good going). However, he usually wakes up any time from between half one and three and won't settle again. He will not take a feed. With persuasion he might take 50mls but doesn't seem at all interested.
We have tried waking him at ten for a dream feed. Again, he doesn't seem interested and still wakes in the early hours and won't go bsck to sleep.
What can I do? I'm finding pretty much staring the day at around 2am quite hard going as a have a toddler to look after.
I really don't think he is hungry. He takes his bottle first thing, but the thing that seems to stop him crying is just being up and about and playing.

Ideally he needs to start his night later so he does his 8 hours from 10 to 6. Can you try just an hour nap at 7 and a bit of awake time in the evening?

I could maybe try that. He's not great at napping during the day, so is very, very tired by tea time.
Could be a plan thouyg

Sorting out the daytime naps will probably massively help. Do whatever it takes, sling, car, buggy, whatever works best. If he is not overtired you will get into a much nicer routine.

Have you tried all if the usual like swaddling, white noise, sticking him in bed with you?

If the all fail I try moving his bedtime by 10 minutes a night until its later and hopefully he will wake later.

What gave you tried for his naps?

I wondered if it might be overtiredness. Would that account for the initial period of sleeping, then the wakefulness?
How long/how many naps should he have? He has roughly 200mls in his bottle about every four hours .

Tried white noise, rocking, a dummy, going for a walk where possible and just holding him. Some are more successful than others. Having a toddler around can often scupper some of these.
For a variety of reasons, sleeping in the bed with us won't work.

With the feeding he needs 2.5 floz for every pound in weight every 24 hours. So if he is 10lb he needs 25floz or 740 mls. Is he getting that?

Have you tried a sling in the day? My dc2 would snooze in hers while I was at playgroup with dc1 or doing things like cooking dinner.

Think they need roughly 15 hours sleep in 24. Mine always seemed to want a nap about an hour after waking. Some people suggest trying to get them to nap 1 hour after waking, then another nap 2 hours after waking, then 3 hours after waking but I don't think its based on fact, just an ideal to bear in mind.

Are you getting him outside in the day? Daylight can help. Have you got a partner that could take him out in the morning? It only has to be a few minutes. Try to get him outside at least twice a day. Know how hard it can be with sleep deprivation though. One thing that might help is putting a tshirt in his cot that either your or DH has worn. I've tried sleeping on their clean sheet for a night before using it on their bed. The scent of a parent seems to help

Have a read of 31 ways. It's very good.

He is getting outside everyday. I think he's about 11lbs, so it looks like is is getting enough milk based on your formula.

He is definitely not getting 15 hours of sleep a day. Probably about ten. He just doesn't seem to want to drop off. If I do get him to go for a nap in the day, he can wake up after about 20 mins.
At night, we try to use a dummy and rock his Moses basket to get him bsck to sleep. He might drop off for ten/twenty mins and then it starts again. I really don't want to get him up to start the day in the small hours. I think this would be a bad habit to get into, but is does seem to be what he wants to do.
I feel a bit desperate and depressed. It makes the days so long and tiring.

Can totally sympathise as my DS was a shocking sleeper. Could you and DH take the early mornings in turn?

We're sort of doing that just now, but if he's working then I try to go to bed really early and I do them.

Did this last a long time with you? Did you try anything that worked, even a bit?

Having added it up, I'm a bit worried about his lack of sleep. He's down about 5 hours of what he should be having. Will this sort itself out?
I could try to "crack" the naps by drafting in family help for a few days, but then we'll be on our own again. Would that make a difference and sort of settle him into a routine?

Have you thought about reflux? My los struggle with sleeping and being up and upright is often the only thing that helps. Refusal of milk when he's up in the middle of the night could be down to silent reflux. Go to gp and try some gaviscon. Also agree with changing bed time. Let him have a short nap at his normal bedtime then wake and play for a bit . Mine have a snooze about 6 ish which gives me time to do baths and bed for the others then I wake them up. Some nights it can take till 11ish for them to go to bed but then they sleep till 7 ish (if it's a good night). We're going the a whole range of reflux / allergy stuff at mo and some of it has helped.

I did think about reflux, but he's quite happy lying down even just after a feed, providing someone's playing with him.
I does make sense to try to keep him up so he sleeps later, but I'm worried that if I mess with this chunk of sleep ill lose it altogether.
Will he always be like this? I would expect him to be up a bit a night at this age, but I thought it would be because he was hungry. I'm a bit confused and worried about the no feeding and not settling back down.

Might just need to go for the later bed time. Would that mean he will be going to bed late for a long time?

If he's not crying I don't think it could be reflux, but then I'm no expert. My DS was crying all night and it turned out to be tongue tie.

Yes, I think getting some help could hopefully crack his naps. Would he sleep in the pram for someone while you had a nap at home?

Have you tried putting him to bed a few minutes later tonight?

The 15 hours is only a guide, so don't stress too much. Some will have more, some will have less

I didn't manage the earlier bed last night. He was complely beside himself. He went to sleep for about seven then woke at midnight but quickly went back to sleep when I rocked his Moses basket. But then he woke again at three. He was awake until about five, but as long as I was rocking him and he had his dummy he seemed quite happy. He got up at about half six.
Ill try the later bedtime tonight.
I'm not sure if I'm doing the right thing just rocking him in the dark, but I suppose if he's not crying then maybe he's ok? It has the advantage that he's not waking the rest of the house.
If I keep doing this, might he eventually fall back asleep quicker?

If I keep doing this, might he eventually fall back asleep quicker?. Not sure about that one but you can hope

Did you know that you can get an automatic cot rocker? Might help you get sone more sleep.

Jiltedt! Genius! That is exactly what I need. Who would have thought such a thing existed! Thank you!