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what am I doing wrong? (re: defiant 5yo)

20 replies

rhetorician · 12/06/2014 16:52

this is part of an overall pattern of ignoring us, not doing as she is asked etc, much of which I accept as par for the course. I just offered her a drink, asked what kind of straw she would like (had to ask twice). She said 'yellow'. I gave her yellow. She then decides she wants red. I say no. She gets enraged, stamps on her yellow straw, tries to get into the drawer, threatens to break the drawer etc. I still say no, tell her to calm down and drink her drink, but that she is not having the red one, especially after she destroyed the other one (yeah, I know, it's only a straw, but this kind of thing happens all the time, e.g. she thinks she can change an outcome by protesting, threatening etc). She then gets crosser and crosser - is crying and very upset by this point, throwing herself on the floor. Then spits in her sister's drink, and on the floor. I send her away to calm down (after shouting at her) as I know that there is no point escalating things when they get to this point.

She calms down, we all say sorry, we agree on the rules (which she knows perfectly well). Her punishment is that she is not allowed to play on the road later on.

But this happens (substitute some other trivial thing) over and over and she never seems to learn to manage her frustration/control her emotions. She is well behaved at school and doing fine, mostly plays nicely with her sister and friends (although hasn't made a friend as such yet). If she is good at school it must be something I am doing, or not doing, right?

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plantsitter · 12/06/2014 21:45

If she is good at school perhaps she expends all her effort on being good at school... DD1 was like this for a while. I tried to be very understanding and treat it as a 2 yr old tantrum (i.e. something that happened to her rather than something she was doing), without giving in to the thing she'd gone off on one about.

On the other hand, if she wanted a red straw couldn't she have gone and swapped it herself? That's what we do when people are being fussy about which cutlery or whatever they want. As long as it's them making the effort and not me it's not my problem. I have also sometimes explained that I can't possibly do what they want if they behave like that because behaving like that doesn't get you what you want. Sometimes being so explicit about it works (obviously before meltdown point when you can't say anything).

Good luck - it's exhausting but will probably just pass!

MERLIN666 · 12/06/2014 22:00

We too are experiencing this with my 6 year old, sometimes it feels if its a control battle, other times it seems she is agitated due to severe constipation, other times it seems she is mimicking her peers behaviour at school. I ask her to leave the room to calm down, and as she is so well behaved at school & really enjoys it i ask her if she ever sees any of her teachers behave as she has done or shout as she has done.
If you find the answer let me know lol

rhetorician · 12/06/2014 22:01

Thanks, good to know I am not alone!!

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MegBusset · 12/06/2014 22:11

I think it's fairly normal 5yo behaviour, DS2 is being a total horror atm (naturally his behaviour is impeccable at school/childminder). I think he is physically tired from nearly a year of school, which doesn't help.

I try to pick my battles, but stand me ground on those I have picked. It helps that I'm even more stubborn than he is Wink DS1 got better around 6yo iirc and is now (mostly) delightful.

rhetorician · 12/06/2014 22:18

It is end of school year, and light nights don't help, and this stuff does always happen at the end of the day, so tiredness absolutely a factor. I know the straw thing seems silly (it is, why should I care?), it was just that I'd specifically asked her which one she wanted, and given it to her, in order to avoid this...and once I had said no, I couldn't back down as she is always always pushing her luck. She told me that I was her very best mummy after this, and then that she hated me at bedtime! And then proceeded to beg me not to leave. I'm like a dish rag!!

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Cric · 13/06/2014 07:34

They get so tired from school.... It sounds like she is ready for the summer holidays!

flipchart · 13/06/2014 07:42

I would pick my battles to be honest. That way you have control over the thing that do matter while she feels like she does have a say in things as well. With the straw issue I would have just said, well get itthe red le yourself. That melt down could have been avoided easily. Hold your ground on the important stuff.

And keep saying to yourself 'this is just a phase'

flipchart · 13/06/2014 07:42

By the way, everything you said about her and her behaviour is perfectly normal!

rhetorician · 13/06/2014 10:20

yes, I kind of knew at the time that making a big thing over the straw was going to sound silly later on...

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rhetorician · 13/06/2014 10:21

flipchart I think the fact that I don't feel I have control over her is why this one just spiralled...

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flipchart · 13/06/2014 10:58

Don't worry, I have been caught up in similar battles when mine were younger ( still do sometimes). I can remember being enraged when Ds1 aged 4 refused to pick his coat up off the floor and it became a huge battle. DH walked in and was (hmm) and said ' whose the parent here' I was frightened I was going to end up with a spoilt out of control brat. My kid was probably knackered and had enough of everything and was at that arkward age so horns were locked. Looking back I really should have let it go.

Pick out what is important, eg good manners yes, colour of straws no!!

Please try to rise above it. Kids do push your buttons but save your energy for when they are teenager, you will wonder what all the fuss was about when they were little!

andream34 · 14/06/2014 21:40

Rhetorician, it doesn't matter whether your course of action with the straw should have been different, what matters is that you stuck to your guns once on that road and did not back down, which proves to her that you cannot be manipulated.

My DD was very similar at that age. You just have to be consistent, not back down, and if necessary escalate the amount of punishment (i.e. she is not allowed to go out and play for longer, cannot not watch TV for an increasing amount of time, etc), but at the same time when she does something good then make sure you praise her.

MERLIN666, just to mention, although constipation can be caused by poor diet, it can also be a symptom of underlying stress that your child could be suffering from.

3boys3dogshelp · 14/06/2014 21:54

She sounds so tired she doesn't know what to do with herself.
I agree with pps about picking your battles.
I would also do whatever you need to get to the end of term with as little upset as possible and she'll more than likely revert to her normal self.
When my ds was going through a horribly stroppy phase and I was thoroughly fed up of telling him off I tried to make a concious effort to spend more time just 'being' with him with nothing to cause confrontation (had lots of similar situations to your strawgate Grin. So sitting colouring with him, going up to bed earlier cuddling up in his bed for an extra bedtime story, sittingwith hhim to watch a dvd rather than leaving him to it. and i gave him less choices about trivial things which might be a bit controversial but i was trying to take the pressure off. Might be way off the mark but it worked for us.

rhetorician · 15/06/2014 16:20

Yes, I think she is wrecked, actually. And avoiding confrontation in the first place, where possible, certainly helps. Thanks all, really helpful and supportive suggestions

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DirtyDancing · 15/06/2014 20:59

Genuine question, but does she always need to have a choice about what straw she has, for example? I think sometimes making lots of decisions for children is tiring & it's good to remove some of the choices which aren't that important

rhetorician · 15/06/2014 21:29

Good question, but I offer her a choice precisely so that she doesn't go off on one!

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BadRoly · 15/06/2014 21:35

I have a similar sounding 5yo too and find I'm damned if I do, damned if I don't.

So with the straw example, if I just have him a straw without offering choice, it would be the wrong one and result in a meltdown. But if I have him the choice, what you described in the op would happen anyway!

The only reassurance I can offer you rhetorician is that's 12yo, 11yo and 7yo don't do it now but I'm fairly certain they did when they were 4/5!

Ilovemydogandmydoglovesme · 15/06/2014 22:01

My 5yo dd has cried and howled several times today. Usually at perfectly reasonable requests such as tidy your mess, get undressed, get in the bath, etc. perfectly normal things. I'm about ready to strangle her. Sad I completely sympathise. If you're a shit parent then I am too.

rhetorician · 15/06/2014 22:48

That's all reassuring in a shite kind of way! I am sure she is utterly normal, if a bit over dramatic!! But it is very wearing.

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Ilovemydogandmydoglovesme · 15/06/2014 23:52

It is very wearing. Usually I enjoy having the dc's at home but today I actually thought to myself, I can't say I've enjoyed being a parent today. I'm quite looking forward to them going to school tomorrow. Sad

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